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LTLFTcomposite
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Re: TSLA corporate outlook

Mon Mar 04, 2019 4:34 pm

Do they know how many people saw the car in a store, sat in one, talked to sales people and other customers, maybe even took a test drive, then some time later decided to pull the trigger and place an on line order?
LTL
White 2012 SV delivered 10 Dec 2011 returned 25 Nov 2014 replaced with stopgap ICE Sentra
[35 months] [35K miles] [9 Bars]
2013 Volt replaced after 36 months/30k miles with ICE Rogue
2016 SV-adjacent May 2016 lost 4th bar March 2018

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EVDRIVER
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Re: TSLA corporate outlook

Mon Mar 04, 2019 6:07 pm

LTLFTcomposite wrote:Do they know how many people saw the car in a store, sat in one, talked to sales people and other customers, maybe even took a test drive, then some time later decided to pull the trigger and place an on line order?
Yes they track that in detail. Every step and every person that was involved.

GRA
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Re: TSLA corporate outlook

Mon Mar 04, 2019 6:17 pm

LTFLTcomposite wrote:Do they know how many people saw the car in a store, sat in one, talked to sales people and other customers, maybe even took a test drive, then some time later decided to pull the trigger and place an on line order?
Indeed. Most people want to sit in a car and see how it fits them, check out the controls, sight lines, amenities etc. and find out how it drives. We've had more than few people who've rejected the Bolt because they couldn't get comfortable in its seats, others have rejected other AFVs for various other issues that could only be determined through physical examination. Buying a car and then returning it involves considerably more hassle (financing, licensing, insurance etc.) than buying something on Amazon and then returning that. I'm in the group that sees closing the stores as a desperation move to save money. I'm sure Tesla hopes most people won't want to bother returning the car even if they find some aspects unsatisfying, but there's a large group of people, myself included, who simply won't buy a car they can't examine first. The crowd that flips their cars every 3 years may be willing to put up with such issues for the short term, but those of us who keep our cars for the long run aren't: http://www.ktvu.com/news/tesla-shifts-t ... ses-stores

As I'm in the Bay Area 15 or 20 miles from the factory, I assume that I'd be able to look at a car before buying, but someone further away from such metro centers isn't going to have that option.
Last edited by GRA on Mon Mar 04, 2019 8:11 pm, edited 2 times in total.
Guy [I have lots of experience designing/selling off-grid AE systems, some using EVs but don't own one. Local trips are by foot, bike and/or rapid transit].

The 'best' is the enemy of 'good enough'. Copper shot, not Silver bullets.

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EVDRIVER
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Re: TSLA corporate outlook

Mon Mar 04, 2019 6:29 pm

A large number of Tesla buyers have already sat i and driven the cars because they heard about them form friends, relatives, and neighbors and this is increasing at a fast pace.

GRA
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Re: TSLA corporate outlook

Mon Mar 04, 2019 7:02 pm

EVDRIVER wrote:A large number of Tesla buyers have already sat i and driven the cars because they heard about them form friends, relatives, and neighbors and this is increasing at a fast pace.
If most people had that option that might be okay, but going forward Tesla has to expand beyond the early adopter crowd and their friends, and not having stores will slow that expansion. Teslas are common in the Bay Area and some other major metro areas in certain demographic groups, but not elsewhere.
Guy [I have lots of experience designing/selling off-grid AE systems, some using EVs but don't own one. Local trips are by foot, bike and/or rapid transit].

The 'best' is the enemy of 'good enough'. Copper shot, not Silver bullets.

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LTLFTcomposite
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Re: TSLA corporate outlook

Mon Mar 04, 2019 7:35 pm

EVDRIVER wrote:
LTLFTcomposite wrote:Do they know how many people saw the car in a store, sat in one, talked to sales people and other customers, maybe even took a test drive, then some time later decided to pull the trigger and place an on line order?
Yes they track that in detail. Every step and every person that was involved.
Funny I've sat in them in stores and never given my name. Often the store was so crowded the reps were already talking to other customers. They could be using facial recognition I suppose.
LTL
White 2012 SV delivered 10 Dec 2011 returned 25 Nov 2014 replaced with stopgap ICE Sentra
[35 months] [35K miles] [9 Bars]
2013 Volt replaced after 36 months/30k miles with ICE Rogue
2016 SV-adjacent May 2016 lost 4th bar March 2018

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LTLFTcomposite
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Re: TSLA corporate outlook

Mon Mar 04, 2019 7:44 pm

To GRA's point, yeah the return thing sounds like a huge hassle. What if I have a trade, sure I can take it to CarMax instead of trading it in, but how do I unwind that if I decide I don't like the new car? Some people can't carry two payments.

Sure people buy lots of stuff on line, but this isn't like getting an HDMI cable in Amazon.

Sure everyone likes to hate car salesman/dealers, but it's naive to overlook the role they play in closing deals. I also think about the waste... all that expense that went into building out those trendy store locations, now spend more money to break leases. Crazy.
LTL
White 2012 SV delivered 10 Dec 2011 returned 25 Nov 2014 replaced with stopgap ICE Sentra
[35 months] [35K miles] [9 Bars]
2013 Volt replaced after 36 months/30k miles with ICE Rogue
2016 SV-adjacent May 2016 lost 4th bar March 2018

GRA
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Re: TSLA corporate outlook

Mon Mar 04, 2019 8:17 pm

ABG:
NHTSA and NTSB investigating 2 fatal Tesla crashes in Florida
In a Friday crash, a Model 3 drove into a tractor trailer, shearing its roof
https://www.autoblog.com/2019/03/04/nht ... a-crashes/
U.S. authorities are investigating a fatal Tesla Model S crash in Florida last Sunday that killed the driver and caused a massive fire, the second fatal Tesla crash in the state this week being probed, the National Highway Traffic Safety Administration (NHTSA) said on Saturday.

The agency and the National Transportation Safety Board said late on Friday they were sending teams to investigate the other fatal crash Friday in Delray Beach, Fla., in which a 2018 Model 3 crashed into a semi-trailer.

A NHTSA spokesman confirmed Saturday the agency has an "ongoing investigation" into the Sunday Tesla crash in Davie, Fla., and "will take additional actions if appropriate."

Tesla did not immediately comment Saturday.

The South Florida Sun Sentinel reported Monday the 2016 Tesla Model S caught fire and burned the 48-year-old driver beyond recognition. First responders said they couldn't get the car's door handles to work before flames became too intense. The newspaper said the Tesla battery repeatedly caught fire after being transported to a towing facility. . . .

A report on Friday's crash released by the Palm Beach County Sheriff's Department did not indicate if Autopilot was engaged in the crash that killed the 50-year-old Tesla Model 3 owner.

The report said the Tesla struck a tractor trailer and the roof was sheared off as it passed underneath the trailer and stopped three-tenths of a mile south of the collision. The driver was pronounced dead at the scene. . . .

NHTSA is also probing the January 2018 crash of a Tesla vehicle apparently traveling in Autopilot that struck a fire truck in Culver City, California, a May 2018 crash in Utah of a Tesla in Autopilot mode and a May 2018 Tesla accident in Florida that killed two teenagers and injured another but was not in Autopilot.

The NTSB is investigating three earlier Tesla incidents being reviewed by NHTSA, as well as an August 2017 Tesla battery fire in California, in which an owner ran into his garage. . . .
The Friday crash sounds identical to Joshua Brown's:
“Vehicle 1 (V-1) was a tractor/trailer combination vehicle traveling eastbound on the driveway access to 14095 SR 7 (Pero Farms) preparing to turn left onto SR 7. Vehicle 2 (V-2) was traveling southbound on SR 7 within the outside lane approaching Pero Farms. After V-1 came to a brief stop at a stop sign, V-1 entered the southbound lanes of SR 7 pulling into the path of V-2. V-2 struck the driver side of V-1’s trailer resulting in the roof being sheared off as it passed underneath the trailer. V-2 continued southbound and came to a final rest approx 3/10th of a mile south of the collision. The driver of V-2 was pronounced deceased on scene.”
.
There are aerial photos of the truck and car from a distance here: https://cdllife.com/2019/roof-sheared-o ... emi-truck/

We'll see if this was an A/P-caused crash; it seems likely. BTW, it's been about a year since the Huang fatal A/P crash into a gore barrier, so we should be getting the NTSB's final report on that pretty soon.
Guy [I have lots of experience designing/selling off-grid AE systems, some using EVs but don't own one. Local trips are by foot, bike and/or rapid transit].

The 'best' is the enemy of 'good enough'. Copper shot, not Silver bullets.

EatsShootsandLeafs
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Re: TSLA corporate outlook

Tue Mar 05, 2019 5:09 am

Enough with the retail stuff being expected/ not a big deal. It was not planned, was a last minute change in strategy.

https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles ... sing-plans

Elon Musk Blindsided Tesla Staff With Store-Closing Plans
Tesla also suggested a brick-and-mortar retail strategy was important in its annual report filed Feb. 19, just nine days before Musk announced the pivot to online sales
It's indisputable that taking a car for a test drive for an hour or being lent it overnight (as a dealer did to me last summer) is of significant value to a lot of buyers. Lining up financing, signing all the docs, taking delivery, then returning it is a huge hassle and a terrible approach to a "test drive". It's also well documented that the refund process with Tesla is problematic for a lot of people. The company can at times hang onto money for months while people try to get it back.

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EVDRIVER
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Re: TSLA corporate outlook

Tue Mar 05, 2019 6:50 am

Those are long term deposits not car purchases. Long term I don’t think the stores will be an issue as I think they are going to de-work how it’s all done but without a large sales team. The majority of Tesla buyers don’t need to be sold on the car. I really don’t see this as a big deal at this point.

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