scottf200
Posts: 1630
Joined: Sun Aug 07, 2011 9:21 pm
Delivery Date: 26 Feb 2011
Location: In my Volt VIN 01234 <actual>
Contact: Website

Scheduling method 2 keep ur 12v battery charged while vaca

Sun May 27, 2012 10:39 am

Does the LEAF have a scheduler with sort time increments (ie. 15 minutes). Below is a thought I had on the Volt and thought it was applicable to the LEAF as well. If not let me know and I'll delete this thread:

We know even if plugged in that the 12v battery is only charged when the main 360v battery is also actively being charged. Given that ...

Re: Scheduling method to keep your 12v battery charged while on long trip

* The Volt charging scheduler does 15 minute increments (I just hopped in the Volt to see the incr units. I assume the MyVolt.COM is the same)
* You can charge "off_peak" OR "mid_peak"+"off_peak" as a combo. These are just esoteric names assigned to some hours.
* It has a weekday and a weekend scheduling component.

What if you used this combination to have normal (non-vaca) charging to be "mid_peak".

What if while down_south or on a long_vaca that you set to "off_peak" charging only. And you set the weekend only "off_peak" as an example to do ONE 15 minute charge. This would keep the 12v battery battery topped off. Plug into the 120v charger on the lower 8amp setting even if you have a 240v charger. Run the Volt down to say 5 EV miles or whatever before you leave.

"Automated" food for thought. Hope that makes somewhat sense. A little hard to explain and I'm not that good at it <grin>!

I vote they build in a "vacation charging" schedule so it just wakes up for a couple minutes a day or every 3rd day.
Last edited by scottf200 on Sun May 27, 2012 11:59 am, edited 1 time in total.
100K EV miles and 80% EV usage
Volt = 53+ mile BEV up to 100 MPH, then 40 MPG hybrid with a 9 gal gas tank
RIP Tesla Model X P90DL - Sig:603 | 2011 Volt to kid | 2016 for wife | 2012 other kid

User avatar
TomT
Posts: 10557
Joined: Sun Aug 08, 2010 12:09 pm
Delivery Date: 01 Mar 2011
Leaf Number: 000360
Location: Foothills of Granada Hills, CA
Contact: Website

Re: Scheduling method 2 keep ur 12v battery charged while va

Sun May 27, 2012 11:44 am

The Leaf's 12 volt battery requirements are somewhat different than the Volt's due to its different EV architecture. But yes, if the car is left alone, the inverter will come on every 5 days to top up the battery from the main pack. If the car is outside and it's an SL, the solar panel will also keep the battery topped up.

Does the LEAF have a scheduler with sort time increments (ie. 15 minutes). Below is a thought I had on the Volt and thought it was applicable to the LEAF as well.
Last edited by TomT on Sun May 27, 2012 12:58 pm, edited 1 time in total.
59,991 miles/12 bars/289 Gids/68.54 AHr/101% SOH/101.64% Hx 7May15 w/ new Lizard (barely made the warranty).
71,770 miles/12 bars/256 Gids/59.04 AHr/88% SOH/87.92% Hx 3Mar16 at lease return.

Now driving a 2016 Volt Premier. Model 3 reserved.

scottf200
Posts: 1630
Joined: Sun Aug 07, 2011 9:21 pm
Delivery Date: 26 Feb 2011
Location: In my Volt VIN 01234 <actual>
Contact: Website

Re: Scheduling method 2 keep ur 12v battery charged while va

Sun May 27, 2012 12:06 pm

TomT wrote:The Leaf does not have to ever start an ICE as the Volt does so its 12 volt battery requirements are different.
Not sure I follow this comment but the 12v battery in the Volt is *just* to "boot" the computers. The 360v battery and the generator motor would start the ICE/GG. Volt has *no* typical "starter motor" like on a conventional car.

On the other hand, the 12v battery in the Volt is good sized (CCA) as you can jump other cars from it easily and with the Volt "on" the APM will let the 360v charge the 12v so you can jump the neighbors 4x4 truck in the dead of winter.

TomT wrote:But yes, if the car is left alone, the inverter will come on every 5 days to top up the battery from the main pack. If the car is outside and it's an SL, the solar panel will also keep the battery topped up.
Good to know. I was under the impression that the 12v battery was only charged when the main battery was also being charged. Thought I read LEAF post on that.
100K EV miles and 80% EV usage
Volt = 53+ mile BEV up to 100 MPH, then 40 MPG hybrid with a 9 gal gas tank
RIP Tesla Model X P90DL - Sig:603 | 2011 Volt to kid | 2016 for wife | 2012 other kid

User avatar
TomT
Posts: 10557
Joined: Sun Aug 08, 2010 12:09 pm
Delivery Date: 01 Mar 2011
Leaf Number: 000360
Location: Foothills of Granada Hills, CA
Contact: Website

Re: Scheduling method 2 keep ur 12v battery charged while va

Sun May 27, 2012 12:57 pm

The 12 Volt DC-DC inverter can provide something like 100-150 amps (I forget the exact number now) so jumping is possible there too. I did exactly that with a friend's truck last winter, in fact.

scottf200 wrote:On the other hand, the 12v battery in the Volt is good sized (CCA) as you can jump other cars from it easily and with the Volt "on" the APM will let the 360v charge the 12v so you can jump the neighbors 4x4 truck in the dead of winter.
59,991 miles/12 bars/289 Gids/68.54 AHr/101% SOH/101.64% Hx 7May15 w/ new Lizard (barely made the warranty).
71,770 miles/12 bars/256 Gids/59.04 AHr/88% SOH/87.92% Hx 3Mar16 at lease return.

Now driving a 2016 Volt Premier. Model 3 reserved.

User avatar
TomT
Posts: 10557
Joined: Sun Aug 08, 2010 12:09 pm
Delivery Date: 01 Mar 2011
Leaf Number: 000360
Location: Foothills of Granada Hills, CA
Contact: Website

Re: Scheduling method 2 keep ur 12v battery charged while va

Sun May 27, 2012 1:09 pm

What happens if the car has been parked with the main battery pack depleted - yes, I know it never actually is supposed to go to zero because the BMS does not allow that - and then is later started? Yes, it has no starter per se, but the generator motor still must be fed sufficient power to turn over the generator's ICE to start it up, and that clearly requires more power that simply booting the Leaf. The motor/generator still assumes a starter's function, no? I assume that is why the Leaf's 12 volt battery can be smaller...

I don't pretend to know all the inner working of the Volt any more than I know the ones of the Leaf, even though I have studied the Leaf service and training manuals in great detail...

scottf200 wrote:
TomT wrote:The Leaf does not have to ever start an ICE as the Volt does so its 12 volt battery requirements are different.
Not sure I follow this comment but the 12v battery in the Volt is *just* to "boot" the computers. The 360v battery and the generator motor would start the ICE/GG. Volt has *no* typical "starter motor" like on a conventional car.
59,991 miles/12 bars/289 Gids/68.54 AHr/101% SOH/101.64% Hx 7May15 w/ new Lizard (barely made the warranty).
71,770 miles/12 bars/256 Gids/59.04 AHr/88% SOH/87.92% Hx 3Mar16 at lease return.

Now driving a 2016 Volt Premier. Model 3 reserved.

scottf200
Posts: 1630
Joined: Sun Aug 07, 2011 9:21 pm
Delivery Date: 26 Feb 2011
Location: In my Volt VIN 01234 <actual>
Contact: Website

Re: Scheduling method 2 keep ur 12v battery charged while va

Sun May 27, 2012 2:37 pm

TomT wrote:The 12 Volt DC-DC inverter can provide something like 100-150 amps (I forget the exact number now) so jumping is possible there too. I did exactly that with a friend's truck last winter, in fact.
OK. I guess I was remembering this thread that stated "The User Manual states that a LEAF cannot be used to jump another vehicle":
viewtopic.php?f=9&t=6707

I have not read the whole LEAF manual, however.
Last edited by scottf200 on Mon May 28, 2012 7:25 am, edited 1 time in total.
100K EV miles and 80% EV usage
Volt = 53+ mile BEV up to 100 MPH, then 40 MPG hybrid with a 9 gal gas tank
RIP Tesla Model X P90DL - Sig:603 | 2011 Volt to kid | 2016 for wife | 2012 other kid

User avatar
planet4ever
Posts: 4674
Joined: Sat Apr 03, 2010 9:53 pm
Delivery Date: 02 May 2011
Leaf Number: 1537
Location: Morgan Hill, CA, south of San Jose

Re: Scheduling method 2 keep ur 12v battery charged while va

Sun May 27, 2012 4:26 pm

TomT wrote:What happens if the car has been parked with the main battery pack depleted - yes, I know it never actually is supposed to go to zero because the BMS does not allow that - and then is later started? Yes, it has no starter per se, but the generator motor still must be fed sufficient power to turn over the generator's ICE to start it up, and that clearly requires more power that simply booting the Leaf. The motor/generator still assumes a starter's function, no? I assume that is why the Leaf's 12 volt battery can be smaller...
I'm fairly certain that the Volt's generator (running as a starter) can only be powered from the high voltage battery, so would never put a load on the 12v battery. But of course even "fully discharged" the main battery still has many times as much power (wattage) as any 12v lead acid battery ever has. So your hypothetical problem would never really exist.

Ray
End of April 2013: Traded my 2011 SL for a 2013 S with charge pkg.

User avatar
davewill
Posts: 4771
Joined: Thu Mar 17, 2011 6:04 pm
Location: San Diego, CA, US

Re: Scheduling method 2 keep ur 12v battery charged while va

Mon May 28, 2012 2:07 pm

scottf200 wrote:
TomT wrote:But yes, if the car is left alone, the inverter will come on every 5 days to top up the battery from the main pack. If the car is outside and it's an SL, the solar panel will also keep the battery topped up.
Good to know. I was under the impression that the 12v battery was only charged when the main battery was also being charged. Thought I read LEAF post on that.
There's an issue where if the car is left plugged in on a charge timer, it seems to prevent the every 5 day 12v charge from happening. So, you want to avoid leaving it plugged in while sitting for long periods, or use a battery tender. The LEAF manual recommends charging it to 80%, leaving it unplugged, and then charging the car every 3 months while storing.
2014 Rav4 EV, Blizzard Pearl White
2011 LEAF SL w/QC, Blue Ocean, returned at end of lease

smkettner
Posts: 6990
Joined: Mon Aug 09, 2010 10:13 pm
Delivery Date: 26 Feb 2014
Location: Orange County, CA

Re: Scheduling method 2 keep ur 12v battery charged while va

Mon May 28, 2012 4:46 pm

How long are you on vacation?

Otherwise you can set LEAF timer to charge 10 minutes once a week and it will top up the 12v battery at the same time. I suggest starting with low state of charge and 80% setting.

It seems to work fine for those that have done it.
1 bar lost at 21,451 miles, 16 months.
2 bar lost at 35,339 miles, 25 months.
LEAF traded at 45,400 miles for a RAV4-EV

leafydragon
Posts: 23
Joined: Thu Jun 14, 2012 9:12 pm
Delivery Date: 14 Jun 2012
Leaf Number: 010464
Location: Singapore

Re: Scheduling method 2 keep ur 12v battery charged while va

Wed Jun 20, 2012 2:07 am

smkettner wrote:How long are you on vacation?
Otherwise you can set LEAF timer to charge 10 minutes once a week and it will top up the 12v battery at the same time. I suggest starting with low state of charge and 80% setting.
It seems to work fine for those that have done it.

Wait a minute, from what I understand of the 12V batt vacation-depletion problem, it is the fact that a charger is left plugged into the car, will either inhibit the 5-day charging of the 12V batt, AND/OR will cause additional draw on the 12V batt whenever the charger is plugged in.
This would be a design flaw.
Am I mistaken?

Off-topic suggestion, the Leaf looks surprisingly "low-tech" under the hood, because of the lead-acid-battery.
I understand the need for separate low-voltage pack for safe operation of accessories and safety stuff with the traction battery disconnected.
But how about using NiMH or LiFePO4 packs (with suitable charge circuit and discharge protection logic)?

Return to “Suggestions for Nissan”