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garygid
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Re: Will dealers be allowed to gouge us?

Fri May 28, 2010 5:42 pm

It would be very bad PR for Nissan or a dealer to "play hardball", and they have little to gain.
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sjfotos
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Re: Will dealers be allowed to gouge us?

Fri May 28, 2010 6:56 pm

Nissan has been very clever in the order process. I can't recall a similar process at any time in the past. They are assigning the allotment to the CUSTOMER, not the dealer. Pure genius. So, if you have the alloted care for delivery in your area, you can shop around the local Nissan dealers with your 'chit'. The purchase contract will be with the dealer, but you have the control because you can take your purchase to any local dealer. Amazing really.

As far the reservation 'back-out', we do not know, but I am guessing that they will allow you to back out at any time prior to delivery. This is going to be a constrained commodity for many, many months.
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DaveinOlyWA
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Re: Will dealers be allowed to gouge us?

Fri May 28, 2010 8:25 pm

sjfotos wrote:Nissan has been very clever in the order process. I can't recall a similar process at any time in the past. They are assigning the allotment to the CUSTOMER, not the dealer. Pure genius. So, if you have the alloted care for delivery in your area, you can shop around the local Nissan dealers with your 'chit'. The purchase contract will be with the dealer, but you have the control because you can take your purchase to any local dealer. Amazing really.

As far the reservation 'back-out', we do not know, but I am guessing that they will allow you to back out at any time prior to delivery. This is going to be a constrained commodity for many, many months.



Toyota did the exact same thing with the 2010 Prius. i was given 3 package options at the "Reveal" in Jan 2009. in Feb . i selected my package and my dealer at that time. then on May 1st i was advised of how much my package would cost and it was offered at a very nice discount. add to that the WA State sales tax waiver; it became a very tough deal to pass up. so i spent the money i had set aside for an EV (at the time, there was nothing on the horizon including the Leaf or anything else for that matter except the Tesla which was out of my price range) 10 days later, my dealer called to tell me my car was in port and to come in for paperwork and at this time, i was given the final out the door price.

when i went to pick it up there was about 10 salesmen hovering around the car looking it over. it was the first one sold in WA state and they wanted to get a look at it as their first regular shipment of 2010's would not arrive for another 2 weeks.
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Re: Will dealers be allowed to gouge us?

Fri May 28, 2010 8:31 pm

daniel wrote:Not necessarily. We do not know if the August reservation process will involve signing the contract. And regardless of speculation above, we do not know what will happen if a buyer refuses delivery. Maybe the dealer gets to keep the car; maybe Nissan keeps the car. We simply do not know. We do not know if any dealers will agree to a test-drive back-out clause. We don't even know if Nissan will permit dealers to accept such a clause. Dealers get to set the price (subject to negotiation with buyers) but is the purchase contract with the dealer or with Nissan? We do not know.

It's all speculation, and speculation is pointless and futile.


This is what they told me in online chat

Federal law forbids manufacturers from interfering with dealer-consumer contract pricing. However, dealers will only receive vehicle allocations for those customers who have agreed on sales terms with the dealer. You will have a list of dealers with which to request a quote.


Sounds reasonably clear that during the reserved phase, a dealer doesn't get a Leaf until a customer signs a contract (with the dealer). That gives reserved buyers some decent bargaining power. And I think it would be pretty bad PR to try to gouge at this stage. With the Federal and State tax incentives meant to encourage adoption, it would seem as if the dealers were trying to pocket that incentive for themselves. Not worth the firestorm of protests that would result with both the consumer and govt, imho.
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planet4ever
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Re: Will dealers be allowed to gouge us?

Sat May 29, 2010 1:48 am

sjfotos wrote:As far the reservation 'back-out', we do not know, but I am guessing that they will allow you to back out at any time prior to delivery. This is going to be a constrained commodity for many, many months.

However, if you are planning to lease, the fine print on the Nissan website does say there is a $595 non-refundable acquisition fee. Presumably you will have to pay that (less $99) when you sign the lease application. Backing out after that will definitely cost you unless they decide you are not qualified. (And yes, this is on top of the $1999 + tax & license.)
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Re: Will dealers be allowed to gouge us?

Sat May 29, 2010 5:58 am

planet4ever wrote:Presumably you will have to pay that (less $99)


Are you talking about the $99 reservation fee? I didn't think that was applicable to the purchase price, and was simply the cost of getting in line? I mean, it would be awesome if it were, but I had already kissed that Benjamin "goodbye".
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Re: Will dealers be allowed to gouge us?

Sat May 29, 2010 7:22 am

mwalsh wrote:
planet4ever wrote:Presumably you will have to pay that (less $99)


Are you talking about the $99 reservation fee? I didn't think that was applicable to the purchase price, and was simply the cost of getting in line? I mean, it would be awesome if it were, but I had already kissed that Benjamin "goodbye".

Since the $99 is refundable at any time, I'd say it's clear that if you buy the car the $99 will be credited towards your purchase price.

What we do not know are what terms we'll have to agree to in order to place a firm order in August. We may have to place a further deposit at that time (I'd actually expect we will) and we do not yet know if that deposit will be refundable. There are good arguments both ways: The car will be in such demand that they can sell it easily if we walk away; but if you make a commitment and they build a car to your specs, they have a right to charge you a "restocking" fee, on the grounds that the next buyer might not want your exact configuration choice.

Right now it costs nothing to stand in line, since the $99 is refundable. At some point they may want to winnow out the people who do not actually intend to buy the car, by requiring some form of binding commitment.

We do not know what will be the case.

I will speculate (yes, speculation here) that in June they will tell us how it will work, what back-out rights we do or do not have, what sort of deposit will be required at time of ordering, whether it's refundable or not, maybe even whether we'll have a chance to test-drive before making a binding commitment, etc.
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sjfotos
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Re: Will dealers be allowed to gouge us?

Sat May 29, 2010 8:15 am

DaveinOlyWA wrote:
sjfotos wrote:Nissan has been very clever in the order process. I can't recall a similar process at any time in the past. They are assigning the allotment to the CUSTOMER, not the dealer. Pure genius. So, if you have the alloted care for delivery in your area, you can shop around the local Nissan dealers with your 'chit'. The purchase contract will be with the dealer, but you have the control because you can take your purchase to any local dealer. Amazing really.

As far the reservation 'back-out', we do not know, but I am guessing that they will allow you to back out at any time prior to delivery. This is going to be a constrained commodity for many, many months.



Toyota did the exact same thing with the 2010 Prius. i was given 3 package options at the "Reveal" in Jan 2009. in Feb . i selected my package and my dealer at that time. then on May 1st i was advised of how much my package would cost and it was offered at a very nice discount. add to that the WA State sales tax waiver; it became a very tough deal to pass up. so i spent the money i had set aside for an EV (at the time, there was nothing on the horizon including the Leaf or anything else for that matter except the Tesla which was out of my price range) 10 days later, my dealer called to tell me my car was in port and to come in for paperwork and at this time, i was given the final out the door price.

when i went to pick it up there was about 10 salesmen hovering around the car looking it over. it was the first one sold in WA state and they wanted to get a look at it as their first regular shipment of 2010's would not arrive for another 2 weeks.



Most excellent! I thought they had had a few dealers charging premiums at some point, looks like I was wrong, or they corrected it. In either case, well done.
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garygid
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Re: Will dealers be allowed to gouge us?

Sat May 29, 2010 9:04 am

A dealer here in CA was telling me that all purchase deposits are completely refundable by CA law until you "take delivery", which is driving the car off the lot into the street.

He did not address the lease payment, or how one might get a test drive. But, that did allow one to see it, sit in it, and even drive it ON the lot. NOT out one dealer driveway and immediately back in the next dealer driveway.

On my next visit, I will ask how test drives might be accomodated.

Maybe something as simple as "they" have to drive it off the lot, and then you can be allowed to drive?
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hill
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Re: Will dealers be allowed to gouge us?

Thu Jun 03, 2010 11:40 am

Jimmydreams wrote:
garygid wrote:So, you think that getting my dealer to submit finished paperwork in the first few minutes of being "allowed" to do so ... will mean nothing to get me an early LEAF, if I am late in the Reservation line?

And, being slow to "deal" will not jepordize an early Reservation's chances of getting one of the earliest LEAFs?

Presumably an out-of-first-area Reservation will have to wait for in-area deliveries.

To get one of the first 200 LEAFs in CA, assuming one has an "early" CA Reservation, what "actions" do you think will be "required"?


Gary...

. . . . . . . snip

To get one of the first 200 Leafs, (assuming LA or OC gets 100 of them) then you'd need to already be in the first 100 in OC or LA on the reservation list. If you're #101 in LA and LA only has 100 cars, it remains to be seen if you'll be able to come to San Diego (for example) to buy. I would think that whatever area you're in will dictate what happens. Even though LA and SD are close, they may be treated differently and no 'cross-area buys' allowed. We don't know.

At least, that's my understanding of the process.


Sadly, I haven't seen anywhere in writing that whomever signed up first (in any given county), is necessarily going to be 1st in line. That should be even more evident, when considering our $99 came with no 'place-in-line' number.

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