edatoakrun
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Re: Sports leaf with more power lower stance and better look

Thu Jul 04, 2013 6:24 pm

="RonDawg"
....Per the article below, the Infiniti LE is "on hold indefinitely." It quotes Infiniti CEO Johan de Nysschen.

http://www.myelectriccarforums.com/infi ... efinitely/

Publicly stated reason:

Renault-Nissan CEO Carlos Goshn recently announced a goal to boost Infiniti annual sales from 170,000 vehicles to 500,000 units by the fiscal year ending March 31, 2017. Infiniti CEO Johan de Nysschen doesn’t believe the goal is attainable, especially if Infiniti focuses on launching the electric LE vehicles.


AFAIK, this is the original source that the article you cited above butchered:


..."There will be an Infiniti EV. The question is one of timing," de Nysschen said. "We have a whole host of product priorities. We have to make very substantial investments now, and it's important that we expand our volume footprint quite quickly."

At the 2012 New York auto show, Infiniti unveiled a five-passenger LE concept electric sedan. Then in December 2012, the brand said it would launch an all-electric Infiniti -- the brand's counterpart to the Nissan Leaf -- in 2014. De Nysschen says that's on hold now.

"There has been no formal decision yet within the company to give the project the green light and let them start with investment," de Nysschen said of the EV. "In my evaluation of our business strategy, I introduced a whole bunch of additional considerations."

Ghosn's EV ambitions pose a challenge for Infiniti. Ghosn has said he hopes to sell 1.5 million EVs across the range of Nissan, Infiniti and Renault by 2016. The company has spent billions of dollars toward that goal. But cumulative sales so far are short of 100,000 units.

A cautious de Nysschen is balancing an Infiniti EV project against resources needed by other products, such as a halo car.

He said it is "quite an easy decision" to prioritize a product that will cultivate "brand positioning" and "expand our market footprint" over a car that has "perceived progressive technology but is not helping to expand the volume base."

"We had so many priorities," he said. The proposed Infiniti EV "was one where I said, 'Look, I need a little more time.'"

The outlook for EVs is clouded by the lack of a charging infrastructure, uncertainty about future government incentives and questions about where China stands on the technology, de Nysschen said. Rapid technological advancements in batteries also risk making an Infiniti EV quickly obsolete.

"We need to re-evaluate our assumptions," he said. "It would not be so smart to introduce a car when perhaps 12 or 18 months down the road you have all-new battery technology."..


http://www.autonews.com/apps/pbcs.dll/a ... z2V9oIk0uM

="RonDawg"
...However, I think it has a lot to do with Elon Musk's recent announcement that he was going to bring an EV in the "$30k price range" but would be superior in every way to the Leaf. Infiniti's decision to delay (perhaps forever) the LE was published not long after Musk's announcement.


Well, If Tesla ever does actually bring an EV in the "$30k price range" to the market I should hope it will be at least in some way superior to the ~$30k BEV Nissan introduced ~ a decade earlier...
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RonDawg
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Re: Sports leaf with more power lower stance and better look

Thu Jul 04, 2013 8:12 pm

deNysschen's statements from the "unbutchered" article doesn't instill any more confidence from me that this car will ever see the light of day, especially with this statement:

There has been no formal decision yet within the company to give the project the green light and let them start with investment," de Nysschen said of the EV. "In my evaluation of our business strategy, I introduced a whole bunch of additional considerations."
(from the "unbutchered" version)

The car's release date has gone from "sometime in 2014" to ???

The fact is any upmarket Nissan and/or Infiniti EV is going to be later rather than sooner. I'm not holding my breath for one.
Blue Ocean 2012 Leaf SV, lost that 1st bar at 34 months/26,435 miles. Lease returned 2 months later. Final LeafStat figures: 225 Gids, 17.44 kWH, SOC 91.89%, SOH 82.36%, 69.49% HX, 54.57 Ahr, battery temp 61.8 F.
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GetOffYourGas
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Re: Sports leaf with more power lower stance and better look

Fri Jul 05, 2013 8:05 am

Does anyone else notice that Inifiniti is claiming that a new battery may be coming, perhaps 12-18 months after 2014? That's by mid-2016. At the same time, Tesla is saying that their third generation will arrive 3-4 years. That's mid-2016 to mid-2017. Is it a coincidence that these two statements, made by the two EV leaders, line up so well? Oh, and GM has hinted that they might make a 200-mile BEV around the same time. They even claim to have prototypes on the road today.

I fully expect the LE to make it to market, but more likely around the same time as Tesla's third generation. They will probably have similar price tags ($40-$50k), similar range (200 miles), and both have quick charging. Where Tesla will have the upper hand is in charging infrastructure with their supercharger network. Even if Nissan gets CHAdeMOs rolled out to hundreds of dealerships by then, they still aren't as available or intelligently placed as the superchargers.

Things will start to get very interesting if these events unfold...
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Nubo
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Re: Sports leaf with more power lower stance and better look

Fri Jul 05, 2013 11:31 am

TomT wrote:I seriously doubt there is enough of a market to support such a limited demand unit at the elevated price it would have to command... Better off getting a Tesla...

Compdoc777 wrote:I would like a sport leaf with more power say 120 kW or more. Somthing light and nice looking like the Z with all the amenities of the Leaf SL. Something I can autocross, and drive daily.


Sometimes markets exist, and sometimes they are "created". Which really only means that someone saw the market that existed, before anyone else did.

I noticed you're still working with polymers.

Compdoc777
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Re: Sports leaf with more power lower stance and better look

Sat Jul 13, 2013 8:57 am

Nubo wrote:
TomT wrote:I seriously doubt there is enough of a market to support such a limited demand unit at the elevated price it would have to command... Better off getting a Tesla...

Compdoc777 wrote:I would like a sport leaf with more power say 120 kW or more. Somthing light and nice looking like the Z with all the amenities of the Leaf SL. Something I can autocross, and drive daily.


Sometimes markets exist, and sometimes they are "created". Which really only means that someone saw the market that existed, before anyone else did.




Yes the leaf is already sporty and hot hatch like.. A little more power and updated looks will get much more buyers. 80% of selling a car is looks. 10% is power, 10% is tech.

Most people don't need a gas powered car. I am never going back and I like proving daily to people that yes my car is just as fast if not faster on my 35 mile cruise to work while they piss money away in gasoline oil and other. Even my co-worker drives a GTI 2.0t and the daily drive at 27 mpg is costing him $322 a month ouch! I can only imagine the guys who drive F350s to work just to park it in a garage all day some have 50 mile or more one way 100 mile round trip drives $$$$ LOL!

edatoakrun
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Re: Sports leaf with more power lower stance and better look

Sat Jul 13, 2013 9:27 am

="Compdoc777"

...Yes the leaf is already sporty...


"Sporty"?

Not the adjective that comes to mind. More like, "utilitarian", "practical", and more subjectively, "homely".

IMO, Nissan should build something like the Esflow, a true performance BEV that would have a halo effect in selling a lot of LEAFs with performance options to those wanting a "sporty" BEV.

Compdoc777 wrote:... Somthing light and nice looking like the Z with all the amenities of the Leaf SL. Something I can autocross, and drive daily...

="edatoakrun"
See the Esflow threads:

viewtopic.php?f=10&t=2671&start=190
viewtopic.php?f=10&t=12306&start=10

I'm still hoping Nissan will build it, so that I use the ESFLOW for long trips and pleasure driving, and relegate my 2011 LEAF to the family truckster duties, for which the LEAF is the ideal vehicle.
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TomT
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Re: Sports leaf with more power lower stance and better look

Sat Jul 13, 2013 10:09 am

Knowing Tesla, it will be superior in almost every way.

edatoakrun wrote:Well, If Tesla ever does actually bring an EV in the "$30k price range" to the market I should hope it will be at least in some way superior to the ~$30k BEV Nissan introduced ~ a decade earlier...
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TomT
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Re: Sports leaf with more power lower stance and better look

Sat Jul 13, 2013 10:10 am

Having owned many sports and sporty cars over the years, I have to agree. The Leaf is about as far from sporty as you can get!

edatoakrun wrote:
Compdoc777 wrote:...Yes the leaf is already sporty...
"Sporty"?

Not the adjective that comes to mind. More like, "utilitarian", "practical", and more subjectively, "homely".
Leaf SL 2011 to 2016, Volt Premier 2016 to 2019, and now:
2019 Model 3; LR, RWD, FSD, 19" Sport Wheels, silver/black; built 3/17/19, delivered 3/29/19.

LeftieBiker
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Re: Sports leaf with more power lower stance and better look

Sat Jul 13, 2013 2:02 pm

TomT wrote:Having owned many sports and sporty cars over the years, I have to agree. The Leaf is about as far from sporty as you can get!


Don't be silly. It isn't a minivan, an econobox, a boxy sedan, etc. Even my old Civic EX was less Sporty than my Leaf SV. Just say it isn't "very sporty" and you'll be much closer to the truth. You're either a purist or just enjoy hyperbole, I guess.
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Drivesolo
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Re: Sports leaf with more power lower stance and better look

Mon Jul 15, 2013 10:44 am

I agree w/ TomT. To say that the Leaf is in any way sporty would be only for those who have never attempted to drive it at speeds above 30 mph. From a 5 mph roll, up to 30 mph it is somewhat quick. However in stock form; it can not corner worth a damn and can be beaten to 60mph by pretty much all mid-sized CMY pickup trucks.

If Nissan had made the Leaf RWD from the start it would've had much greater potential to be a "sporty" car even w/ its current power and weight characteristics.
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