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jlv
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Re: Tesla's autopilot, on the road

Thu Aug 10, 2017 12:52 pm

edatoakrun wrote:If TSLA is ever to become profitable, I expect it may be largely due to monetizing the information it is able to collect on vehicle occupants.
...Interestingly, the camera in the Model 3 doesn’t only cover the driver, but the whole cabin...

I can see it now: the Tesla Network's video channel of the "80 MPH Club".
'13 SL+Prem (mfg 12/13, leased 4/14, bought 5/17)Tesla S 75D (3/17)
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GRA
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Re: Tesla's autopilot, on the road

Thu Aug 10, 2017 3:48 pm

Somehow, I think that people who are worried about in-cabin cameras will have another use for duct, electrician's or masking tape, depending on how much they care about aesthetics.
Guy [I have lots of experience designing/selling off-grid AE systems, some using EVs but don't own one. Local trips are by foot, bike and/or rapid transit].

The 'best' is the enemy of 'good enough'. Copper shot, not Silver bullets.

baustin
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Re: Tesla's autopilot, on the road

Thu Aug 10, 2017 5:15 pm

Which will likely disable the AutoPilot functions...
2013 Leaf SV - Cayenne Red - QC Port - LED Headlights

GRA
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Re: Tesla's autopilot, on the road

Fri Aug 11, 2017 3:53 pm

baustin wrote:Which will likely disable the AutoPilot functions...

In a car-share vehicle that may be true (assuming you can write code to do that). But in a privately-owned car, I doubt they could get away with that. Even if they can, that just provides an opportunity for competitors who offers camera-free cabins. Most people simply won't care, and will ignore them just as they ignore security cameras now. A business opportunity awaits, to serve those that do care.
Guy [I have lots of experience designing/selling off-grid AE systems, some using EVs but don't own one. Local trips are by foot, bike and/or rapid transit].

The 'best' is the enemy of 'good enough'. Copper shot, not Silver bullets.

baustin
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Re: Tesla's autopilot, on the road

Sat Aug 12, 2017 4:21 am

GRA wrote:
baustin wrote:Which will likely disable the AutoPilot functions...

In a car-share vehicle that may be true (assuming you can write code to do that). But in a privately-owned car, I doubt they could get away with that. Even if they can, that just provides an opportunity for competitors who offers camera-free cabins. Most people simply won't care, and will ignore them just as they ignore security cameras now. A business opportunity awaits, to serve those that do care.


If Tesla is going to install a camera to monitor the driver while AutoPilot is active, then I would image that they would code it to either disable or limit the AutoPilot functions if the camera gets no image. If they are not going to do that, then what is the point of installing a camera to monitor the driver?
2013 Leaf SV - Cayenne Red - QC Port - LED Headlights

GRA
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Joined: Mon Sep 19, 2011 1:49 pm
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Re: Tesla's autopilot, on the road

Sat Aug 12, 2017 4:14 pm

baustin wrote:
GRA wrote:
baustin wrote:Which will likely disable the AutoPilot functions...

In a car-share vehicle that may be true (assuming you can write code to do that). But in a privately-owned car, I doubt they could get away with that. Even if they can, that just provides an opportunity for competitors who offers camera-free cabins. Most people simply won't care, and will ignore them just as they ignore security cameras now. A business opportunity awaits, to serve those that do care.


If Tesla is going to install a camera to monitor the driver while AutoPilot is active, then I would image that they would code it to either disable or limit the AutoPilot functions if the camera gets no image. If they are not going to do that, then what is the point of installing a camera to monitor the driver?

What's to stop someone from taping a photo (of Elon Musk or J.B. Straubel, if they wish) in front of the camera lens? :D I can see plenty of ways to game such a system, but maybe they can make it foolproof. To me though, the whole issue simply goes away if the cars are fully autonomous and the company assumes responsibility for any accidents the car causes while it's driving itself, which is what the standard should be. Then, who cares what the occupants are doing inside the car? Monitor cameras used as above serve solely as a means of shifting the blame when a car is semi-autonomous. Monitoring a driver for signs of drowsiness is another matter, but there are other indicators of that which don't require a camera.
Last edited by GRA on Sun Aug 13, 2017 4:00 pm, edited 1 time in total.
Guy [I have lots of experience designing/selling off-grid AE systems, some using EVs but don't own one. Local trips are by foot, bike and/or rapid transit].

The 'best' is the enemy of 'good enough'. Copper shot, not Silver bullets.

Graffi
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Re: Tesla's autopilot, on the road

Sun Aug 13, 2017 10:10 am

Reading through these last few posts I am directed to the little "EYE" on the top of my Laptop. How many of you are concerned with someone remotely watching you through that camera? How many of you have covered that EYE to SPY? As soon as I get a new laptop (had to get a replacement this past November) I place one of those little circular band-aids over the lens. It both protects the lens and allows me to be protected from any remote viewing. jmho
2013 SL Metalic Slate - We LOVE our Leaf
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GRA
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Re: Tesla's autopilot, on the road

Sun Aug 13, 2017 4:01 pm

Graffi wrote:Reading through these last few posts I am directed to the little "EYE" on the top of my Laptop. How many of you are concerned with someone remotely watching you through that camera? How many of you have covered that EYE to SPY? As soon as I get a new laptop (had to get a replacement this past November) I place one of those little circular band-aids over the lens. It both protects the lens and allows me to be protected from any remote viewing. jmho

Yup.
Guy [I have lots of experience designing/selling off-grid AE systems, some using EVs but don't own one. Local trips are by foot, bike and/or rapid transit].

The 'best' is the enemy of 'good enough'. Copper shot, not Silver bullets.

baustin
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Re: Tesla's autopilot, on the road

Sun Aug 13, 2017 5:08 pm

Graffi wrote:Reading through these last few posts I am directed to the little "EYE" on the top of my Laptop. How many of you are concerned with someone remotely watching you through that camera? How many of you have covered that EYE to SPY? As soon as I get a new laptop (had to get a replacement this past November) I place one of those little circular band-aids over the lens. It both protects the lens and allows me to be protected from any remote viewing. jmho


As I see it, this fear of remote viewing is fueled by paranoia and ignorance. Many cameras have a light to show when they are active. The only reported case, that I am aware of, where this actually happened, the remote viewer loaded the software before he handed out the laptops to the recipients. Yes, it could happen, but the odds of it are extremely low.
2013 Leaf SV - Cayenne Red - QC Port - LED Headlights

GRA
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Joined: Mon Sep 19, 2011 1:49 pm
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Re: Tesla's autopilot, on the road

Mon Aug 14, 2017 5:07 pm

baustin wrote:
Graffi wrote:Reading through these last few posts I am directed to the little "EYE" on the top of my Laptop. How many of you are concerned with someone remotely watching you through that camera? How many of you have covered that EYE to SPY? As soon as I get a new laptop (had to get a replacement this past November) I place one of those little circular band-aids over the lens. It both protects the lens and allows me to be protected from any remote viewing. jmho


As I see it, this fear of remote viewing is fueled by paranoia and ignorance. Many cameras have a light to show when they are active. The only reported case, that I am aware of, where this actually happened, the remote viewer loaded the software before he handed out the laptops to the recipients. Yes, it could happen, but the odds of it are extremely low.

Sure, much of it is driven by paranoia, but as the old saying goes, just because you're paranoid doesn't mean they aren't out to get you! :lol:

Re indicator lights, the people who worry about such things will point out that if they can hack your computer remotely to turn the camera on, they can probably disable the indicator light as well. See the "Autonomous vehicles" thread for Tesla's concerns about hacking the AI.
Guy [I have lots of experience designing/selling off-grid AE systems, some using EVs but don't own one. Local trips are by foot, bike and/or rapid transit].

The 'best' is the enemy of 'good enough'. Copper shot, not Silver bullets.

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