Do I need a sub panel. Please help.

[mctom987]

This will give you a rough load calc:

http://www.nojolt.com/load_calculations.shtml" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

I better not try to permit anything, it says I need 300+ amps and I only have 200 amp service. :shock:

I'm not far from that…
Minimum Service Entrance Size = 268.27604166667 amps

It also gets a few things wrong.
1: I have a gas dryer. Apparently it's pulling 5000W from a 120V outlet it's sharing with the washer.
2: Small appliance branches do nothing switching from 2 to 20 (highlighting my earlier point about ignoring small loads)

 

[ElectricEddy]

Hello,

I have got an on site estimate from a licensed electrician in San Diego who will rearrange some breakers, install 50A breaker and run #4 wire 10 feet on the inside the garage wall behind the panel for $300. He asked me to send him a picture of my panel so he can prepare for this Friday installation. However, I got a phone call from him saying that I might need a 100A sub panel and the new total cost would be $700. I thought that some of my breakers can be rearranged using tandem breakers to make room for the 50A EVSE double pole breaker. Do I really need a sub panel? Thanks for your help.

https://drive.google.com/file/d/0B1J-Iedk5rMgT0RaUk1sX202RkU/edit?usp=sharing" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

I have not seen any comments about wire fill. From your picture I count 21 120V ckts, if wired with 2 wire ckts this would equal 22 wires 14 to 12 awg. 240V ckts count is 5 equaling 11 wires (spa neutral) 10 awg and up (not including the bonding conductors). This panel was originally designed for 20 1" wide breaker spots expandable to 40 with the narrow 1/2" DNPL type breakers. A better picture with the panel cover off would show true fill. I have found in the past that the wide BR type breakers do not heat up their overloads like the DNPLs do at higher loads. This might be a good candidate for a 100 Amp sub to relieve any overheating problems and provide for some future ckts ( hopefully there is a spare lug there large enough for a #3 AWG neutral-CEC Canada), a lower cost solution would be to juggle as mentioned above. I would have your certified electric contractor ( in good standing with the local insp dept. stop by for a free estimate). Opening the panel up before estimating over the phone or with a picture has always worked for me. Master Electrician 28 years.

 

[johnrhansen]

Some people over do it on the amount of circuits they put into a house. You might find one breaker only leads to one or 2 lightly loaded receptacles. You need to know what breakers go to what anyway. Why don't you do a survey of that and see if you can combine some circuits in a J box external to the panel so you can take some breakers out to make room for your evse breaker?

 

[aarond12]

I have a gas dryer. Apparently it's pulling 5000W from a 120V outlet it's sharing with the washer.

WOW! Are you sure that is a gas dryer and not an electric one? That's a tremendous amount of current for a gas dryer. A gas dryer should be below 500 watts typically. :shock:

 

[mctom987]

I have a gas dryer. Apparently it's pulling 5000W from a 120V outlet it's sharing with the washer.

WOW! Are you sure that is a gas dryer and not an electric one? That's a tremendous amount of current for a gas dryer. A gas dryer should be below 500 watts typically. :shock:

Yep.

Total # of clothes dryers

Volt-amp rating of clothes dryer (must be at least 5000)

 

[johnrhansen]

Typically you run a gas dryer and the washing machine on the same dedicated laundry outlet don't you? What do you do to calculate the draw for a gas dryer in a load calc? All the examples I remember were for electric dryers. Is it just the current draw per the nameplate of the dryer?

 

[smkettner]

I good builder will wire the laundry outlet as a dedicated split phase.

 

[johnrhansen]

I good builder will wire the laundry outlet as a dedicated split phase.

The breaker would be a 2 gang breaker then right?

 

[smkettner]

Yes two hot from a 240v breaker. Break the hot tab on the outlet to separate the duplex. Use common neutral. This gives each appliance a full 15 or 20 amp at 120v.

 

[johnrhansen]

Yes two hot from a 240v breaker. Break the hot tab on the outlet to separate the duplex. Use common neutral. This gives each appliance a full 15 or 20 amp at 120v.

I've done that before for the garbage disposal/dishwasher.

 

[GlennD]

Today a connected breaker is required. In 1976 my house was wired with all multi branch circuits including split washer-dryer and dishwasher-garbage disposal. None of the breakers are connected and are grandfathered that way.