GRA
Posts: 9109
Joined: Mon Sep 19, 2011 1:49 pm
Location: East side of San Francisco Bay

Re: Electrify America Network

Sat Aug 18, 2018 11:41 am

EA has just added a bunch of sites to their Coming Soon list, increasing the total from 28 to 55. Among those listed are Rufus and Island City, OR, 108 and 261 miles from Portland, so those will connect to Huntington once complete. No reason why they couldn't have waited on Huntington until Rufus, at least, was done, and Rufus is #31 on the list so unlikely to complete in the short term. I note they have other sites shown on the map as 'planned', with the notation that the actual site will be within 10 miles or so but nothing is firm yet (which is the procedure I'd like to see Tesla adopt, so we don't have SC sites listed as 'Coming soon' for a year or more). Dunnigan, on I-5 just north of the I-505 junction is also on the list, and much needed for people traveling between Norcal and Oregon, but another site or two is needed to connect to Oregon.

I-5 in Oregon and Washington, I-10 from Houston eastwards to Jacksonville, I-70 and I-80/76 in the Midwest, and I-15 from Butte southwards all look like they're making good progress with sites. The agreement with Walmart is obviously speeding up site acquisition tremendously, as 33 of the 55 coming soon sites are at Walmarts/Sam's Clubs, along with two of the nine completed sites. Now we'll see how well they do completing them.

Coming Soon

    Alltown Gas Station Plymouth (22 Long Pond Rd, Plymouth, MA, 02360)
    Walmart Supercenter 1834 (135 NE Terry Ln, Grants Pass, OR, 97526)
    Walmart Supercenter 5396 (1330 Goldfish Farm Rd SE, Albany, OR, 97322)
    Stinker Store #68 (326 ID-24, Heyburn, ID, 83336)
    Walmart Supercenter 3259 (3555 Mullan Rd, Missoula, MT, 59808)
    Kum & Go 540 (3105 Grand Prairie Pkwy, Waukee, IA, 50263)
    Walmart Supercenter 1585 (1401 S Dewey St, North Platte, NE, 69143)
    Grand Island Quality Inn (7838 S Hwy 281, Grand Island, NE, 68803)
    Casey's Lincoln NE (110 NW 20th St, Lincoln, NE, 68528)
    Walmart Supercenter 5033 (1300 Barlow Rd, Ft. Morgan, CO, 80701)
    Walmart Supercenter 1214 (115 W Willow St, Colby, KS, 67701)
    Walmart Supercenter 664 (4301 Vine St, Hays, KS, 67601)
    Casey's Lebanon MO (669 West Elm St, Lebanon, MO, 65536)
    Walmart Supercenter 7249 (500 W Mount Vernon Blvd, Mount Vernon, MO, 65712)
    Walmart Supercenter 331 (525 N Cities Service Hwy, Sulphur, LA, 70663)
    Walmart Supercenter 402 (1932 Rees St, Breaux Bridge, LA, 70517)
    The Commons at Wolfcreek (2755 North Germantown Pkwy, Memphis, TN, 38133)
    Willowbrook Commons (61 East Thompson Lane, Nashville, TN, 37211)
    Pensacola Square (6235 North Davis Hwy, Pensacola, FL, 32504)
    Walmart Supercenter 2114 (1621 Main St, Chipley, FL, 32428)
    Barrett Place (800 Cobb Place Boulevard NW, Kennesaw, GA, 30144)
    Walmart Supercenter 3 (30983 US Hwy 441, Commerce, GA, 30529)
    Walmart Supercenter 959 (2163 W County Rd 48, Bushnell, FL, 33513)
    Waterford Commons ( 915 Hartford Turnpike, Waterford, CT, 06385)
    Walmart Supercenter 1802 (1501 SW Wanamaker Rd, Topeka, KS, 66604)
    Dell Mercantile (24 Main St, Dell, MT, 59724)
    Walmart Supercenter 602 (1025 Sawdust Rd, Spring, TX, 77380)
    Novato Fair Shopping Center (900 Diablo Ave, Novato, CA, 94947)
    Motel 6 - Dunnigan (3930 County Rd 89, Dunnigan, CA, 95937)
    Walmart Supercenter 2947 (9000 NE Hwy 99, Vancouver, WA, 98665)
    Rufus Sinclair Gas Station (501 1st St, Rufus, OR, 97050)
    Walmart Supercenter 3053 (1605 SE Everett Mall Way, Everett, WA, 98208)
    Walmart Supercenter 1889 (11619 Island Ave, Island City, OR, 97850)
    Flying J Town Pump (122000 W Browns Gultch Rd, Butte, MT, 59701)
    Walmart Sam's Club 8272 (4385 Venetucci Blvd, Fountain, CO, 80906)
    Walmart Supercenter 1965 (3201 Manawa Centre Dr, Council Bluffs, IA, 51501)
    Walmart Supercenter 637 (200 Frontier St, Lexington, NE, 68850)
    Walmart Supercenter 65 (350 Park Ridge Rd, Sullivan, MO, 63080)
    Walmart Supercenter 3602 (1100 Lejune Dr, Springfield, IL, 62703)
    Walmart Supercenter 673 (3050 Wilma Rudolph Blvd, Clarksville, TN, 37040)
    Village Commons Shopping Center (1300 Village Square, Tallahassee, FL, 32312)
    Walmart Supercenter 3835 (5588 Little Debbie Pkwy, Ooltewah, TN, 37363)
    Walmart Supercenter 1048 (589 KY-92, Williamsburg, KY, 40769)
    Walmart Supercenter 907 (180 N Lee St, Forsyth, GA, 31029)
    The Walk at Highwoods Preserve (18001 Highwoods Preserve Pkwy, Tampa, FL, 33647)
    Walmart Supercenter 2860 (160 Pooler Pkwy, Pooler, GA, 31322)
    Walmart Supercenter 1769 (20 Industrial Dr, Dubois, PA, 15801)
    Sheetz 213(2511 New Berwick Hwy, Bloomsburg, PA, 17815)
    Walmart Supercenter 1949 (10401 Bennett Rd, Fredonia, NY, 14063)
    Walmart Supercenter 630 (230 N Beltline Dr, Florence, SC, 29501)
    Sheetz 191 (1098 Harrisburg Pike, Carlisle, PA, 17013)
    Country Hills Shopping Center (2965 Rolling Hills Rd, Torrance, CA, 90505)
    Montebello Plaza (2401 W Via Campo, Montebello, CA, 90640)
    Walmart Supercenter 5195 (11400 Hwy 99, Everett, WA, 98204)
    Walmart Supercenter 1697 (8465 Elk Grove Blvd, Elk Grove, CA, 95758)
Guy [I have lots of experience designing/selling off-grid AE systems, some using EVs but don't own one. Local trips are by foot, bike and/or rapid transit].

The 'best' is the enemy of 'good enough'. Copper shot, not Silver bullets.

DaveinOlyWA
Posts: 13141
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Delivery Date: 16 Feb 2018
Leaf Number: 314199
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Contact: Website

Re: Electrify America Network

Sat Aug 18, 2018 1:07 pm

In a perfect...

yeah, whatever. Its 82 mile to Boise from Huntington, Le Grande is 87 miles away and no, not open yet but on its way. but the reality is a lot of moving parts have to come together and for some, the season is the key. Guessing some areas just kinda need to get done before Winter or go on hold for 5 months. Either way, the hole exists. Where the hole exists is really inconsequential.
2011 SL; 44,598 miles. 2013 S; 44,840 miles.2016 S30 deceased. 29,413 miles. 2018 S40; 8743 miles, 485 GIDs, 37.6 kwh 111.39 Ahr , SOH 96.49, Hx 114.98
My Blog; http://daveinolywa.blogspot.com" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

GRA
Posts: 9109
Joined: Mon Sep 19, 2011 1:49 pm
Location: East side of San Francisco Bay

Re: Electrify America Network

Sat Aug 18, 2018 1:20 pm

DaveinOlyWA wrote:In a perfect...

yeah, whatever. Its 82 mile to Boise from Huntington, Le Grande is 87 miles away and no, not open yet but on its way. but the reality is a lot of moving parts have to come together and for some, the season is the key. Guessing some areas just kinda need to get done before Winter or go on hold for 5 months. Either way, the hole exists. Where the hole exists is really inconsequential.

Then we disagree. To serve the greatest number of customers with a given investment at the earliest date, you want QCs to expand out from large concentrations of those customers to connect them with other large concentrations of customers and/or frequent recreation destinations. I don't doubt that weather limitations play a part, but judging by the list it seems most likely that easy site contracts have been the determining factor. As I expect the completion pace to be fairly slow until next year in any case (which is when the first cars that can really benefit from high-speed CCS QCs will start to appear in numbers), it's not that big a deal. I'm more concerned with the fact that site locations often seem to be determined by that ease of contract rather than putting them where they will provide the greatest utility for off-interstate travel, i.e. at junctions with U.S. and state highways.
Guy [I have lots of experience designing/selling off-grid AE systems, some using EVs but don't own one. Local trips are by foot, bike and/or rapid transit].

The 'best' is the enemy of 'good enough'. Copper shot, not Silver bullets.

DaveinOlyWA
Posts: 13141
Joined: Sat Apr 24, 2010 7:43 pm
Delivery Date: 16 Feb 2018
Leaf Number: 314199
Location: Olympia, WA
Contact: Website

Re: Electrify America Network

Sat Aug 18, 2018 3:32 pm

Hmm, I guess "I" need to reexamine VW's motivation for doing this then.
2011 SL; 44,598 miles. 2013 S; 44,840 miles.2016 S30 deceased. 29,413 miles. 2018 S40; 8743 miles, 485 GIDs, 37.6 kwh 111.39 Ahr , SOH 96.49, Hx 114.98
My Blog; http://daveinolywa.blogspot.com" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

GRA
Posts: 9109
Joined: Mon Sep 19, 2011 1:49 pm
Location: East side of San Francisco Bay

Re: Electrify America Network

Sun Aug 19, 2018 1:56 pm

DaveinOlyWA wrote:Hmm, I guess "I" need to reexamine VW's motivation for doing this then.

Was their motivation ever in doubt? It's 'the government is forcing us to do this because we were very, very bad boys'. That being said, the respective governments get the final sign-off on VW's plans, so its up to them to see that the network will serve customers well. In some states (like Colorado) there are other programs that will build an effective off-interstate network, and it's less of an issue in those cases.
Guy [I have lots of experience designing/selling off-grid AE systems, some using EVs but don't own one. Local trips are by foot, bike and/or rapid transit].

The 'best' is the enemy of 'good enough'. Copper shot, not Silver bullets.

SageBrush
Posts: 2686
Joined: Sun Mar 06, 2011 2:28 am
Delivery Date: 13 Feb 2017
Location: Colorado

Re: Electrify America Network

Sun Aug 19, 2018 4:12 pm

Owners of non Tesla EVs also own an ICE with few exceptions. I suspect that they will take little advantage of the EA network for road trips since EV fueling will be at least as expensive as fossil fool and less convenient.

Result: the EA network is a white elephant even before it gets built. Perhaps Tesla will scoop it up for a pittance.
2013 LEAF 'S' Model with QC & rear-view camera
Bought off-lease Jan 2017 from N. California
Car is now enjoying an easy life in Colorado
3/2018: 58 Ahr, 28k miles
-----
2018 Tesla Model 3 LR, Delivered 6/2018

stutech
Posts: 3
Joined: Sat Aug 18, 2018 8:38 am
Delivery Date: 28 May 2018
Leaf Number: 309018
Location: South Jordan, UT

Re: Electrify America Network

Mon Aug 20, 2018 12:11 am

GRA wrote:
stutech wrote:
GRA wrote:#9, Huntington, OR is open. Why now, I'm not sure, because it's out in the middle of nowhere all by its lonesome. Heyburn, ID 240 miles away is listed as coming soon, but it's not as if there's likely to be a lot of BEVs located in the area that can reach it either at the moment, and Albany, OR is 379 miles away by the shortest (non-Interstate) route.

The Heyburn, ID station is an important station for anyone going from Salt Lake City to Boise, as I often do from time to time. My family lives in Boise and going back and forth costs a mint in gasoline with my regular ICE car. I would much prefer to take my 2018 leaf but currently I can only make it to the Heyburn area safely from the last Chademo station in the Salt Lake Area. I think that is why Electrify America choose this area as one of the first as it is so lacking in charging resources in rural Idaho. Idaho in general though has yet to have a single non dealer owned chademo at all, even in the Boise area. It gets really irritating finding that Tesla has a charger in Tremonton, UT and Twin Falls, ID and Boise, ID however for us regular ev users that are non tesla we are out of luck. I can tell you the Boise area has tons of leafs so it's very odd that more non level 2 infrastructure hasn't been built. Also yes I am a new member, but a long time lurker here I thought I would share this info as I am not sure how many other people here are frequenting this "middle of nowhere area" as you guys put it. :D

The thing is, while this site will help you in your particular situation, the number of non-Tesla BEVs is small in this area compared to others. For instance, it's 345 miles from Portland to Huntington, OR, and there are far more BEVs in the Portland area than in SLC so expanding out from there should be the priority. Huntington is beyond non-Tesla range from Portland (and even with a Tesla you'd better have an S100D or 3 LR and take it easy if you expect to make it using only SCs), and SLC-Heyburn is pushing Bolt range given UT/ID freeway speeds and the 1,100 ft. climb along the way.

I have nothing against putting QCs in places like Huntington and Heyburn, indeed they'll be needed there, but you really want one in between Heyburn and SLC first, in Ogden or Tremonton, as it's 182 miles between SLC and Heyburn, and the network is supposed to have a max. spacing of 120 miles and average 70 miles - anything other than a Bolt can't make it (I-Pace and e-Tron Quattro as well once they're available). Even so, it would make far more sense to put a QC in Hood River or Biggs first, then Pendleton, Ontario and Nampa or Boise, and even more sense to connect Portland and Seattle first - see the heat map for the Bolt here: https://www.mynissanleaf.com/viewtopic.php?f=10&t=9111&start=1740#p532907

Salt Lake has some BEVs, but Denver and Dallas have more and Portland and Seattle more yet, then there's California and the NE corridor or the Tampa-Orlando axis which are in a whole other category.




I agree with the points that it should be a priority from Portland first, however I am just happy they are at least adding them to the areas I need as well. To get to Heyburn, ID currently I have to go from SLC to the maverick in Farr West Utah aka North Ogden to charge, then charge a bit in Tremonton, UT on level 2, then I can make it to the campground in Heyburn, ID. I've done this a couple of times and it is doable, but far from ideal. They really do need to put one ideally in Snowville, UT and Jerome, ID to complete the SLC to Boise route. I am willing to bet this is their plan, but why they don't do a whole wing at once is really odd. Salt Lake has a decent amount of BEV's but most are BMW i3's not leafs or their the older leafs not the 2018.

GRA
Posts: 9109
Joined: Mon Sep 19, 2011 1:49 pm
Location: East side of San Francisco Bay

Re: Electrify America Network

Mon Aug 20, 2018 2:09 pm

SageBrush wrote:Owners of non Tesla EVs also own an ICE with few exceptions. I suspect that they will take little advantage of the EA network for road trips since EV fueling will be at least as expensive as fossil fool and less convenient.

Result: the EA network is a white elephant even before it gets built. Perhaps Tesla will scoop it up for a pittance.

Seeing as how the whole point of a high-power QC network like EA's is to empower people to get rid of their ICEs and use BEVs for all their car needs, I doubt that it will be a white elephant (always assuming charging isn't priced more expensively than gas per mile). So far we've got only a single price point for EA charging fees, and eventually there will be competition from other networks that will help pricing, eVgo being the most likely at the moment.
Guy [I have lots of experience designing/selling off-grid AE systems, some using EVs but don't own one. Local trips are by foot, bike and/or rapid transit].

The 'best' is the enemy of 'good enough'. Copper shot, not Silver bullets.

GetOffYourGas
Posts: 1875
Joined: Tue Dec 20, 2011 6:56 pm
Delivery Date: 09 Mar 2012
Location: Syracuse, NY

Re: Electrify America Network

Mon Aug 20, 2018 8:09 pm

GRA wrote:
SageBrush wrote:Owners of non Tesla EVs also own an ICE with few exceptions. I suspect that they will take little advantage of the EA network for road trips since EV fueling will be at least as expensive as fossil fool and less convenient.

Result: the EA network is a white elephant even before it gets built. Perhaps Tesla will scoop it up for a pittance.

Seeing as how the whole point of a high-power QC network like EA's is to empower people to get rid of their ICEs and use BEVs for all their car needs, I doubt that it will be a white elephant (always assuming charging isn't priced more expensively than gas per mile). So far we've got only a single price point for EA charging fees, and eventually there will be competition from other networks that will help pricing, eVgo being the most likely at the moment.


EVGo is already cost-competitive with gasoline if you use the membership option. And you should in any month you expect to pay $10 or more for charging, since the fee is a credit for the month. Plus you can cancel at any time. It takes a little forethought, but it's really not hard to manage.

If EA is more expensive, I will just continue to use EVGo.
~Brian

EV Fleet:
2011 Torqeedo Travel 1003 electric outboard on a 22' sailboat
2012 Leaf SV (traded for Bolt)
2015 C-Max Energi (302A package)
2017 Bolt Premier

DaveinOlyWA
Posts: 13141
Joined: Sat Apr 24, 2010 7:43 pm
Delivery Date: 16 Feb 2018
Leaf Number: 314199
Location: Olympia, WA
Contact: Website

Re: Electrify America Network

Tue Aug 21, 2018 6:01 am

It has become rather apparent that VW is only doing the bare minimum to comply with the court ruling while doing what it can to bolster their own product. Don't be surprised when they come out with tiered pricing for VW EVers.
2011 SL; 44,598 miles. 2013 S; 44,840 miles.2016 S30 deceased. 29,413 miles. 2018 S40; 8743 miles, 485 GIDs, 37.6 kwh 111.39 Ahr , SOH 96.49, Hx 114.98
My Blog; http://daveinolywa.blogspot.com" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

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