EcoCarRental
Posts: 49
Joined: Thu Sep 08, 2011 10:22 pm
Delivery Date: 09 Sep 2011
Leaf Number: 7087
Location: Maui, Hawaii
Contact: Website

Re: Maui, Hawaii

Wed Dec 12, 2012 9:13 pm

Reddy wrote:
EcoCarRental wrote:
Becky50 wrote:We stayed in Lahaina for week in early November and saw only one LEAF. It was driving between Lahaina and Kaanapali on a Sunday afternoon. It was white. Next time we will rent from Shaun instead of Hertz. Hopefully, we will be returning in the fall.

The local dealer has been bringing in lots of Leafs in the past several months and I wouldn't be surprised if there were close to 100 Leafs on Maui. The recent great lease rates are the big reason for that. Hopefully we'll see you in the fall.

Shaun
I saw several throughout my trip, including another red one at the Kahana Center charging station. I spoke with one owner who indicated at least 110 had been sold on Maui. Interestingly, most people I talked to were not super "EV literate" and I always tried to direct them to this forum for more info. Almost everyone at the DCQC was charging to 100% (even though that last 10-20% overheats the battery and is relatively slow). I think this is just the newbie effect since I never felt the need to charge past 80% at the DCQC even without having overnight charging at the condo.

Reddy

The last time I charged at the DCQC there was another Leaf charging, I noticed that the charger said he was only at 1.4 kw on his charge and when I went to ask how long he thought he might have left he said he was almost done since the charger showed that he was at 97%, so what he did was charge until the unit automatically shut off (it's set to give a 80% charge) and then plug it back in again to get to 100%. It will definitely be nice when we have more DCQC's.

Shaun
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EcoCarRental
Posts: 49
Joined: Thu Sep 08, 2011 10:22 pm
Delivery Date: 09 Sep 2011
Leaf Number: 7087
Location: Maui, Hawaii
Contact: Website

Re: Maui, Hawaii

Wed Dec 12, 2012 9:57 pm

Caracalover wrote:
I drove our Leaf to Haleakala to see how far it would get and I made it to the park entrance, which is 11 miles from the top, with 2 bars remaining & 8 miles on the guessometer. There are plans to install a DC QC near the park entrance which will allow 100% electrics to get all the way to the top.

Shaun
Aloha

Love your state, if I ever get back I will rent a Leaf, without a doubt.

After all that uphill the 8 mile range was likley not at all accurate. Have to wonder if you drove up at a speed over 35mph. I have done a lot of mountain driving and with two bars you still have a lot (LBW is at 17% or so) of the usable battery left, so 11 miles should be doable, although i don't recall how much elevation gain is past the park entrance. Perhaps try it again and turn around if you hit the LBW, and don't think you will make it. I have seen low numbers with half a battery when doing 55 up the mountain near me.

I think a QC at that location might be overkill, since once you are there you will use little to get to the top, and then you will be gaining energy all the way down. Many could end up well over 80% at the bottom. The closer to a full charge you have forces the use of actual brakes, which would not be good for that much downhill. It seems like it could be a bad plan, since there is no downshifting if you have a full battery. Not sure if you can alter the plan, but several L2 plugs would be a far better use of resources, or put the QC closer to the bottom.

Do you recall how much energy you gained on the way down? At least a bar or two?


The last time we drove it up Haleakala (2 people in the car) we stopped at the park entrance and charged it overnight at the ranger station (~7000 feet elev.) on level I - this was part of a demonstration requested by one of the park personnel, and we donated our car for the test. The next day, with a 100% charge, the park personnel drove the remaining 11 miles to the top, which used 36% of the battery, so we really do need a DCQC at the park entrance, especially since the average stay at the park entrance location is only ~12-20 minutes. L2 charging would simply take way too long. Continuing down from the top (10,000 feet) with a 64% charge they drove it to our office in Kahului (sea level) and the battery got back to 92%. Going from our office up Haleakala the first 8 miles is highway driving. I plan on driving up there again to see how far it will go before I have to turn around.

One of my neighbors drove his Leaf from his house to the summit of Haleakala on one charge, and it was a close call - here's a google map of that route http://goo.gl/maps/MbG2L. Here's a video he took of his drive http://vimeo.com/47432693. The route from our office is ~7 miles longer, and here's the google map of that route http://goo.gl/maps/xqDhO.

Shaun
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TurboFroggy
Posts: 107
Joined: Sat Jan 01, 2011 10:41 pm
Delivery Date: 21 Jun 2011
Leaf Number: 2398
Location: Everett, WA
Contact: Website

Re: Maui, Hawaii

Wed Dec 12, 2012 10:47 pm

Boomer23 wrote:When I was there 14 months ago, that dealer had a $5,000 "Added Markup" sticker on most of his new cars on the lot, including the one LEAF that was there and for sale. If that's still the case, small wonder that they're not moving.


Anyone watching this thread from Maui and thinking of buying a Leaf, DO NOT PAY THIS ADDITIONAL MARKUP!
Here is a good bargaining chip: You can have a Leaf shipped to Maui for $1,072 from Matson shipping:
http://www.matson.com/pov/booking/shipping_rates.htm
I would not pay over MSRP as the normal destination fee should cover this shipping cost.
If the dealer won't give it to you MSRP or lower + normal destination fee, let them know you can have a Leaf shipped there for less, I am sure they will bargain with you. There are LOTS of dealers in California that could arrange the sale/shipping of a new Leaf enough under MSRP to cover the shipping.

Also +1 for the Biobeetle, we rented it when we were visiting Maui a few years ago. It was wonderful, just like our biodiesel powered Beetle we had waiting for us at home. Good to know that we can rent a Leaf now from the same cool BioBeetle company!
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Caracalover
Posts: 560
Joined: Sat Jun 04, 2011 10:47 pm
Delivery Date: 12 Mar 2011
Leaf Number: 0567
Location: Tujunga
Contact: Website

Re: Maui, Hawaii

Wed Dec 12, 2012 10:54 pm

It is easy to see how someone could use 36% of the battery on a grade like that, especially if they enjoyed the torque. The trouble is on the way down, they may have overcharged the battery, and used 8% to get to your office on the highway. It is likely they had to use the actual brakes, so I still disagree on the need for a QC, unless it has a very large sign to warn people not to charge over 50%. Adding 4 bars on the descent to 1300 feet, I have to wonder if he was trying to regen as much as possible, or just coasting at speed. I could see people that don't understand the car using the QC on the way back down, and that would not be good for the battery or the brakes. Keep in mind what you called a close call still did not get to the LBW, which means he had at least 15% of the battery left for A/C, radio, or even a little defrost. I will grant you that most people will not drive that slow, so this is one energy draining route, that is for sure, but it should be doable with a new battery.

Keep in mind as you get closer to 80% charge you get less regen, especially at higher speeds, so I find it very likely that the park person had to use the brake pads. At that elevation a 100% charge is a mistake, just in case you have to go down, instead of up in the morning. Nissan really didn't think that part through when they only gave us the two options of 80% and 100%. A 50% charge would have likley gotten the ranger back to you with an 80% charge. I would worry if they had gone down that grade using only the brakes to slow the car.
26,000 miles on Silver Leaf
wildcatzoo.org drive there on Sunday across a big mountain, sorry no public charging at this time.
Looking for grants to put in solar port so perhaps in the future...

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Electric4Me
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Delivery Date: 04 Aug 2011
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Re: Maui, Hawaii

Thu Dec 13, 2012 9:36 am

Caracalover wrote:It is likely they had to use the actual brakes, so I still disagree on the need for a QC, unless it has a very large sign to warn people not to charge over 50%.

I think the QC is entirely appropriate as there's no need to sit there at L2 speeds. 40-50% stopping point is also likely ideal as you suggest.

If I remember the drive correctly, I would think that you could climb all the way to VLB or even Turtle, and then turn around if needed, coasting/regening all the way back down. I will definitely bring my WattsLeft meter along with me *when* I rent from Shaun in the future.
Bill Davis
2011 Cayenne Red SL
2014 Toyota RAV4 EV
6.4 kW PV system
Leaf Quick Release Hitch for bikes/cargo
Fun in the Leaf! (video)

EcoCarRental
Posts: 49
Joined: Thu Sep 08, 2011 10:22 pm
Delivery Date: 09 Sep 2011
Leaf Number: 7087
Location: Maui, Hawaii
Contact: Website

Re: Maui, Hawaii

Thu Dec 13, 2012 11:47 am

I think most people who will use a DCQC at the park entrance will not charge to 100% anyway since it would take longer then they would be willing to wait, and there's no need for it. If you charge to 80%, then use 36% for the last 11 miles you would be at 44% at the top of Haleakala, and gaining 28% thru regen coming back down would put you at 72% in Kahului. Also, most people will be driving from the West Side (Lahaina, Kaanapali), Maalaea or Kihei, so we don't know what their state of charge will be when they get to the park entrance. Can't wait for the additional DCQC's.

Shaun
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Caracalover
Posts: 560
Joined: Sat Jun 04, 2011 10:47 pm
Delivery Date: 12 Mar 2011
Leaf Number: 0567
Location: Tujunga
Contact: Website

Re: Maui, Hawaii

Thu Dec 13, 2012 4:46 pm

EcoCarRental wrote:I think most people who will use a DCQC at the park entrance will not charge to 100% anyway since it would take longer then they would be willing to wait, and there's no need for it. If you charge to 80%, then use 36% for the last 11 miles you would be at 44% at the top of Haleakala, and gaining 28% thru regen coming back down would put you at 72% in Kahului. Also, most people will be driving from the West Side (Lahaina, Kaanapali), Maalaea or Kihei, so we don't know what their state of charge will be when they get to the park entrance. Can't wait for the additional DCQC's.

Shaun

I have a trip already planned for 2013 (Africa) but I have been wanting to take my wife to Hawaii for a while now. Are there Leaf rentals on the other islands? I love Kauai, as well as Maui and Kona, so I would like to do a week on each. The big island will likely need to go ICE, but who knows if there are QC's all over.
26,000 miles on Silver Leaf
wildcatzoo.org drive there on Sunday across a big mountain, sorry no public charging at this time.
Looking for grants to put in solar port so perhaps in the future...

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Electric4Me
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Posts: 531
Joined: Tue Apr 20, 2010 7:25 pm
Delivery Date: 04 Aug 2011
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Location: Union City, CA

Re: Maui, Hawaii

Thu Dec 13, 2012 4:59 pm

Caracalover wrote:I have a trip already planned for 2013 (Africa) but I have been wanting to take my wife to Hawaii for a while now. Are there Leaf rentals on the other islands? I love Kauai, as well as Maui and Kona, so I would like to do a week on each. The big island will likely need to go ICE, but who knows if there are QC's all over.

I rented a Leaf on Oahu this past spring and it worked out well.

Bill
Bill Davis
2011 Cayenne Red SL
2014 Toyota RAV4 EV
6.4 kW PV system
Leaf Quick Release Hitch for bikes/cargo
Fun in the Leaf! (video)

Caracalover
Posts: 560
Joined: Sat Jun 04, 2011 10:47 pm
Delivery Date: 12 Mar 2011
Leaf Number: 0567
Location: Tujunga
Contact: Website

Re: Maui, Hawaii

Fri Dec 14, 2012 8:38 am

Electric4Me wrote:
Caracalover wrote:I have a trip already planned for 2013 (Africa) but I have been wanting to take my wife to Hawaii for a while now. Are there Leaf rentals on the other islands? I love Kauai, as well as Maui and Kona, so I would like to do a week on each. The big island will likely need to go ICE, but who knows if there are QC's all over.

I rented a Leaf on Oahu this past spring and it worked out well.

Bill

The last time I was on Oahu the rentals and parking rates were so high I think I saved money by taking tours, but good to know the Leaf is available there.
26,000 miles on Silver Leaf
wildcatzoo.org drive there on Sunday across a big mountain, sorry no public charging at this time.
Looking for grants to put in solar port so perhaps in the future...

User avatar
Electric4Me
Gold Member
Posts: 531
Joined: Tue Apr 20, 2010 7:25 pm
Delivery Date: 04 Aug 2011
Leaf Number: 772
Location: Union City, CA

Re: Maui, Hawaii

Fri Dec 14, 2012 10:47 am

Caracalover wrote:The last time I was on Oahu the rentals and parking rates were so high I think I saved money by taking tours, but good to know the Leaf is available there.

I rented the Leaf from the GreenCar car share company. The "daily" rate was on the high side, but I saved money overall because I really didn't need a car everyday, just to sit in the hotel's parking garage (at my own expense). It got me to re-think what I usually did which was to rent a car from the airport for every day until the end. Some trips that's exactly what you need, but it sure wasn't for me in this case. I just took a shuttle to/from the Honolulu hotel for ~$12 each way.
Bill Davis
2011 Cayenne Red SL
2014 Toyota RAV4 EV
6.4 kW PV system
Leaf Quick Release Hitch for bikes/cargo
Fun in the Leaf! (video)

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