GRA
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Re: Gen 2 GM Volt Plug-in Hybrid (2016+) MSRP $33,995

Sat Oct 24, 2015 3:04 pm

Firetruck41 wrote:<snip>
In fact, if the Volt had 5 seats I might have bought one instead. I am glad I bought the Leaf, but a Volt or Energi may still be in my future as our "other" daily driver.

If you're considering one of the Energis, then the Sonata's another 5-seat PHEV: http://insideevs.com/wp-content/uploads ... terior.jpg

More trunk space than the Fusion Energi, I think: http://www.theautochannel.com/news/2015 ... t.5-lg.jpg

and 27 vice 19 miles AER.
Guy [I have lots of experience designing/selling off-grid AE systems, some using EVs but don't own one. Local trips are by foot, bike and/or rapid transit].

The 'best' is the enemy of 'good enough'. Copper shot, not Silver bullets.

scottf200
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Re: Gen 2 GM Volt Plug-in Hybrid (2016+) MSRP $33,995

Sat Oct 24, 2015 9:08 pm

GRA wrote:
scottf200 wrote:<snip>
Gen 1 & 2 are unique in all PHEVs and hence EREV since it uses the battery to drive the car until it drains. Even on hard throttle or up to 101 MPH speed limit. (exception is cold winter days to warm the battery and cabin more efficiently for a few minutes).

Not unique anymore, unless the i3REx comes on under max accel while there's still sufficient charge.
The motor cycle engine is sized to limp home ... different usage ... avoid be stranded!!!

Compare that to my Volt drive through the hills in NC and TN in the past couple weeks going with flow of traffic up hill at 65-70 MPH!
Last edited by scottf200 on Mon Oct 26, 2015 7:50 am, edited 1 time in total.
100K EV miles and 80% EV usage - Sorry :(PEC
Volt = 53+ mile BEV up to 100 MPH, then 40 MPG hybrid with a 9 gal gas tank
Tesla Model X P90DL - Sig:603 | 2011 Volt to kid | 2016 for wife | 2012 other kid

GRA
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Re: Gen 2 GM Volt Plug-in Hybrid (2016+) MSRP $33,995

Sun Oct 25, 2015 3:48 pm

scottf200 wrote:
GRA wrote:
scottf200 wrote:<snip>
Gen 1 & 2 are unique in all PHEVs and hence EREV since it uses the battery to drive the car until it drains. Even on hard throttle or up to 101 MPH speed limit. (exception is cold winter days to warm the battery and cabin more efficiently for a few minutes).

Not unique anymore, unless the i3REx comes on under max accel while there's still sufficient charge.
The motor cycle engine is sized to limp home ... different usage ... avoid be stranded!!!

Compare that to my Volt drive through the hills in NC and TN in the past couple weeks going with flow of traffic up hill at 65-70 MPH!

If the REx has hold mode enabled, it provides the same basic utility as the Volt (if much shorter total range), and as has been reported here and elsewhere, it can maintain 70 mph or so on the REx as long as you're on flat ground:
BMW i3 REx Top Speed With Depleted Battery – Video
http://insideevs.com/bmw-i3-rex-top-spe ... ery-video/

As long as you've used hold mode before a big climb you can (probably) make it up any grade in the U.S. without fully draining the battery. Not that I think the i3 REx is as good value for money as the Volt; IMO it's still vastly overpriced for what you get, and AFAIC there's no contest as to which one I'd choose, as the Volt provides more general utility. Boosting the % of usable capacity the i3 can retain in Hold mode from 75% to 100% like the Volt, and increasing the size of the gas tank so you can drive at least two hours at freeway speeds on the REx would make the capabilities more even, but not enough to overcome an $11k price differential.

One thing that's interesting is that the i3's Hold mode only retains 75% of the battery's usable capacity, which means that i3's AER at the start of a climb after using Hold mode is almost exactly the same as the Volt 2.0's: 54 versus 53 miles. Which one can go further on the climb would depend on the speed of the climb, as I imagine the Volt has better CdA that at higher speeds would overcome the i3 REx's ca. 650 lb. weight advantage. We won't know until some Volt 2.0 owners start doing test runs, but for now I'd assume that the Volt would be the vehicle of choice on I-80 up to Donner summit or I-70 over Vail Pass, and the i3 REx would be superior driving up to the summit of Mt. Evans or over Tioga Pass.
Guy [I have lots of experience designing/selling off-grid AE systems, some using EVs but don't own one. Local trips are by foot, bike and/or rapid transit].

The 'best' is the enemy of 'good enough'. Copper shot, not Silver bullets.

EatsShootsandLeafs
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Re: Gen 2 GM Volt Plug-in Hybrid (2016+) MSRP $33,995

Fri Nov 13, 2015 2:30 pm

Going in to test drive one of these tomorrow morning.

On the fence mainly because I think GM wants a lot of money over the 2015 volt (which they are giving away at a REALLY, REALLY nice price, like $230/month lease out the door with no money on the table--or less). Thing is the 2015's 4 seats are a complete deal killer for me, even if the 2016's fifth seat is only usable by a toddler.

As I mentioned in the past, I dropped my Leaf almost two years ago because its winter range was just atrocious, but I always liked the EV drivetrain. I'm currently driving a new Altima, but I get bored easily and it is so darn banal.

Unfortunately for compelling myself on these, gas is SO CHEAP right now that running an electric vehicle is barely any cheaper at all actually.

pkulak
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Re: Gen 2 GM Volt Plug-in Hybrid (2016+) MSRP $33,995

Fri Nov 13, 2015 2:41 pm

EatsShootsandLeafs wrote:running an electric vehicle is barely any cheaper at all actually.


That is true. However, it's still nice to have a dual powertrane. If you don't care at all about environmental stuff, at least you have the peace of mind of knowing that you can plug in at any point if gas starts to get too pricey. Plus, running electric keeps maintenance costs very low. I'd probably plug in just to avoid the oil changes, even if it saved me no money at all.

EatsShootsandLeafs
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Re: Gen 2 GM Volt Plug-in Hybrid (2016+) MSRP $33,995

Fri Nov 13, 2015 2:52 pm

pkulak wrote:
EatsShootsandLeafs wrote:running an electric vehicle is barely any cheaper at all actually.


That is true. However, it's still nice to have a dual powertrane. If you don't care at all about environmental stuff, at least you have the peace of mind of knowing that you can plug in at any point if gas starts to get too pricey. Plus, running electric keeps maintenance costs very low. I'd probably plug in just to avoid the oil changes, even if it saved me no money at all.
Well I still assume we're in a bit of a price trough so it is a good time to buy an efficient vehicle because demand is low, but I cannot pay what I was briefly quoted today.

So back to earlier. Locally--in NY state--I can go to a dealership right now and get a new 2015 Volt with 10k/year for $230/month with $0 out of pocket of any sort. However, the quote on a 2016 volt with 12k/year was $396, but that was not a base volt (base I think shave maybe $50 off that), plus GM charges a lot on extra miles ($.25 on overage). One other thing is I Just got the "chevrolet private offer" coupon, so that is supposed to buy me $1000 after all other negotiations, which is good for around $25-30/month on a Leaf.

I am running 15k/year right now with all the driving I do. I can't pretend getting rid of my altima will save me any money at all, even if price goes up to $3.50, and I don't care much about environmental, but I'm starting to hate driving such a common car :)

Too bad the volt looks like the cruze now, but chevy seems to have built a good vehicle. Its EV is almost as efficient as the leaf, it's slightly quicker, slightly smaller, but completely invalidates range anxiety. Driving 15k/year as I do, in winter climate, makes the Leaf simply untenable. I know range is up 25% since I owned a 2012, but when I dumped it I said 50% extra is minimum before I go back to EV-only.

My guess is I won't get a Volt right now just because I think I'm too upside down on the lease and probably have to finish my Altima lease up or close because I refuse to be hosed on it.

EatsShootsandLeafs
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Re: Gen 2 GM Volt Plug-in Hybrid (2016+) MSRP $33,995

Sat Nov 14, 2015 4:30 am

OH wow I Just learned that none of the Volt models have power seats. GM pretends this is to save weight. I'd rather lose the immeasurable loss in efficiency. Not having power seats on a $30k+ car in 2015 is a shame. Turns out the Leaf still doesn't have them, either? Baffling decisions on bother companies' parts IMO.

2016 volt also has no cd player! Heck, even I still listen to discs from time to time. That is just very weird. Definitely going to check out a hybrid avalon today as well when at the dealership (it sells toyota also).

I'd think about holding out for the new Prius, but they are too darn slow. I had a 2010 for over 40k miles and I won't return to a vehicle that slow off the line. My Leaf was a killer in traffic with its aggressive 0-30. I still miss that.

EDIT: Took a 2016 out for a drive. Drives similarly to the leaf I'd say though with less let off at higher speeds in terms of acceleration, due to the better horsepower.

Trunk is pretty decent. Rear seats are not great, I'd say an adult should be 5,10" or less to fit in the back without hitting heads, but okay for kids.

DaveinOlyWA
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Re: Gen 2 GM Volt Plug-in Hybrid (2016+) MSRP $33,995

Sat Nov 14, 2015 9:12 am

power seats? ya, they are ok for company cars when several people drive them but my LEAF? one that only 2 people have driven besides me in 23 months? why do I need power seats again?? They are nice but and I would love them for my LEAF and I am willing to pay an extra...uh... hmmm.. ok, never mind. I guess I wouldn't be willing to pay extra for that.
2011 SL; 44,598 miles. 2013 S; 44,840 miles. 2016 S30; 13001 miles. 363 GIDs, Ahr 82.34, Hx; 102ish% kwh 28.1 QCs 112
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pkulak
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Re: Gen 2 GM Volt Plug-in Hybrid (2016+) MSRP $33,995

Sat Nov 14, 2015 9:44 am

Yeah, the Volt doesn't have power seats, auto cruise, lane keep, etc. Android auto is a huge win, but apart from that there's no cool tech available except in the powertrane. It's a real shame.

My next car needs to at least have auto cruise.

GRA
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Re: Gen 2 GM Volt Plug-in Hybrid (2016+) MSRP $33,995

Sun Nov 15, 2015 5:34 pm

pkulak wrote:Yeah, the Volt doesn't have power seats, auto cruise, lane keep, etc. Android auto is a huge win, but apart from that there's no cool tech available except in the powertrane. It's a real shame.

My next car needs to at least have auto cruise.

Via GCR:
2016 Chevrolet Volt: Owner's First Impressions Of Car, Range, Dealers, And More
http://www.greencarreports.com/news/110 ... s-and-more

He's happy with the advanced features (side and rear blindspot warning) it does have. I agree that ACC is becoming almost a 'must have' feature, and auto-braking too. Lane-keeping, I'm not so sure yet, given the problems that have been reported in some versions.
Guy [I have lots of experience designing/selling off-grid AE systems, some using EVs but don't own one. Local trips are by foot, bike and/or rapid transit].

The 'best' is the enemy of 'good enough'. Copper shot, not Silver bullets.

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