edatoakrun
Posts: 4329
Joined: Thu Nov 11, 2010 9:33 am
Delivery Date: 15 May 2011
Leaf Number: 2184
Location: Shasta County, North California

Re: Tesla's autopilot, on the road

Thu Jun 01, 2017 12:58 pm

Google translation seems to indicate another Tesla crash due either autopilot, or to confusion of who (or what) was driving the car: :

MODEL X FOUNDER: AN ACCIDENT THAT HURTS ... HEART!

On May 25, 2017 at 10 am, I made a horrendous road accident with the Model X Founder which was given to us as a gift by Tesla Motors thanks to the SEO competition.
Route 138 to Pointe-du-Lac is very narrow and in some places the stone walls protecting the residences are at as little as 2 meters from the asphalt.
I thought I was on the autopilot (it was activated well or I thought it was activated, I do not know) and so I left the road of the eyes for a short time in order to change Song on the center screen. When my eyes came back on the road, half of the car was already on the roadside ... I gave a steering wheel to avoid the stone wall, but it was too late! Obviously, it happened very quickly...

http://roulezelectrique.com/model-x-fou ... -au-coeur/

Another report emphasizing another risk from the driver not comprehending autopilot's limitations:

Tesla’s Autopilot Tech Is a Danger to Cyclists, Robotics Expert Says

Tesla's semi-autonomous car technology has helped make the company a $54 billion success story. But the system still has flaws, according to a Stanford University robotics researcher, who says it shows a disturbing inability to recognize cyclists.

Heather Knight is an expert in human-robot interfaces with a PhD from the Robotics Institute at Carnegie Mellon University, and is doing post-doctoral research in social robotics. She published an essay about Tesla's self-driving tech on the blogging platform Medium, entitled "Tesla Autopilot Review: Bikers Will Die."...

Knight said that her concern is that people will see the so-called "autopilot" feature as being fully autonomous at all times, and will fail to pay attention to their surroundings, "as we see in the fatal crashes so far." Even if detection rates improve, she said, it's important that human drivers "have the correct mental model of the car, complete with its shortcomings."...

http://fortune.com/2017/05/29/tesla-danger-cyclists/
no condition is permanent

finman100
Posts: 259
Joined: Thu Sep 20, 2012 10:42 am
Delivery Date: 06 Jun 2014
Location: Albany, OR

Re: Tesla's autopilot, on the road

Thu Jun 01, 2017 3:08 pm

thanks for the info. I've now increased my Model 3 reservations to 2.
Albany, Oregon
2014 Silver SV with charge/LED package. June 2014, I'm in the EV game!
30,200 miles
19.1 kWh on 100% charge (56ish Ah)
4.2 miles/kWh average
Best trip: all of 'em. They're all no-gas!

GRA
Posts: 6970
Joined: Mon Sep 19, 2011 1:49 pm
Location: East side of San Francisco Bay

Re: Tesla's autopilot, on the road

Mon Jun 05, 2017 5:57 pm

See the post here re AAA raising Tesla's rates by ca. 30%:http://www.mynissanleaf.com/viewtopic.php?f=10&t=20321&start=440#p496390

and earlier posts in this thread from March re self-insurance: http://www.mynissanleaf.com/viewtopic.php?f=12&t=22213&start=200#p487232
Guy [I have lots of experience designing/selling off-grid AE systems, some using EVs but don't own one. Local trips are by foot, bike and/or rapid transit].

The 'best' is the enemy of 'good enough'. Copper shot, not Silver bullets.

GRA
Posts: 6970
Joined: Mon Sep 19, 2011 1:49 pm
Location: East side of San Francisco Bay

Re: Tesla's autopilot, on the road

Tue Jun 20, 2017 5:39 pm

GRA wrote:BTW, we still haven't seen the NTSB's report on the causes of the accident, which is separate from the NHTSA's investigation. Unlike NHTSA, NTSB doesn't have any regulatory or enforcement authority, all they can do is make recommendations. They tend to be much more willing to point out safety problems than NHTSA or FAA, for that reason. Unfortunately, it also means that many of their recommendations get delayed or ignored for years, because (especially in the case of airliners), it costs a lot of money to retrofit an entire fleet, so the airlines usually lobby to delay or defeat such mandates.

NTSB has now opened their docket on the crash, so we're getting closer. From USA Today:
A driver killed in an accident that attracted nationwide attention while using Tesla's partially self-driving car ignored repeated warnings to put his hands on the wheel, federal investigators say in a report released Tuesday.

The 538-page report from the National Highway Traffic Safety Administration reveals fresh details about what is believed to be the first deadly crash in which an American driver was relying on self-driving technology to steer, accelerate and brake the vehicle.

The agency, which opened an investigation to explore the possibility that Tesla's Autopilot system was faulty, said it had drawn "no conclusions about how or why the crash occurred. . . ."

Jack Landskroner, a lawyer for Brown's family, said the NTSB report confirms that "baseless rumors reported in the media that Joshua was watching a Harry Potter video at the time of this horrible crash are unequivocally false."

"There was no video playing and no evidence that any electronics were in use at the time of this accident, other than his car’s operational technology," Landskroner said in an email. "We look forward to receiving the Board’s finding and recommendations related to the crash which we anticipate will be published at a later date."

Landskroner did not say whether the family would pursue any legal action against Tesla but added that he anticipates NTSB will deliver additional information at a later date.

NHTSA said in January that the driver should have seen the truck "at least" seven seconds before the collision, calling it a "period of extended distraction" and that he "took no braking, steering or other actions. . . ."

The driver used the vehicle's self-driving system for 37.5 minutes of the 41 minutes of his trip, according to the NTSB. During the time the self-driving system was activated, he had his hands on the wheel for a total of only about half a minute, investigators concluded.

Tesla has long insisted that drivers must keep their hands at the wheel, ready to take over at any time. The company, which declined to comment, has previously defended its system. But software upgrades since the accident would likely have prevented it, CEO Elon Musk has said.

NTSB said the driver received seven visual warnings on the instrument panel, which blared "Hold Steering Wheel," followed by six audible warnings. Although most attention in the crash has focused on Tesla and Brown, NTSB also quoted a witness to the crash as saying that the truck driver had sufficient time to avoid the collision. . . .
https://www.usatoday.com/story/money/ca ... 411516001/

The NTSB press release: https://www.ntsb.gov/news/press-releases/Pages/PR20170619.aspx
. . . The docket includes reports that cover various aspects of the investigation, including highway design, vehicle performance, human performance, and motor carrier factors. The crash reconstruction report, also included in the docket, provides a description of the crash sequence. The docket also includes interview transcripts and summaries, photographs, and other investigative material.

The docket contains only factual information collected by NTSB investigators; it does not provide analysis, findings, recommendations, or probable cause determinations. No conclusions about how or why the crash occurred should be drawn from the docket. Analysis, findings, recommendations, and probable cause determinations related to the crash will be issued by the Board at a later date. . . .

Direct link to docket: https://dms.ntsb.gov/pubdms/search/hitlist.cfm?docketID=59989&CFID=1126988&CFTOKEN=b1b9a5b7e849bb32-88C471C8-01C8-077F-A22C23E2E219927F

Reading it now (just finished with the injuries report, which is about what you'd expect in this situation, if not quite what was widely assumed. Although the injuries are described dispassionately in medical terms, if you're at all squeamish it's best to skip that section).
Last edited by GRA on Thu Jun 22, 2017 12:57 pm, edited 1 time in total.
Guy [I have lots of experience designing/selling off-grid AE systems, some using EVs but don't own one. Local trips are by foot, bike and/or rapid transit].

The 'best' is the enemy of 'good enough'. Copper shot, not Silver bullets.

edatoakrun
Posts: 4329
Joined: Thu Nov 11, 2010 9:33 am
Delivery Date: 15 May 2011
Leaf Number: 2184
Location: Shasta County, North California

Re: Tesla's autopilot, on the road

Wed Jun 21, 2017 10:06 am

Tesla Shakes Up Its Automated Driving Team For The Second Time In 6 Months

Just days after Elon Musk tweeted about upgrades in semi-autonomous driving features for Tesla electric vehicles, the head of its Autopilot development efforts has been replaced, the second shakeup of that team in less than six months. The company also tapped an artificial intelligence expert Musk has worked with on an unrelated project to lead its autonomous vehicle technology push.

Chris Lattner had just joined Tesla in January, coming from Apple, to become its vice president of Autopilot software and head up the engineering group working on that feature. He confirmed his departure in a tweet late Tuesday.

“Turns out that Tesla isn't a good fit for me after all,” he said...

In January, Tesla had praised "Chris’s reputation for engineering excellence...." He joined the electric-car maker after spending 11 years at Apple.

Musk wants Tesla to be among the first companies to sell fully self-driving vehicles, and plans to keep adding ever greater functionality via wireless software updates over the next couple of years. As a CEO, he's also famously impatient and changes in Tesla's management team have become a frequent occurrence over the past decade...

https://www.forbes.com/sites/alanohnsma ... d940754239
no condition is permanent

GRA
Posts: 6970
Joined: Mon Sep 19, 2011 1:49 pm
Location: East side of San Francisco Bay

Re: Tesla's autopilot, on the road

Tue Jun 27, 2017 7:37 pm

Via IEVS:
Tesla Autopilot Versus Bicyclist – Video
http://insideevs.com/tesla-autopilot-ve ... ist-video/
Guy [I have lots of experience designing/selling off-grid AE systems, some using EVs but don't own one. Local trips are by foot, bike and/or rapid transit].

The 'best' is the enemy of 'good enough'. Copper shot, not Silver bullets.

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