SageBrush
Posts: 2602
Joined: Sun Mar 06, 2011 2:28 am
Delivery Date: 13 Feb 2017
Location: Colorado

Re: Chevrolet Bolt - 60 kWh, 238 mi, < 7s 0-60

Fri Jun 01, 2018 7:44 am

DaveinOlyWA wrote:
SageBrush wrote:Tesla, on the other hand ? No problem driving anywhere.


So your counter to my "EV with QC a must" is an EV with QC?

If it is a Tesla. Other EVs, like my LEAF, do not benefit from a QC port in my large regional area of the United States
2013 LEAF 'S' Model with QC & rear-view camera
Bought off-lease Jan 2017 from N. California
Car is now enjoying an easy life in Colorado
3/2018: 58 Ahr, 28k miles
-----
2018 Tesla Model 3 LR, Delivered 6/2018

GetOffYourGas
Posts: 1849
Joined: Tue Dec 20, 2011 6:56 pm
Delivery Date: 09 Mar 2012
Location: Syracuse, NY

Re: Chevrolet Bolt - 60 kWh, 238 mi, < 7s 0-60

Mon Jun 04, 2018 7:56 am

SageBrush wrote:
DaveinOlyWA wrote:
SageBrush wrote:Tesla, on the other hand ? No problem driving anywhere.


So your counter to my "EV with QC a must" is an EV with QC?

If it is a Tesla. Other EVs, like my LEAF, do not benefit from a QC port in my large regional area of the United States


Exactly. Or at least has Tesla-like range. My 2012 Leaf didn't have a QC port. Even if it had the range of a 2018 (150 miles), a QC port would be useless to me. But with a range well over 200 miles, my Bolt suddenly has some QC available. And even that's only because I'm about 200 miles outside of a heavily travelled / well QC'd corridor (the Northeast Corridor). In many parts of the country, even 238 miles isn't enough to make meaningful use of a QC port.
~Brian

EV Fleet:
2011 Torqeedo Travel 1003 electric outboard on a 22' sailboat
2012 Leaf SV (traded for Bolt)
2015 C-Max Energi (302A package)
2017 Bolt Premier

SageBrush
Posts: 2602
Joined: Sun Mar 06, 2011 2:28 am
Delivery Date: 13 Feb 2017
Location: Colorado

Re: Chevrolet Bolt - 60 kWh, 238 mi, < 7s 0-60

Mon Jun 04, 2018 12:24 pm

Dave's reply made me think he is unaware that Tesla has its own network, one that is VASTLY more useful and available to their car owners than ChadeMo is, particularly outside of the coasts.

This is ChadeMo for Middle America. The few stations available are concentrated in cities that are too far apart to allow long distance driving, even if one ignores their lousy placement and long charge times. As a practical matter, ChadeMo (and CCS) are no where near a solution for flyover country, even for dedicated EV early adopters.

Image

And here is CCS. As an internal ruler, the blue to Albuquerque is 250 miles

Image
2013 LEAF 'S' Model with QC & rear-view camera
Bought off-lease Jan 2017 from N. California
Car is now enjoying an easy life in Colorado
3/2018: 58 Ahr, 28k miles
-----
2018 Tesla Model 3 LR, Delivered 6/2018

GetOffYourGas
Posts: 1849
Joined: Tue Dec 20, 2011 6:56 pm
Delivery Date: 09 Mar 2012
Location: Syracuse, NY

Re: Chevrolet Bolt - 60 kWh, 238 mi, < 7s 0-60

Mon Jun 04, 2018 1:04 pm

Interesting. Honestly, these maps are more than I dreamed we'd have even just a few years ago. And yet it's nowhere near what we need. It will take a long time to really fill in, especially in "flyover country". We really do need cars with longer range than 150 miles in order to bridge the gaps, and that will be so for another half a decade at least.
~Brian

EV Fleet:
2011 Torqeedo Travel 1003 electric outboard on a 22' sailboat
2012 Leaf SV (traded for Bolt)
2015 C-Max Energi (302A package)
2017 Bolt Premier

Zythryn
Posts: 1037
Joined: Fri Jun 04, 2010 4:49 am

Re: Chevrolet Bolt - 60 kWh, 238 mi, < 7s 0-60

Mon Jun 04, 2018 1:55 pm

GetOffYourGas wrote:Interesting. Honestly, these maps are more than I dreamed we'd have even just a few years ago. And yet it's nowhere near what we need. It will take a long time to really fill in, especially in "flyover country". We really do need cars with longer range than 150 miles in order to bridge the gaps, and that will be so for another half a decade at least.


Other than the ones that already exist ;)
Previous owner of Prius, Volt, Leaf & Model S
Current owner of Model 3
http://www.netzeromn.com

GRA
Posts: 8906
Joined: Mon Sep 19, 2011 1:49 pm
Location: East side of San Francisco Bay

Re: Chevrolet Bolt - 60 kWh, 238 mi, < 7s 0-60

Mon Jun 04, 2018 6:11 pm

OTOH, for non-Tesla owners 2019 should see a huge improvement: https://electrek.co/2018/05/03/electrify-america-map-charging-stations-network/

They plan to have the first X-C route (probably I-80/76/70/15) done by the end of 2019. At least in California they're using Black and Veatch, the same supervising contractor as Tesla.
Guy [I have lots of experience designing/selling off-grid AE systems, some using EVs but don't own one. Local trips are by foot, bike and/or rapid transit].

The 'best' is the enemy of 'good enough'. Copper shot, not Silver bullets.

GetOffYourGas
Posts: 1849
Joined: Tue Dec 20, 2011 6:56 pm
Delivery Date: 09 Mar 2012
Location: Syracuse, NY

Re: Chevrolet Bolt - 60 kWh, 238 mi, < 7s 0-60

Tue Jun 05, 2018 4:14 am

Zythryn wrote:
GetOffYourGas wrote:Interesting. Honestly, these maps are more than I dreamed we'd have even just a few years ago. And yet it's nowhere near what we need. It will take a long time to really fill in, especially in "flyover country". We really do need cars with longer range than 150 miles in order to bridge the gaps, and that will be so for another half a decade at least.


Other than the ones that already exist ;)


Exactly. My point was more that even the 2018 Leaf still doesn't have enough range for a solid US offering. It's still a commuter / errands type of car. The difference between 150 miles (Leaf) and 240 miles (Bolt) is huge in many parts of the country. It often can mean the difference between a usable QC network or not. And that will remain the case for years to come.
~Brian

EV Fleet:
2011 Torqeedo Travel 1003 electric outboard on a 22' sailboat
2012 Leaf SV (traded for Bolt)
2015 C-Max Energi (302A package)
2017 Bolt Premier

User avatar
paulgipe
Gold Member
Posts: 205
Joined: Sat Aug 02, 2014 4:23 pm
Delivery Date: 20 Oct 2014
Leaf Number: 311200
Location: Bakersfield, CA 93305
Contact: Website

Re: Chevrolet Bolt - 60 kWh, 238 mi, < 7s 0-60

Tue Jun 05, 2018 9:26 am

GetOffYourGas wrote:
Zythryn wrote:
GetOffYourGas wrote:Interesting. Honestly, these maps are more than I dreamed we'd have even just a few years ago. And yet it's nowhere near what we need. It will take a long time to really fill in, especially in "flyover country". We really do need cars with longer range than 150 miles in order to bridge the gaps, and that will be so for another half a decade at least.


Other than the ones that already exist ;)


Exactly. My point was more that even the 2018 Leaf still doesn't have enough range for a solid US offering. It's still a commuter / errands type of car. The difference between 150 miles (Leaf) and 240 miles (Bolt) is huge in many parts of the country. It often can mean the difference between a usable QC network or not. And that will remain the case for years to come.


Agreed. That's true even for here in California. Saturday we did a 186 mile loop in our Bolt and returned with 20 kWh remaining. We wouldn't have been able to do it with the 18 Leaf without range anxiety. It turns out that there's a Level 2 30 miles west of Bakersfield. We stopped to just to make sure it was working. It was. With the Leaf you would have had to stop for at last an hour or more. As it was we just drove home. There was nothing--and I mean nothing on the other 150 miles--not even a 14-50.

Paul
Bakersfield, California
2017 Bolt LT with DCFC, leased 11/09/17
2015 Nissan S with QC, leased, returned
2013 Chevy Volt Premium, used 10/3/16, sold
L2; ClipperCreek HCS-40; Jesla; JDapter Stub
http://www.wind-works.org

edatoakrun
Posts: 5221
Joined: Thu Nov 11, 2010 9:33 am
Delivery Date: 15 May 2011
Leaf Number: 2184
Location: Shasta County, North California

Re: Chevrolet Bolt - 60 kWh, 238 mi, < 7s 0-60

Tue Jun 05, 2018 12:02 pm

Some may recall the long discussion (on this thread, I believe) of how long it would take an Ioniq (with higher efficiency and slightly higher kW initial charge rate) to overtake a Bolt (equipped with ~twice the battery capacity) while on a long trip with multiple DC recharges.

Part one, below, does not give the final answer, but I expect part two will be posted shortly, on Bjorn's channel.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yH3RqJRhNEE
no condition is permanent

DaveinOlyWA
Posts: 13085
Joined: Sat Apr 24, 2010 7:43 pm
Delivery Date: 16 Feb 2018
Leaf Number: 314199
Location: Olympia, WA
Contact: Website

Re: Chevrolet Bolt - 60 kWh, 238 mi, < 7s 0-60

Thu Jun 07, 2018 11:05 am

GetOffYourGas wrote:Interesting. Honestly, these maps are more than I dreamed we'd have even just a few years ago. And yet it's nowhere near what we need. It will take a long time to really fill in, especially in "flyover country". We really do need cars with longer range than 150 miles in order to bridge the gaps, and that will be so for another half a decade at least.


Well we now have 5 new stations open (maybe 4?) with new ones coming online nearly every week for the next two years and that is just the beginning. So a "must be 250" mile EV is a limited time need. Yeah the buildout on the fringes has been pathetically slow and without VW's missteps we probably would still be wondering what to do.
2011 SL; 44,598 miles. 2013 S; 44,840 miles.2016 S30 deceased. 29,413 miles. 2018 S40; 8743 miles, 485 GIDs, 37.6 kwh 111.39 Ahr , SOH 96.49, Hx 114.98
My Blog; http://daveinolywa.blogspot.com" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

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