DanCar
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Location: SF Bay area, 94043

Re: Autonomous Vehicles, LEAF and others...

Mon Dec 25, 2017 11:01 am

GRA wrote:I'd say that's pretty much still dem/val. I'm talking about the point when the public can buy cars with L4 capability.
Waymo says the public will be able to do this with their ride sharing service next year, in Chandler, Az. Might be 2025 before it is cheap, ride share or car purchase, and available across much of the U.S.

edatoakrun
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Leaf Number: 2184
Location: Shasta County, North California

Re: Autonomous Vehicles, LEAF and others...

Wed Dec 27, 2017 12:35 pm

Too bad PRO-PILOT assist is not yet available fro the comparisons below:

We compared 3 self-driving systems in cars — and the winner is clear

We've tried Tesla Autopilot, Cadillac Super Cruise, and Mercedes Drive Pilot.

Each has its own pros and cons....


And the winner is ... Cadillac Super Cruise!

I stand by my verdict from my original Autopilot-Super Cruise head-to-head.

Super Cruise does one thing quite well. Outside that one thing — hands-free highway driving — I had zero confidence in it, but then again, Cadillac didn't design it to promote any confidence at all off the highway.

I've added another layering of thinking to my views on these autonomous technologies. My question is, "Would I pay for it?"

I can get Super Cruise for under $100,000 and trust it to handle some major highways, so I would seriously considering parting with the cash. With Autopilot, given that the hardware on new vehicles is already in place, I might wait until Tesla improves the system before ponying up the dough.

And with Drive Pilot, although it's the underachiever that overachieves, it's not so much better than good old cruise control that I'd feel obligated to shoulder the considerable extra expense.

So it's Super Cruise for the win!

http://www.businessinsider.com/best-sel ... r-cruise-7

Listen here, for a discussion also affirming GM's superiority:

http://www.autonocast.com/blog/2017/12/ ... -and-china
no condition is permanent

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EVDRIVER
Posts: 6065
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Re: Autonomous Vehicles, LEAF and others...

Wed Dec 27, 2017 2:20 pm

What automakers will be offering OTA updates to their driving tech besides Tesla? I see it odd to compare what could be finished products on one vehicle to one that is evolving and offers constant updates and enhancements for free with the ability to upgrade to full autonomous. Will all automakers be offing this value proposition? Do they offer the ability to leverage unused and included hardware to enhance their present capabilities?

GRA
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Location: East side of San Francisco Bay

Re: Autonomous Vehicles, LEAF and others...

Sun Jan 21, 2018 5:12 pm

Via GCC:
New Navigant Leaderboard puts GM and Waymo at the head of the autonomous driving technology pack, Tesla last
http://www.greencarcongress.com/2018/01/20180119-navigant.html

. . .The Navigant AD Leaderboard assesses which participants are best-equipped to be the Leaders in developing complete automated driving stacks—including perception systems, processing, and control software—and services platforms. It quantifies the current relative position of each of these companies as the latest features are being developed and commercialized to help improve safety. . . .

In this latest report, General Motors (GM) and Waymo are effectively in a dead heat on the technology front; both companies are on the verge of having production ready AVs suitable for mobility services.

While Waymo has made progress on the business front with partnerships with Avis, AutoNation, and Lyft, GM still has the edge with the ability to manufacture vehicles and provide services through its dealer network, its captive finance arm, and the Maven mobility service division. . . .

Of note, Tesla ranked last in this Leaderboard, tied with Apple in the Challengers group. Navigant observed that while Tesla has been aggressive in promoting Autopilot, since ending its relationship with Mobileye the company has struggled to reach the same level of functionality with its in-house developed system.

Navigant’s evaluation criteria for the report include:

Vision
Go-to-Market Strategy
Partners
Production Strategy
Technology
Sales, Marketing, and Distribution
Product Capability
Product Quality and Reliability
Product Portfolio
Staying Power

There's an X-Y chart comparing all the companies, with the X-axis showing Strategy and the Y-axis Execution.
Guy [I have lots of experience designing/selling off-grid AE systems, some using EVs but don't own one. Local trips are by foot, bike and/or rapid transit].

The 'best' is the enemy of 'good enough'. Copper shot, not Silver bullets.

GRA
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Joined: Mon Sep 19, 2011 1:49 pm
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Re: Autonomous Vehicles, LEAF and others...

Wed Jan 31, 2018 5:35 pm

Via GCC:
udelv makes first public road test delivery from autonomous electric last-mile delivery vehicle
http://www.greencarcongress.com/2018/01/20180131-udelv.html

udelv, a Burlingame, Calif. company, unveiled its autonomous, electric, last-mile delivery vehicle and made the first public road test deliveries from Draeger’s Market in San Mateo to two nearby customers. The deliver route was a 2.5-mile loop with traffic lights, lane changes, unsignalized left turns and two delivery stops. In compliance with existing California regulations, the vehicle was supervised by a safety driver and in test mode.

The distinctive orange customized vehicle is built on a fully electric powertrain and features 18 secure cargo compartments with automatic doors using a cloud-based proprietary technology that is shared between the vehicle, customers and merchants. In its current configuration, the vehicle can drive for up to 60 miles (97 km) per cycle and can load up to 700 pounds (317.5 kg) of cargo.

A dedicated application is available on iOS to track and potentially reschedule deliveries, with an Android version to be released soon.

To complement its autonomous driving technology and ensure reliability of the service, udelv also created an ultra-low latency teleoperations system to monitor and control the vehicles remotely and allow for overrides and human-assisted guidance in unique situations. . . .

The company, with several technology patents pending, is planning to test dozens of udelv vehicles on the roads in a few states within a short timeframe. . . .
Guy [I have lots of experience designing/selling off-grid AE systems, some using EVs but don't own one. Local trips are by foot, bike and/or rapid transit].

The 'best' is the enemy of 'good enough'. Copper shot, not Silver bullets.

GRA
Posts: 7931
Joined: Mon Sep 19, 2011 1:49 pm
Location: East side of San Francisco Bay

Re: Autonomous Vehicles, LEAF and others...

Wed Jan 31, 2018 6:51 pm

Via ABG:
Waymo orders thousands of Pacifica vans for self-driving ride-hailing
Commercial service is scheduled to begin in Phoenix this year and expand from there.
https://www.autoblog.com/2018/01/30/waymo-thousands-pacifica-vans-self-driving/

. . . Fiat Chrysler provided Waymo with 100 Pacifica minivans refitted for self-driving testing in 2016, then 500 in 2017. . . .

The companies said the automaker would start delivering "thousands" of minivans in late 2018. Waymo is due to begin offering a ride-hailing service to the public in Phoenix later this year.

"The additional Pacifica Hybrid minivans will be used to support Waymo as it expands its service to more cities across the United States," the companies said. . . .

Last week, Waymo said it began testing self-driving vehicles in Atlanta, bringing to 25 the total number of U.S. cities in which it is testing. .
. .
Guy [I have lots of experience designing/selling off-grid AE systems, some using EVs but don't own one. Local trips are by foot, bike and/or rapid transit].

The 'best' is the enemy of 'good enough'. Copper shot, not Silver bullets.

cwerdna
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Re: Autonomous Vehicles, LEAF and others...

Thu Feb 01, 2018 1:40 am

Thanks to https://teslamotorsclub.com/tmc/threads ... t-2541464I found out that CA DMV https://www.dmv.ca.gov/portal/dmv/detai ... eport_2017 are finally up.

Tesla's answer is amusing to me vs. Waymo. I'll have to spend some time to look at the others. https://www.theverge.com/2018/1/31/1695 ... ement-2017 is a summary story.

As a refresher, 2016 CA DMV disengagement Reports are at https://www.dmv.ca.gov/portal/dmv/detai ... eport_2016.

https://www.engadget.com/2018/02/01/way ... port-card/ says
Waymo's vehicles drove 2 million miles in self-driving mode across 25 cities in 2017, putting its total autonomous miles to 4 million. It accelerated its testing to prepare for its ride-hailing fleet's launch this year, allowing it to "gather as much data as possible in order to improve [its] technology." According to its annual report submitted to the government of California, Waymo drove 352,545 of those miles in The Golden State from December 2016 to November 2017...

'13 blue Leaf SV w/premium package (owned)
'13 blue Leaf SV w/QC + LED & premium packages (lease over, car returned)
'06 Prius

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RegGuheert
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Re: Autonomous Vehicles, LEAF and others...

Thu Feb 01, 2018 2:00 pm

First-ever self-driving delivery on public roads sees groceries dropped off in Bay Area:
San Jose Mercury News wrote:A Bay Area tech company is claiming the world’s first delivery of goods by a self-driving car on public roads, after its electric cargo truck carried groceries from the posh Draeger’s grocery store in San Mateo to two nearby locations Tuesday.

“We’re making history today by reinventing deliveries,” said Udelv CEO Daniel Laury.
RegGuheert
2011 Leaf SL Demo vehicle
10K miles: Apr 14, 2013, 20K miles (55.7Ah): Aug 7, 2014, 30K miles (52.0Ah): Dec 30, 2015, 40K miles (49.8Ah): Feb 8, 2017, 50K miles (47.2Ah): Dec 7, 2017.
Enphase Inverter Measured MTBF: M190, M215, M250, S280

cwerdna
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Re: Autonomous Vehicles, LEAF and others...

Fri Feb 02, 2018 4:12 am

https://www.autoblog.com/2018/02/01/way ... tervention lists some stats from the 2017 CA DMV disengagement reports I pointed to earlier.

Unrelated:
We were in an accident during an automated driving tech demo
https://techcrunch.com/2018/02/01/we-we ... tech-demo/

Also, the Navigant chart from much earlier is a bit goofy. How the heck could they know anything about Apple's program to put it on the chart? They haven't released any info.

'13 blue Leaf SV w/premium package (owned)
'13 blue Leaf SV w/QC + LED & premium packages (lease over, car returned)
'06 Prius

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RegGuheert
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Re: Autonomous Vehicles, LEAF and others...

Sat Feb 03, 2018 3:34 pm

GM To Go Large With Self-Driving Cars In U.S. In 2019:
InsideEVs wrote:According to GM, robo-taxis could generate “several hundred thousands of dollars” of revenue over its lifetime, compared to $30,000 on average that GM’s gets from the initial sale.

In 2016, GM acquired Cruise Automation and engaged it to develop fleet of autonomous Chevrolet Bolt EVs.

One of the main goals for the future is lowering the costs of autonomous vehicles. GM decided to equip the Bolt EVs with all the stuff for self-driving from in-house components. Chief Executive Mary Barra said:
GM Chief Executive Mary Barra wrote:We are the only company that has this under one roof.
A key element in GM’s self-driving technology, Lidar, is expected to cost $300 at some point in the future (huge decrease from $20,000 today). To make it reality, GM recently acquired Lidar company Strobe Inc. that promised 99% cost reduction.
FWIW, LiDAR is the technology that is claimed to be needed on the Teslas to keep them from driving into parked firetrucks at full speed:

Image
RegGuheert
2011 Leaf SL Demo vehicle
10K miles: Apr 14, 2013, 20K miles (55.7Ah): Aug 7, 2014, 30K miles (52.0Ah): Dec 30, 2015, 40K miles (49.8Ah): Feb 8, 2017, 50K miles (47.2Ah): Dec 7, 2017.
Enphase Inverter Measured MTBF: M190, M215, M250, S280

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