Official California DWP Thread

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I have posted the following in the LA city group forum but will re-post here. I would like very much to hear about other people's experiences with LA DWP.

I am in LA City, specifically Leimert Park. I have already started dealing with the DWP in preparation for getting the EVSE installed in our single family home (outside garage wall probably, no room in garage for cars). DWP and LA Building and Safety are sure not ready for this yet. I have had conversations with people at the downtown headquarters and also my local area for DWP. I have had conversations with the chief engineer for the LA City Dept. of Bldg. and Safety. Here is DWP's outdated web page for EV http://www.ladwp.com/ladwp/cms/ladwp000801.jsp
Their information for consumers at this point is scant to non-existent. I have gotten DWP to come to the house to make the drawing of where the TOU (time of use) meter would be installed by the electrical contractor for the EVSE. Application on DWP site for separate EV related meter is out of date and requires VIN number of vehicle and purchase date. Here is the link to the outdated form http://www.ladwp.com/ladwp/rebates/ChargingStationRes.ladwp?act=init&contentId=LADWP_RESEVCHARGE_SCID
I have told them verbally this won't work since I need to get the installation done prior to purchasing the car so that I can start charging it right away. Anyhow, I am interested in anyone else's experiences thus far.
I have also had DWP and Building and Safety representatives out to the condo complex where we own a condo for discussions about the electric service to the building and to each unit and whether there was capacity either on the line side or the load side for EVSE. No conclusive information as of yet.

OK, I finally found the information I was looking for:

http://www.ladwp.com/ladwp/cms/ladwp010512.pdf

The guy I talked with told me that I can replace my meter with a Time of Use (TOU) meter. There is no charge for the replacement, but there is a monthly service charge of $8.00 to have the TOU meter, which cuts down any cost savings.

Here is the Residential Time of Use Rate Structure:

?Rate B - Time-of-Use Service
1 Service Charge $ 8.00 $ 8.00
2 Energy Charge - per kWh
High Peak Period $ 0.16061 $ 0.06515
Low Peak Period $ 0.08144 $ 0.06515
Base Period $ 0.04655 $ 0.05045
3 Electric Vehicle Discount - per kWh $ (0.02500) $(0.02500)
4 ECA - per kWh See General Provisions
5 ESA - per kWh See General Provisions
6 RCA - per kWh See General Provisions

Note: the two different rates for each period are for High Season (June-Sept) and Low Season (Oct-May).

Here are the Rating Periods:

?RATING PERIODS
High Peak Period 1:00 p.m. – 5:00 p.m. Monday through Friday (20 hours/week)
Low Peak Period 10:00 am. - 1:00 p.m. Monday through Friday 5:00 p.m. – 8:00 p.m. Monday through Friday (30 hours/week)
Base Period 8:00 p.m. – 10:00 a.m. Monday through Friday, All Day Saturday and Sunday (118 hours/week)

I did a quick calculation and found that for my situation, the TOU meter will probably only save me $2 per month for EV charging, and perhaps another $1 per month savings on my regular electricity usage. While there is a 2.5 cents per KWH discount for the EV charging, in addition to lower rate with TOU, it takes about 160 KWH per month EV charging to break even with the $8.00 service charge for the meter. My calculations were for 125 KWH per month (current use), plus 225 KWH per month to charge my Nissan Leaf (assuming 4 miles per KWH, for a total of 900 miles per month). Works out to about $25 per month for electricity to run the Leaf, or 11.2 cents per mile.

Merged.

Stoaty said:

... plus 225 KWH per month to charge my Nissan Leaf (assuming 4 miles per KWH, for a total of 900 miles per month). Works out to about $25 per month for electricity to run the Leaf, or 11.2 cents per mile.

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$25 for 900 miles per month would be 2.8 cents per mile, no ?

LEAFer said:

Stoaty said:

... plus 225 KWH per month to charge my Nissan Leaf (assuming 4 miles per KWH, for a total of 900 miles per month). Works out to about $25 per month for electricity to run the Leaf, or 11.2 cents per mile.

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$25 for 900 miles per month would be 2.8 cents per mile, no ?

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Oops... that should read 11.2 cents per KWH which would be 2.8 cents per mile. Thought that seemed way too high. Thanks for catching my error :mrgreen:

If your commute involves much stop-and-go, or extended freeway driving, you might see a range of closer to 70 miles from a charge-up. Including guesstimated 10% charging losses, that charging energy is likely to be about 24kWh * 1.1, so the mileage per AC kWh would be

70 miles /(24 DC kWh * 1.1 AC-to-DC)

or about 2.7 miles per AC kWh.

DeaneG said:

If your commute involves much stop-and-go, or extended freeway driving, you might see a range of closer to 70 miles from a charge-up. Including guesstimated 10% charging losses, that charging energy is likely to be about 24kWh * 1.1, so the mileage per AC kWh would be

70 miles /(24 DC kWh * 1.1 AC-to-DC)

or about 2.7 miles per AC kWh.

Click to expand...

Yes, that is probably more accurate... except for the fact that a full charge wouldn't be 24 kWh, unless the Leaf uses the whole of the battery charge. Thought I read that about 20 kWh maximum would be used from full to empty, so as not to fry the battery pack. Please correct me if I am wrong. Also, the 70 miles was for driving at 55 with the AC going on a hot day. Wish they had given info without AC, cooler day, 50 MPH, etc.

Assuming:

88 miles per charge
Chargeable capacity of 20 kWh
10% electricity loss from charging

I get exactly 4 miles per AC kWh. Guess it just depends on how things work in the real world. We will know soon enough.

I heard by email from a DWP EV representative. I had asked about why the on line application form for a TOU meter for the EV required the VIN number, date of purchase,etc. since the whole point was to get the EVSE installed prior to getting the car. FYI, there was nothing really new in the fact sheet that she sent me. Here is what she said...

Quote...
We are currently revising the process and form, so don’t worry about filling it out now. Thanks for your patience as we work things out.
I’m attaching our Electric Vehicle Program Fact Sheet with some general information. We are still working to figure out the implementation details of the program, but I’ll make sure we notify you as soon as we have more information.
At this point we’re identifying customers and having our Electric Service Reps check for electric capacity for the charger installation. Please provide your address and phone number.
End Quote

If I hear anymore, I will post here.

If the Energy rate is around 4.5¢ per kWh, with 2.5¢ off for EV charging, how much is the TOTAL rate/kWh, including distribution, etc.?

For example, with my SDG&E, the energy part is about 9¢, but the "distribution, etc." varies from 3 or 4¢ up to about 25¢ per kWh, a TOTAL of about 13 to 34¢ per kWh.

In the end, what DWP was offering was either to go on whole house TOU and they would give you a 500 kWh block of energy (I am assuming monthly) that would have a 2 1/2 cent per kWh discount...OR.....you could put in a separate TOU meter that would have a separate $8 per month service charge and you would have to have your own electrician (or your EVSE installer) put in the TOU meter, the wiring for it, etc. at your cost. They would give you a 2 1/2 cent per kWh discount for charging the EV on the TOU meter at night
In the end, we don't want whole house TOU and putting in a separate TOU meter was going to be too expensive to install and not worth the small amount of savings in electric costs. We have plenty of room in our existing panel for the EVSE circuit.

Maybe someday if the dual headed meter gets UL approved and DWP uses them, we will go that route for TOU charging for the EV because they would just have to switch out the existing meter. But a whole separate panel, meter, wiring, etc. and us paying for it? No way.

I don't think I will opt for the TOU meter. There is an $8/month subscription fee, and the cost savings to us with the discounted rate would only be about $8 a month anyway (we aren't heavy drivers). Plus tack on any installation fees for the meter itself (I've been unable to determine if there are any).

The LADWP website seems to hint at a block discount amount on your bill if you do not opt for the TOU meter. You send them proof that you own the car and they will give you a certain dollar discount based on average household charging use. Anyone heard of this?

WWBD said:

I don't think I will opt for the TOU meter. There is an $8/month subscription fee, and the cost savings to us with the discounted rate would only be about $8 a month anyway (we aren't heavy drivers). Plus tack on any installation fees for the meter itself (I've been unable to determine if there are any).

The LADWP website seems to hint at a block discount amount on your bill if you do not opt for the TOU meter. You send them proof that you own the car and they will give you a certain dollar discount based on average household charging use. Anyone heard of this?

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As I posted previously, if you go on whole house TOU they would give you an EV bonus of 500 kWh block of energy monthly that would have a 2 1/2 cent per kWh discount on the lowest base rate (8pm to 10 am on weeknights, all day Sat. and Sun.). We have decided to go on whole house TOU to get this discounted rate at nighttime. TOU separate meter did not pencil out for same reasons you have given....monthly fee plus the cost to install separate meter which we would have to pay. We are going to give whole house TOU a try. We had our local DWP service rep come out to the house and now we just have to call him once the EV project puts in our Blink and he will get the ball rolling to switch out our meter to TOU. Then I have to make sure we get the EV discount.

Is switching to whole house TOU free? If so, are there any disadvantages? I've got my blink now.

One disadvantage, and the reason we are not going to go to whole house TOU metering, is that if you work from home, or your spouse is often home during the day, and/or you live in a hot area in the summer, the electricity that you use during the peak periods might well wipe out any savings you get during the off peak period. And a second separate TOU meter for the EV also does not make sense for us for the reasons previously discussed. Thus, after running all the numbers, I determined that the best courser of action for us is to do nothing different.

WWBD said:

Is switching to whole house TOU free? If so, are there any disadvantages? I've got my blink now.

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Does anyone know the carbon footprint for electricity from LA DWP (grams per KWH) using their overall mix? I am curious about the carbon footprint of the Leaf using LA DWP power.

I found some recent information about DWP improvements for the year 2010:

--Coal is down to 39% of power
--DWP achieved the goal of 20% renewable energy (technically, they got to 19.7%)
--Half of the renewable energy is wind; 30% is small hydroelectric
--DWP will divest itself of power from the Navajo Generating Station in Arizona by 2014, which will reduce carbon emissions by an additional 26%

http://www.globe-net.com/articles/2011/january/22/los-angeles-achieves-20-percent-renewable-energy-target.aspx?sub=

Still don't know what the carbon footprint is from DWP electricity, but it looks like they are making significant strides toward getting off coal.

Stoaty said:

Still don't know what the carbon footprint is from DWP electricity, but it looks like they are making significant strides toward getting off coal.

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I'm guessing that most of the coal is imported from AZ as there is very little coal generation capacity in CA...