SageBrush
Posts: 414
Joined: Sun Mar 06, 2011 2:28 am
Delivery Date: 13 Feb 2017
Location: Colorado

Re: Trumpists begin their attack on America's EV policies.

Mon Mar 06, 2017 9:44 pm

alozzy wrote:And yet, so many Vancouver residents are convinced that an EV can't meet their needs. I'm still hopeful that there is a rising tide though...
If they are right, a plug-in would be a fantastic upgrade. E.g. your 80 miles in a day would be covered by 5.5 kWh of electricity and one gallon of liquid fuel in a Prius Prime, and they would have all the flexibility and range they think they require.

Honestly though, it is pretty easy to improve on a 20 mpg SUV with current ICE offerings.
2013 Model 'S' with QC & rear-view camera
Bought off-lease Jan 2017 from N. California with 63.9 Ahr after 22k miles
Car is now enjoying an easy life in Colorado

alozzy
Posts: 121
Joined: Fri Jan 20, 2017 4:25 pm
Delivery Date: 18 Jan 2017

Re: Trumpists begin their attack on America's EV policies.

Mon Mar 06, 2017 11:02 pm

I would guess that at least half the population of Vancouver could meet their daily commute needs with a pure BEV.

Honestly though, it is pretty easy to improve on a 20 mpg SUV with current ICE offerings.


Yes, which is why I no longer drive the Santa Fe and will be selling it in the Spring ;)

To your point about easily improving on 20 mpg, totally agree! Yet, there are millions of people driving older SUVs (which get crappy mileage and pollute like crazy) who choose to continue to drive them because EVs scare them. I've had countless conversations with people who, when I talk about EVs, politely nod and then roll their eyes as soon as one mentions either range or charging time. It's that mind set that's holding back mass adoption of HPEVs, BEVs, etc - not political will or lack thereof.

FYI: I would have gladly purchased a Leaf 3 years ago, if I could have afforded one. But it was only this year that I was able to get a used Leaf in my price range and I'm so glad I did. Hopefully there's a good chunk of the population that's been doing the same thing and this year is the year they make the leap.
Canadian with a US 2013 Ocean Blue SV + QC, purchased 01/2017 in WA
Zencar 12/20/24/30A L1/L2 portable EVSE
1-1/4" Curt #11396 hitch
After market, DIY LED DRLs
LeafSpy Pro + Konnwei KW902 ELM327 BT OBDII dongle
Big grin, enjoying my first BEV :D

mxp
Posts: 709
Joined: Fri Apr 23, 2010 9:32 pm
Delivery Date: 26 Jun 2015
Location: Fremont, CA

Re: Trumpists begin their attack on America's EV policies.

Mon Mar 06, 2017 11:17 pm

No surprise.

Sadly, Trump's collecting his in-direct tax money in a big way, and getting rid of true visionaries like Elon Musk.

1. Approve the Dakota Access pipeline
2. Kill EV policies - oil industry/gasoline has lots of "in-direct" taxes for Trump
3. By stifling the EV momentum, he gets to kick Elon in the gut.

... and you can see how this ends for America. :-(

GetOffYourGas
Posts: 1298
Joined: Tue Dec 20, 2011 6:56 pm
Delivery Date: 09 Mar 2012
Location: Syracuse, NY

Re: Trumpists begin their attack on America's EV policies.

Tue Mar 07, 2017 8:57 am

alozzy wrote:
FYI: I would have gladly purchased a Leaf 3 years ago, if I could have afforded one. But it was only this year that I was able to get a used Leaf in my price range and I'm so glad I did. Hopefully there's a good chunk of the population that's been doing the same thing and this year is the year they make the leap.


It may not be about political will, but those politics directly affect the affordability of EVs. If the tax credit goes away, EVs become more expensive. Then people will be even less able to afford them, new or used.
~Brian

EV Fleet:
2011 Torqeedo Travel 1003 electric outboard on a 22' sailboat
2012 Leaf SV
2015 C-Max Energi (302A package)

alozzy
Posts: 121
Joined: Fri Jan 20, 2017 4:25 pm
Delivery Date: 18 Jan 2017

Re: Trumpists begin their attack on America's EV policies.

Tue Mar 07, 2017 9:37 am

Didn't realize you get a federal tax credit for used EVs, sorry. You're lucky, we don't have any credits for used EVs. I can see how that tips the scales in favor of ICE vehicles somewhat. For me, at 1/10th the cost for electricity vs gas, it's compelling without credits - but we have a carbon tax too.
Canadian with a US 2013 Ocean Blue SV + QC, purchased 01/2017 in WA
Zencar 12/20/24/30A L1/L2 portable EVSE
1-1/4" Curt #11396 hitch
After market, DIY LED DRLs
LeafSpy Pro + Konnwei KW902 ELM327 BT OBDII dongle
Big grin, enjoying my first BEV :D

WetEV
Posts: 1640
Joined: Fri May 04, 2012 8:25 am
Delivery Date: 16 Feb 2014
Location: Near Seattle, WA

Re: Trumpists begin their attack on America's EV policies.

Tue Mar 07, 2017 9:51 am

edatoakrun wrote:The long-expected offensive against BEVs now opens, in the ongoing republican war on reason.


So? Ice doesn't care.

Image

Will we have a Blue Water North Pole this summer?
WetEV
#49
Most everything around here is wet during the rainy season. And the rainy season is long.
2012 Leaf SL Red (Totaled)
2014 Leaf SL Red

GetOffYourGas
Posts: 1298
Joined: Tue Dec 20, 2011 6:56 pm
Delivery Date: 09 Mar 2012
Location: Syracuse, NY

Re: Trumpists begin their attack on America's EV policies.

Tue Mar 07, 2017 10:49 am

alozzy wrote:Didn't realize you get a federal tax credit for used EVs, sorry. You're lucky, we don't have any credits for used EVs. I can see how that tips the scales in favor of ICE vehicles somewhat. For me, at 1/10th the cost for electricity vs gas, it's compelling without credits - but we have a carbon tax too.

I think you misunderstood me. The federal tax credit does not apply to used cars. The only exception I know of is (was?) the CO state credit which applies to any car (new or used) that has not yet been registered in the state. (someone from CO, feel free to correct me if I'm wrong here).

The effect of the tax credit on used prices is indirect. If a new Leaf can be purchased for ~$20k (which it can today, in many states), how much would a 3-year old car be worth? Probably at most half that.

If those incentives go away, that same Leaf would cost $30k new. So the used Leafs would presumably jump in value as well.
~Brian

EV Fleet:
2011 Torqeedo Travel 1003 electric outboard on a 22' sailboat
2012 Leaf SV
2015 C-Max Energi (302A package)

soldcake
Posts: 26
Joined: Mon Jun 20, 2016 3:47 am
Delivery Date: 19 Jun 2016
Leaf Number: 311414

Re: Trumpists begin their attack on America's EV policies.

Tue Mar 07, 2017 10:55 am

Infra-structure. Infra-structure.

Let yelp more on places with EV charger. Make it a trendy thing. Boo on places without charger. Make it big on social media.
As a daily driver , L2 charger everywhere I go shopping, eating, etc is just working. I can plug in, go eat, come back an hour later. L3 is not much good for that usage. L3 is good for "emergency charging", may be long trip. For long trip, i will drive my prius. Guess what, i do NOT have charger at my apartment. But I am driving a EV. It can work.

The government cannot stop i-phone, or online shopping. The population just move on. The industry will follow.

Automotive companies will lobby for barriers for imported EVs, like what they did to Tesla. They do what they do. We do what we do. Nothing personal...

Vision:
- hey, you smart, old and young, give us that invention on fuel cell, that can be recharged at home 99% efficient.
- hey, you businessman, built a national wide low cost used EV lease business, that the HUGE low income market can be reached. (Their cars are usually not in good emission shape....)

my 2 cents.
Feb-2017 4442mi 73.9Ahr 93%SOH 88.6%Hx
Nov-2016 2998mi 73.0Ahr 91%SOH 87%Hx
Sep-2016 1050mi 74.3Ahr 93%SOH 89%Hx
2016 Leaf White SV + no premium package :roll:

rmay635703
Posts: 262
Joined: Wed Jan 19, 2011 7:43 pm

Re: Trumpists begin their attack on America's EV policies.

Tue Mar 07, 2017 11:26 am

I wonder what the VW settlement money will end up going for?

Was supposed to build a nationwide quick charge network, maybe VW diesels will come back?

edatoakrun
Posts: 4175
Joined: Thu Nov 11, 2010 9:33 am
Delivery Date: 15 May 2011
Leaf Number: 2184
Location: Shasta County, North California

Re: Trumpists begin their attack on America's EV policies.

Wed Mar 08, 2017 12:22 pm

Legal battlefield:

Want to Gut Emission Rules? Prepare for War With California

IN ITS ONGOING jihad against federal regulations, the Trump administration has indicated some interest in targeting the ones that attempt to fight climate change. First in its sights: a funky law that gives the state of California the right to make its own rules on automotive emissions. But because of the way laws and business work, the California exemption is one of the most powerful environmental tools in the world.

So California’s not going down without a fight.

A quick history lesson: When legislators wrote the 1963 Clean Air Act, they acknowledged that California already had pollution-fighting rules, and that its environmental situation was especially dire. So they gave the state the right to write its own, stricter standards.

“It’s hard to overstate how important the ability for California to set its standards has been to public health and clean air over the past 40 years,” says Don Anair, deputy director for the clean vehicles program at the Union of Concerned Scientists. “Time and again, California’s been willing and able to move forward.”...

Good news for environmental cheerleaders: Stripping California of its special status would require a change to the Clean Air Act—the kind of legislating a Democratic filibuster could derail.

But, you say, the EPA doesn’t have to kill the waiver process if it just refuses to issue any new ones. It might even have the legal right to rescind already granted waivers. But California can fight back—and it’s got a stocked arsenal.

“The statute is very clear. It says EPA shall grant the waiver,” says Cara Horowitz, co-executive director of the Emmett Institute on Climate Change and the Environment at UCLA School of Law. The EPA can only hit the reject button if it can prove a requested rule is weaker than the federal standards, isn’t consistent with the Clean Air Act, or “does not need such standards to meet compelling and extraordinary conditions.” Through the 1990s, Los Angeles smog conditions were severe enough to cancel after-school sports and flood emergency rooms—compelling and extraordinary. Today, the motivating threat is climate change...

What if Trump does start rolling back standards? “We’ll see them in court,” says Roland Hwang, director of the National Resources Defense Council’s energy and transportation program...

https://www.wired.com/2017/03/want-gut- ... alifornia/
no condition is permanent

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