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jlv
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Re: TSLA corporate outlook

Wed Aug 08, 2018 9:26 am

An interesting comparison. I'd forgotten about the squeeze play Porsche did when attempting to take over VW.
Taking Tesla private and having the shorts pay for it
Last edited by jlv on Wed Aug 08, 2018 10:15 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Joe6pack
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Re: TSLA corporate outlook

Wed Aug 08, 2018 9:49 am

Don't know what you're smoking, but Porsche failed to buy VW, the whole deal backfired and VW wound up taking over Porsche.

https://www.theguardian.com/business/2012/jul/05/volkswagen-buys-porsche

If you really want to know what it takes to take a public company private, go read Barbarians at the Gate. It's the story of how RJR Nabisco was taken private in a leveraged buyout in the 80's.
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jlv
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Re: TSLA corporate outlook

Wed Aug 08, 2018 10:16 am

Not smoking anything. I did fix my slightly misworded text. Still an interesting possibility.
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Joe6pack
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Re: TSLA corporate outlook

Wed Aug 08, 2018 11:53 am

I was probably a little harsh. My apologies. It's just that the way this thing is being handled is pretty bush league. I mean, unless the ink is dry on some sort of financing instrument this deal is very much in doubt. Usually when a company is taken private like this it's because it is generating more cash than the value of the stock. Therefore, it is attractive from a financing standpoint and can make debt service. RJR was making tons of money and generating a lot of cash. The problem was that investors were focusing on the cigarette business and undervaluing the rest of the company. This was back when there was talk of the FDA regulating nicotine as a drug and perhaps even outlawing tobacco. Also, there was a lot of public pressure not to support smoking which large institutional investors and insurance companies bowed to.

In Tesla's case, I really don't see it. Sure they have some desirable products, but substitutes are available. They are burning, not generating cash and have a ton of debt already. The biggest asset they probably have is the brand, but that isn't worth anywhere close to $72 billion.

The book I mentioned in my previous post is a really good read and I doubt much has changed since then. I plan to go home and dust off my copy tonight. They made it into a movie starring James Garner I think, but it wasn't very good. The book is much better.
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goldbrick
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Re: TSLA corporate outlook

Wed Aug 08, 2018 1:40 pm

Personally I hope the deal goes through. I have no financial interest in TSLA at all but I think the discourse around here would be much improved if the topics were relevant to Tesla's cars and technology and not the price/value of TSLA the stock.

GRA
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Re: TSLA corporate outlook

Wed Aug 08, 2018 7:04 pm

jlv wrote:
LTLFTcomposite wrote:A conspiracy theorist might conclude that folks with lots of oil to sell want to slow down the adoption of EVs
From what I've read, the SWF investments are primarily non-fossil fuel related. Looks like they are wisely diversifying.

Yup:
Tesla Marks the Latest High-Profile Bet for Saudi Wealth Fund
https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2018-08-08/tesla-marks-the-latest-high-profile-bet-for-saudi-wealth-fund
Guy [I have lots of experience designing/selling off-grid AE systems, some using EVs but don't own one. Local trips are by foot, bike and/or rapid transit].

The 'best' is the enemy of 'good enough'. Copper shot, not Silver bullets.

goldbrick
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Re: TSLA corporate outlook

Thu Aug 09, 2018 9:14 am

Not to mention that since Saudi Arabia has the most control over the price of oil due to their ability to increase output for next to nothing, anytime they want, it is interesting to watch how they have kept the price at the level required to maximize their over-all income.

Too low and they don't make enough money, too high and the world accelerates its shift away from oil to other forms of energy. Of course the fracking 'revolution' in the US and potentially elsewhere was a bump in the road and many petrol states have governments that behave like spoiled children but I do believe the Saudi's are trying to manage the oil price to 'keep the addict coming back'. I don't know if that makes me a conspiracy theorist or if that's just how any rational business person would act but I find it interesting. So the fact that they are diversifying their enormous wealth is to be expected. They aren't bumpkins.

GRA
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Re: TSLA corporate outlook

Mon Aug 13, 2018 7:45 pm

Surprised no one's posted any of this, so I will:
Tesla likely to face SEC investigation following Musk tweets amid debate of market manipulation
https://www.cnbc.com/2018/08/08/tesla-likely-to-face-sec-investigation-following-musk-tweets.html

Elon Musk and Tesla sued over 'fraudulent scheme' to go private
Lawsuits say ‘funding secured’ tweet broke securities laws and aimed to punish short-sellers
https://www.theguardian.com/technology/2018/aug/11/elon-musk-and-tesla-sued-over-funding-secured-tweet

Musk Says ‘Funding Secured’ Claim Sparked by Saudi Meeting
https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2018-08-13/musk-says-saudi-interest-sparked-effort-to-take-tesla-private
Guy [I have lots of experience designing/selling off-grid AE systems, some using EVs but don't own one. Local trips are by foot, bike and/or rapid transit].

The 'best' is the enemy of 'good enough'. Copper shot, not Silver bullets.

WetEV
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Re: TSLA corporate outlook

Mon Aug 13, 2018 8:56 pm

Musk Says ‘Funding Secured’ Claim Sparked by Saudi Meeting
https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2018-08-13/musk-says-saudi-interest-sparked-effort-to-take-tesla-private[/quote]

What would a kingdom economically dependent on oil extraction want to do with an electric car company, other than to shut it down?
WetEV
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EVDRIVER
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Re: TSLA corporate outlook

Mon Aug 13, 2018 9:30 pm

WetEV wrote:
Musk Says ‘Funding Secured’ Claim Sparked by Saudi Meeting
https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2018-08-13/musk-says-saudi-interest-sparked-effort-to-take-tesla-private


What would a kingdom economically dependent on oil extraction want to do with an electric car company, other than to shut it down?[/quote]

Diversify. They happen to also bee seeing fleets of EVs for use their as well as EV limos.

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