DaveinOlyWA
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Re: Official Tesla Model 3 thread

Fri Oct 05, 2018 9:56 am

evnow wrote:
Joe6pack wrote:Can we stop pretending that even if Tesla shows a "profit" on paper that they are actually profitable. What profitable company has to have "volunteers" help deliver product because they haven't invested in the resources to actually get their product to market.

Well, if volunteers would help in delivery, every automaker will take it. As is they have to employ 30,000+ people and pay them a lot of money to deliver cars.

In 2010, Carlos Ghosn said they will make 150k EVs a year. That hasn't happened yet.

So, if you care about EVs, you should be very happy Tesla is actually selling some 300k EVs a year now.


LOL!!!

no, no they wouldn't. Since they can't, they don't. End of story.
2011 SL; 44,598 miles. 2013 S; 44,840 miles.2016 S30 deceased. 29,413 miles. 2018 S40; 11,987 miles, 485 GIDs, 37.6 kwh 110.89 Ahr , SOH 96.00, Hx 115.22
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Joe6pack
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Re: Official Tesla Model 3 thread

Fri Oct 05, 2018 11:29 am

DaveinOlyWA wrote:
evnow wrote:
Joe6pack wrote:Can we stop pretending that even if Tesla shows a "profit" on paper that they are actually profitable. What profitable company has to have "volunteers" help deliver product because they haven't invested in the resources to actually get their product to market.

Well, if volunteers would help in delivery, every automaker will take it. As is they have to employ 30,000+ people and pay them a lot of money to deliver cars.

In 2010, Carlos Ghosn said they will make 150k EVs a year. That hasn't happened yet.

So, if you care about EVs, you should be very happy Tesla is actually selling some 300k EVs a year now.


LOL!!!

no, no they wouldn't. Since they can't, they don't. End of story.


I would gladly volunteer to deliver cars for Porsche and I am pretty sure they would tell me to go to hell.
2012 Leaf SL leased October 4th, 2012
Braselton, GA

lorenfb
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Re: Official Tesla Model 3 thread

Fri Oct 05, 2018 1:47 pm

lorenfb wrote:nonot
GRA wrote:
lorenfb wrote:
Really? And how are you able conclude that? Are you aware that he owns about 40% of Tesla and because of that he'll have
a significant overall influence who is the new chairman/policies and who gets elected to the board, if it's changed at all.

Bottom Line: Elon Musk just lost the title of chairman, .1% of his wealth, and the shareholders lost less than .05% of their wealth.
Most likely more shareholder wealth will have been lost when the Q3 report arrives. Remember, Tesla gave away about $18K
of shareholder wealth with each vehicle sold in Q2. Obviously in Q3, given the M3 volume, it won't be as great, e.g. less than $1K - $2K
per vehicle sold.

Sure the fine was a small portion of his wealth (BTW, he owns about 20% of Tesla, not 40%) but the terms of the settlement included:

Musk will step down as Tesla’s Chairman and be replaced by an independent Chairman. Musk will be ineligible to be re-elected Chairman for three years;

Tesla will appoint a total of two new independent directors to its board;

Tesla will establish a new committee of independent directors and put in place additional controls and procedures to oversee Musk’s communications

I consider it unrealistic to expect the SEC to allow Elon to go on as before with just a slap on the wrist, so I fully expect them to monitor future corporate communications closely.


So it's you that feels it's unrealistic, right? Have you seen specific/enumerated SEC guidelines for Musk, other than what
you've stated? With regard to a new chairman, Musk still has significant influence over that decision and significant influence
over the new chairman's decisions. Besides, the SEC has no control over who the next chairman is. As still CEO, Musk has the all
authority to fully run Tesla based on his strategy and views. So what if Musk no longer communicates about financial decisions
and pro-forma data, he still can communicate, e.g. tweet, about basically everything else about Tesla. The SEC has no control over
what he tweets about his strategy/goals for Tesla as a CEO. Yes Musk has an ego, but it's doubtful that the SEC's ruling has affected
that much and will not significantly curb his modus operandi, i.e. he'll have plenty of wiggle room.


Well, so much for my previous view, i.e. now he's tweeting stupid comments about the SEC. The guy is a joke & HOPELESS!
We in SoCal had a few state facilities for guys like Musk, until they were closed down during the Reagan administration.

Musk sent the tweet referring to the "Shortseller Enrichment Commission" hours after the judge handling his settlement agreement with the SEC ordered both parties to explain why the court should approve it.


https://www.cnbc.com/2018/10/05/tesla-s ... itter.html
Leaf SL MY 9/13: 66K miles, 50 Ahrs, 5.2 miles/kWh (average), Hx=70, SOH=78, L2 charges to 100% > 1000, max battery temp < 95F (35C), min discharge point > 20 Ahrs

Oils4AsphaultOnly
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Re: Official Tesla Model 3 thread

Sat Oct 06, 2018 6:46 am

Wow, so much misinformation.

@ Joe6pack - Tesla owners aren't really helping deliver the cars, they're helping inform the new owners and engaging them while the staff is taking care of the actual delivery process: https://www.reddit.com/r/teslamotors/co ... eliveries/

If a porsche dealer ever got so busy that their staff was overwhelmed, and they were offered volunteer help, I think they wouldn't mind current owners engaging new owners while their staff gets their cars ready.

@ lorenfb - The $50k Tesla is taken sales away from more than BMW / Audi / MB. People are trading in their $25k+ vehicles (civic, accord, prius) for a $50k one: https://www.autoblog.com/2018/08/02/tes ... trade-ins/

For the high mileage drivers, it's simple math. With gas at $4/gal (and rising), after 5 years (18k miles per year), a $50k Tesla costs the same as a $30k accord.

As for Elon Musk's tweets. Yeah, those were inexcusable. But as a shareholder, given a choice between an erratic and brilliant CEO or a calm and rational one, I might have to flip a coin. There's no doubting the results of the company, and that's what an investment should be made on. Unless there's another company with a more sane CEO who also carries the mission to transition us to a sustainable energy future, I don't really have a choice on where to put my money.
:: Model 3 LR :: acquired 9 May '18
:: Leaf S30 :: build date: Sep '16 :: purchased: Nov '16
Date - Miles / GIDs:
May '17 - 7300 mi / 363
Feb '18 - 20.5k mi / 333

lorenfb
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Re: Official Tesla Model 3 thread

Sat Oct 06, 2018 10:02 am

Oils4AsphaultOnly wrote:If a porsche dealer ever got so busy that their staff was overwhelmed, and they were offered volunteer help, I think they wouldn't mind current owners engaging new owners while their staff gets their cars ready.


You're joking, right?

Oils4AsphaultOnly wrote:@ lorenfb - The $50k Tesla is taken sales away from more than BMW / Audi / MB. People are trading in their $25k+ vehicles (civic, accord, prius) for a $50k one: https://www.autoblog.com/2018/08/02/tes ... trade-ins/


So what! That's a very small percentage of Tesla's delivery backlog, i.e. trade-ins.

Oils4AsphaultOnly wrote:For the high mileage drivers, it's simple math. With gas at $4/gal (and rising), after 5 years (18k miles per year), a $50k Tesla costs the same as a $30k accord.


Really? That's why ICEV sales are down significantly versus a huge increase in BEV sales, right? NOT! The consumer ALWAYS makes a purchase
based on only operating cost, right? Hopefully, you're not involved in automotive strategic marketing!

Oils4AsphaultOnly wrote:As for Elon Musk's tweets. Yeah, those were inexcusable. But as a shareholder, given a choice between an erratic and brilliant CEO or a calm and rational one, I might have to flip a coin. There's no doubting the results of the company, and that's what an investment should be made on. Unless there's another company with a more sane CEO who also carries the mission to transition us to a sustainable energy future, I don't really have a choice on where to put my money.


So you bought Tesla yesterday on the big down move, right? Elon Musk, another Steve Jobs or really a mental case of John Sculley?
Last edited by lorenfb on Sat Oct 06, 2018 10:10 am, edited 3 times in total.
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SageBrush
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Re: Official Tesla Model 3 thread

Sat Oct 06, 2018 10:03 am

Tesla should be settling into a rate of 30,000 sales a month through the end of the year.
Nice job; I look forward to double that by 2020.
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-----
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lorenfb
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Re: Official Tesla Model 3 thread

Sat Oct 06, 2018 10:11 am

SageBrush wrote:Tesla should be settling into a rate of 30,000 sales a month through the end of the year.
Nice job; I look forward to double that by 2020.


And that new production is located where?

I'm surprised you haven't answered the question. You usually respond. Could be that there's NO possible way that Tesla can increase
the production capacity needed to achieve that level by year end?
Last edited by lorenfb on Sat Oct 06, 2018 8:34 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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SageBrush
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Re: Official Tesla Model 3 thread

Sat Oct 06, 2018 10:13 am

Oils4AsphaultOnly wrote:For the high mileage drivers, it's simple math. With gas at $4/gal (and rising), after 5 years (18k miles per year), a $50k Tesla costs the same as a $30k accord.

Exactly. Or better.

Non-hybrid ICE drivers pay 10 - 15 cents a mile. EV drivers with PV can pay as little as 0.5 cents a mile (like me.)
A Tesla will last a *long* time, making the money argument very persuasive even before considering the fantastic merits of the car itself.

For me, the arithmetic worked out this way:
51k Tesla before TTL
(10k) old car value
(14.4k) value of a 6 year newer car (based on $200 a month)
(10k) Tax Credits
(10k) Fuel savings over 200k miles @ 5 cents a mile (hybrid Vs EV fueled by my PV.)
-----
$6.6k upgrade cost

Trades are almost always less advantageous than replacing an end-of-life car. Anyone buying a new ICE today should review their arithmetic.
Last edited by SageBrush on Sat Oct 06, 2018 10:43 am, edited 1 time in total.
2013 LEAF 'S' Model with QC & rear-view camera
Bought off-lease Jan 2017 from N. California
Car is now enjoying an easy life in Colorado
3/2018: 58 Ahr, 28k miles
-----
2018 Tesla Model 3 LR, Delivered 6/2018

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EVDRIVER
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Re: Official Tesla Model 3 thread

Sat Oct 06, 2018 10:36 am

lorenfb wrote:
SageBrush wrote:Tesla should be settling into a rate of 30,000 sales a month through the end of the year.
Nice job; I look forward to double that by 2020.


And that new production is located where?



It will never work until it does but you seem to be proven wrong repeatedly. All of your predictions have been wrong and your technical speculation about the car has also be wrong repeatedly. I suppose you still have yet drive one ever, or is that "confidential"?

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lpickup
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Re: Official Tesla Model 3 thread

Sat Oct 06, 2018 11:29 am

lorenfb wrote:
Oils4AsphaultOnly wrote:@ lorenfb - The $50k Tesla is taken sales away from more than BMW / Audi / MB. People are trading in their $25k+ vehicles (civic, accord, prius) for a $50k one: https://www.autoblog.com/2018/08/02/tes ... trade-ins/


So what! That's a very small percentage of Tesla's delivery backlog, i.e. trade-ins.


It's an indication of what is happening across the board Loren...or are you claiming that 100% of the people whose former vehicles were Civics, Accord and Priuses chose to trade in to Tesla and none of them decided to sell privately?
...Lance

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