Chelsea Sexton’s Volt EVSE Woes Don’t Bode Well for You & Me

[smkettner]

I am surprized for someone that does not use air conditioning the TOU would give 50% increase.
Seems like it should be close to revenue neutral and a person would save by adjusting habits.

Anyway I would not fully trust the analysis unless I did it myself. I would give it a go and see what really happens. Then get a separate meter for EV and go back to the normal schedule only if needed. Especially with the possibility of installing the very ugly conduit or busting out walls of other people.

I suppose Tier 1 is like having all power under the off-peak or super off-peak. So those of us that are closer to Tier 2 and Tier 3 would be neutral with TOU.
I wonder what the break even usage actually is with normal usage (whatever normal is)

 

[planet4ever]

I predict that after we've each gotten our own LEAF and driven it for a while most of us are going discover something about charging that will surprise many of us. We are going to discover that the fancy and expensive 240v EVSE that we sweated so much about is only being used for two, three, or maybe four hours a night.

Look, unless I'm mistaken, the average American car travels about 1000 miles per month. Until quick charge infrastructure gets built out across the country, the average EV will travel less than 1000 miles per month, because it will be less likely to be used for long trips. Early driving reports we are getting back are saying that the LEAF will get more than 4 miles/kWh in real driving situations, and that is consistent with Nissan's claim of 100 miles on less than 24kWh.

But let's be conservative, and say the average EV might be driven 1000 miles per month and might use 250kWh of electricity to do it. That's still less than 9kWh per day. Nine. Not twenty four. Even the 120v “trickle charge” can easily supply 9kWh in eight hours or less.

Sure, you don't drive exactly 1000/30.5 = 32.8 miles each day. But just think of the battery as supplying an average of 35 miles/day with a buffer of an extra 65 miles. Most nights you can leave it plugged in more than eight hours. Most nights you will need less than eight hours of 120v juice. Once in a while you may need to drive the car before it is fully charged. So what? Do you need a full tank of gas every morning when you leave home?

Now, what does all this have to do with the current thread, and why am I posting it here? Because I think "You & Me" and millions of other potential EV owners don't really have any "EVSE Woes", because most of us don't really need any garage infrastructure at all, except an ordinary 120v outlet.

Now, California, that's a special case. And indeed, as we have learned here, it is California's tiered electric rates, not the EVSE, that is the cause of Chelsea's woes. The blunt fact is that even 8 or 9 kWh/day will push most of us in the golden state into the next higher tier, unless we do something about it. Dual meters, TOU rates, special EV schedules, solar arrays ... there are a number of ways available to us to address the problem, and figuring out the best one is not easy. Some of us may just need to swallow hard and accept that the juice for our new beauty is going to cost 30c or even 40c per kWh. It's not the end of the world. Even at those rates the fuel costs for a LEAF will be comparable to the fuel costs for most “economy” cars running on gasoline.

 

[EVDRIVER]

I predict that after we've each gotten our own LEAF and driven it for a while most of us are going discover something about charging that will surprise many of us. We are going to discover that the fancy and expensive 240v EVSE that we sweated so much about is only being used for two, three, or maybe four hours a night.

Look, unless I'm mistaken, the average American car travels about 1000 miles per month. Until quick charge infrastructure gets built out across the country, the average EV will travel less than 1000 miles per month, because it will be less likely to be used for long trips. Early driving reports we are getting back are saying that the LEAF will get more than 4 miles/kWh in real driving situations, and that is consistent with Nissan's claim of 100 miles on less than 24kWh.

But let's be conservative, and say the average EV might be driven 1000 miles per month and might use 250kWh of electricity to do it. That's still less than 9kWh per day. Nine. Not twenty four. Even the 120v “trickle charge” can easily supply 9kWh in eight hours or less.

Sure, you don't drive exactly 1000/30.5 = 32.8 miles each day. But just think of the battery as supplying an average of 35 miles/day with a buffer of an extra 65 miles. Most nights you can leave it plugged in more than eight hours. Most nights you will need less than eight hours of 120v juice. Once in a while you may need to drive the car before it is fully charged. So what? Do you need a full tank of gas every morning when you leave home?

Now, what does all this have to do with the current thread, and why am I posting it here? Because I think "You & Me" and millions of other potential EV owners don't really have any "EVSE Woes", because most of us don't really need any garage infrastructure at all, except an ordinary 120v outlet.

Now, California, that's a special case. And indeed, as we have learned here, it is California's tiered electric rates, not the EVSE, that is the cause of Chelsea's woes. The blunt fact is that even 8 or 9 kWh/day will push most of us in the golden state into the next higher tier, unless we do something about it. Dual meters, TOU rates, special EV schedules, solar arrays ... there are a number of ways available to us to address the problem, and figuring out the best one is not easy. Some of us may just need to swallow hard and accept that the juice for our new beauty is going to cost 30c or even 40c per kWh. It's not the end of the world. Even at those rates the fuel costs for a LEAF will be comparable to the fuel costs for most “economy” cars running on gasoline.

I have driven about 80K EV miles between three EVs and from my experience people generally think they will charge one way with an EV and the reality does not match that thought. There will be many surprising moments for new EV owners related to efficiency, charging and other discoveries. What I can say from experience is that almost every EV driver I have met has the same relative reality moments and no mater what one reads online the real life experiences match must better than the press reviews. Remember, the Leaf goes from 0-60 in anywhere from 7 to 10 seconds, in the car world that's a mountain of difference. Insert a grain of salt until you actually drive the car for a bit


As we say, it's all about the pack!

 

[tps]

But let's be conservative, and say the average EV might be driven 1000 miles per month and might use 250kWh of electricity to do it. That's still less than 9kWh per day. Nine. Not twenty four. Even the 120v “trickle charge” can easily supply 9kWh in eight hours or less.

I've thought about this: Over the past few years I driven about 14K/yr, about 40m/day. This would require about 10kWh each day, maybe more depending on running the A/C in the summer or the heat in the winter. This is certainly entirely doable with the 1.4kW "trickle" charging cable. However, there might be an occasional event when I come home late and have to make a longer trip early the next morning, so I plan to install a 16A Leviton on a 20A 240V circuit here at home.

I would like to see a 6.6KW onboard charger, so that I can get charge quickly at public L2 charge points. (Maybe they'll offer this as an option by the time I get to order, since I'm in the "forgotten 36".) Given the size of the Philadelphia metro area, this might make occasional trips that push the car's round-trip range a bit easier to plan. Next year, the main public L2 charging points may be mostly limited to various Nissan dealers around town, rather than at my destination. It'd be great if all Nissan dealers got DC QC, as in Japan, but I don't see that happening until EVs take off on a much larger scale. Still, I'll probably spring for the QC port so I can take advantage of it when available.