matth
Posts: 81
Joined: Fri May 06, 2011 11:35 am
Delivery Date: 9- 0-2011
Location: Berkeley, CA

Re: New PG&E EV rate schedule

Wed Nov 20, 2013 9:46 pm

oakwcj wrote:
matth wrote:Everyone who is on E9-(A or B) should have an email from PG&E with a link that provides a summary of annual electric cost with the available rate schedules. It appears to be based on actual use for the last 13 months, and, as expected the new, exciting simple EV rate is by far the most expensive for me, roughly doubling my annual electric costs.

Here are my numbers, FYI

E-9A $268 (current)
EV $508
E-1 $466
E-6 $402

I'm not sure how fine-grained the PG&E analysis is. If it's based on hourly use, it's probably pretty good (and that's possible, since I have a smart meter), but if not, the news is probably worse, since the EV rate schedule makes it much harder to schedule off peak activities on weekends. Anyway, this will be part of my opposition to the elimination of E9. If this were a normal rate case, I'm sure the PUC could not stomach doubling the cost for any users, even if not all.


I haven't gotten such an email. When did you receive yours? I'd be especially interested, since I didn't have a SmartMeter until a few weeks ago. Unfortunately, the PUC has already decided that the grandfathering of E9 will end no later than December 31, 2014, and perhaps earlier, if the 2014 General Rate Case establishes a new EV schedule at an earlier date.


The one that actually worked came Monday of this week. The first one, with a link that did not work, came in some time last week. If you want to see how it looks, PM me with your email and I can forward the message that I got. Obviously it will reflect only my usage pattern.
White, SL/QC
Blink EVSE
Delivery estimate 8/2011
Actual delivery 9/17/11

jjlink
Posts: 19
Joined: Thu Aug 04, 2011 8:24 am
Delivery Date: 19 Jan 2012
Location: SF Bay Area, Calif

Re: New PG&E EV rate schedule

Fri Nov 22, 2013 2:41 pm

I ran the PG&E estimate of the new, exciting simple EV rate. It works out to about a 32% price increase. Exactly what I expect from PG&E and the PUC.

Correction: its 47% (not 32%).
Last edited by jjlink on Tue Nov 26, 2013 12:15 pm, edited 1 time in total.

matth
Posts: 81
Joined: Fri May 06, 2011 11:35 am
Delivery Date: 9- 0-2011
Location: Berkeley, CA

Re: New PG&E EV rate schedule

Mon Nov 25, 2013 11:02 pm

jjlink wrote:I ran the PG&E estimate of the new, exciting simple EV rate. It works out to about a 32% price increase. Exactly what I expect from PG&E and the PUC.


In considering what steps to take, be aware that the E-9 rate has not been adjusted for a number of years, AFIK. So to the extent you think PG&E's cost of generation and transmission have legitimately increased, there is a compound rate increase that even a fair proceeding would allow.

You'll also note that PG&E is beginning their general 2014 rate case, where they plan to greatly increase the rate for the lower tier users while increasing the higher tiers less (or none..I've not looked at the rate case yet). PG&E cloaks this in terms of fairness for the higher users, but neglects to point out that all users get the advantage of the rates in the lower tiers, while only the (more wasteful? less conservationist?) users in the high tiers pay the average rates combining the low tier and the highest tier they actually use. Note also that hot areas get a much higher base allotment, so the argument about the disadvantaged San Joaquin Valley is a little bit of a red herring.

Oh, and jjlink, how did the rates play out if you look at alternative rate structures, such as E-1 and E-6?
White, SL/QC
Blink EVSE
Delivery estimate 8/2011
Actual delivery 9/17/11

jjlink
Posts: 19
Joined: Thu Aug 04, 2011 8:24 am
Delivery Date: 19 Jan 2012
Location: SF Bay Area, Calif

Re: New PG&E EV rate schedule

Tue Nov 26, 2013 11:55 am

Actually its a bigger rate increase than I thought.


    Rate PG&E estimate

    E-9A . $ 641
    EV-A . $ 941 = 47% Rate Increase
    E-1 . $ 1,011 = 58% Rate Increase
    E-6 ... $ 904 = 41% Rate Increase

They might as well just get rid of the EV rate since it will cost me more.

Here is a photo of the estimate:
http://www.flickr.com/photos/18921934@N08/11071894754/

User avatar
planet4ever
Posts: 4674
Joined: Sat Apr 03, 2010 9:53 pm
Delivery Date: 02 May 2011
Leaf Number: 1537
Location: Morgan Hill, CA, south of San Jose

Re: New PG&E EV rate schedule

Tue Nov 26, 2013 2:02 pm

matth wrote:In considering what steps to take, be aware that the E-9 rate has not been adjusted for a number of years, AFIK.
Actually, the E-9 rate was last adjusted in May of this year. The summer rates for Tier 3 through 5 were increased by about 2% over the January 2013 increase. The winter rates for those tiers went up more than 3.5% in that four month period. All rates had already been increased in January 2013.

Ray
End of April 2013: Traded my 2011 SL for a 2013 S with charge pkg.

mxp
Posts: 709
Joined: Fri Apr 23, 2010 9:32 pm
Delivery Date: 26 Jun 2015
Location: Fremont, CA

Re: New PG&E EV rate schedule

Sat Nov 30, 2013 3:49 am

jjlink wrote:I ran the PG&E estimate of the new, exciting simple EV rate. It works out to about a 32% price increase. Exactly what I expect from PG&E and the PUC.

Correction: its 47% (not 32%).


Thanks for sharing the latest calculations...

Sadly, with the electricity cost increase, it makes justifying the Leaf versus the purchase of a comparable vehicle in a similar category less compelling. Plus, the EV driver have to accept some inconveniences and limitations (range, some comfort, charging infra etc etc)

Modern gasoline or diesel vehicles are getting more efficient. Why would anyone buy a Leaf (at the current price, plus increased electricity costs) when they can get into a similarly priced VW diesel or a comparable fuel efficient econo car?

User avatar
planet4ever
Posts: 4674
Joined: Sat Apr 03, 2010 9:53 pm
Delivery Date: 02 May 2011
Leaf Number: 1537
Location: Morgan Hill, CA, south of San Jose

Re: New PG&E EV rate schedule

Sat Nov 30, 2013 4:26 am

mxp wrote:Modern gasoline or diesel vehicles are getting more efficient. Why would anyone buy a Leaf (at the current price, plus increased electricity costs) when they can get into a similarly priced VW diesel or a comparable fuel efficient econo car?
I didn't buy a LEAF to save money. If I just wanted to save money I would never buy a new car of any kind.

I bought a LEAF because it doesn't burn gasoline. Because I can "fill it up" at home. Because it is silky quiet yet powerful. Because it is simple. Because ... so many reasons.

As for highway robbery by PG&E -- just foil them. Generate your own electricity.

Ray

P.S. Hmm, I see some parallels here: Electricity without burning oil, coal, or natural gas. Right on the roof of my own home. Silent and just as powerful as what they want to ship to me. Solar cells are such a simple concept.
End of April 2013: Traded my 2011 SL for a 2013 S with charge pkg.

srl99
Posts: 205
Joined: Thu Aug 16, 2012 7:04 am
Delivery Date: 16 Aug 2012

Re: New PG&E EV rate schedule

Sat Nov 30, 2013 5:44 am

You could move to Silicon Valley Power (10c/kWH all the time), SMUD, Alameda Power (etc.) territory are all closer to the "national average" of 12c/kWH. I'm curious what happens to solar buy-back rates w the 2014 GRC. It's quite a subsidy to be able to sell kWH at full retail (peak rates) and then buy back at your convenience (off peak).

foobert
Posts: 65
Joined: Mon Nov 07, 2011 12:34 pm
Delivery Date: 13 Nov 2011
Leaf Number: 15611
Location: San Jose, CA
Contact: Website

Re: New PG&E EV rate schedule

Tue Dec 03, 2013 6:42 pm

Has anyone noticed the fine-print in the EV schedule regarding "Standby reservation charges"?

The provisions of Schedule S—Standby Service Special Conditions 1 through 6 shall
also apply to customers whose premises are regularly supplied in part (but not in whole)
by electric energy from a nonutility source of supply. These customers will pay monthly
reservation charges as specified under Section 1 of Schedule S, in addition to all
applicable Schedule EV charges. See Special Condition 6 of this rate schedule for
exemptions to standby charges


Special conditions 5 & 6:
5. SOLAR GENERATION FACILITIES EXEMPTION: Customers who utilize solar
generating facilities which are less than or equal to one megawatt to serve load and
who do not sell power or make more than incidental export of power into PG&E’s
power grid and who have not elected service under Schedule NEM
{which is virtually no residential solar customer}, will be exempt from paying the
otherwise applicable standby reservation charges.

6. DISTRIBUTED ENERGY RESOURCES EXEMPTION: Any customer under a
time-of-use rate schedule using electric generation technology that meets the
criteria as defined in Electric Rule 1 for Distributed Energy Resources is exempt
from the otherwise applicable standby reservation charges. Customers qualifying
for this exemption shall be subject to the following requirements. Customers
qualifying for an exemption from standby charges under Public Utilities (PU) Code
Sections 353.1 and 353.3, as described above, must take service on a time-of-use
(TOU) schedule in order to receive this exemption until a real-time pricing program,
as described in PU Code 353.3, is made available. Once available, customers
qualifying for the standby charge exemption must participate in the real-time
program referred to above. Qualification for and receipt of this distributed energy
resources exemption does not exempt the customer from metering charges
applicable to time-of-use (TOU) and real-time pricing, or exempt the customer from
reasonable interconnection charges, non-bypassable charges as required in
Preliminary Statement BB - Competition Transition Charge Responsibility for All
Customers and CTC Procurement, or obligations determined by the Commission to
result from participation in the purchase of power through the California
Department of Water Resources, as provided in PU Code Section 353.7.



:?:
Firstly, what exactly is a "standby reservation charge"?

Can anyone translate special condition 6 into plain English?
Orphan lover: Red 2012 SL
Drink'n the Cool-Aid

User avatar
planet4ever
Posts: 4674
Joined: Sat Apr 03, 2010 9:53 pm
Delivery Date: 02 May 2011
Leaf Number: 1537
Location: Morgan Hill, CA, south of San Jose

Re: New PG&E EV rate schedule

Tue Dec 03, 2013 10:31 pm

foobert wrote:Firstly, what exactly is a "standby reservation charge"? Can anyone translate special condition 6 into plain English?
I believe a standby reservation is an agreement between a customer and the utility that the customer normally gets a large amount of power from elsewhere, but if that power is interrupted for some reason it has the right to suddenly start pulling it from the utility's lines. Naturally there is a monthly charge for that sort of agreement. As to condition 6, why worry? So long as your "other source" is less than a megawatt of solar panels you are exempt from the whole business.

Ray
End of April 2013: Traded my 2011 SL for a 2013 S with charge pkg.

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