EVSE Federal credit

Anyone going ahead and getting their EVSE installed this year to take advantage of the Federal Credit.
Or are you waiting until the delivery of your car gets closer next year and taking a chance that the credit will be extended for next year also.

I feel the install quote was way too high to install the evse in my prewired, permitted and inspected home. I plan to get a Leviton 16 amp home evse and self install. Install as in bolt to the wall and plug into the outlet. Even if it costs same after tax I just cannot give that money to AV.

Some of us may not have a choice because AeroVironment and/or EcoTality won't perform the install until next year... seems like they are backed up, and if you have a 2011 order date, you're way down the list. My order date is January 2011, and have not yet been contacted by EcoTality for an inspection (on the list of maybes).

Captain Obvious here, but if they really want EVs to take off, they will need to eliminate the bottleneck for EVSE installs, eliminate the exclusive contract with AV, and get EVSEs out there in the retail market (allowing market competition for the hardware and allowing you to get any electrician to handle the install, or even do a self install if you know what you're doing and/or have a pre-wired circuit to hook up to). The current process might work for the first year, but after that they're going to be producing Leafs faster than EVSEs can be manufactured and installed.

smkettner said:

I feel the install quote was way too high to install the evse in my prewired, permitted and inspected home. I plan to get a Leviton 16 amp home evse and self install. Install as in bolt to the wall and plug into the outlet. Even if it costs same after tax I just cannot give that money to AV.

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So no RV cord after all.

EVDRIVER said:

smkettner said:

I feel the install quote was way too high to install the evse in my prewired, permitted and inspected home. I plan to get a Leviton 16 amp home evse and self install. Install as in bolt to the wall and plug into the outlet. Even if it costs same after tax I just cannot give that money to AV.

Click to expand...

So no RV cord after all.

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Most likely I will get by on the included L1 for some time until the evse thing shakes out a bit. If there was an option for just a cord and no junk I would far and away prefer that set up. There is absolutely no reason for all the evse equipment IMO. If there is a hack to bypass it I would be all for it.

I am still looking for a super basic no options L2 evse. Similar to the included L1 but 16a L2 power. I am hoping the Leviton is close enough and has a low (<$350) price.

smkettner said:

EVDRIVER said:

smkettner said:

I feel the install quote was way too high to install the evse in my prewired, permitted and inspected home. I plan to get a Leviton 16 amp home evse and self install. Install as in bolt to the wall and plug into the outlet. Even if it costs same after tax I just cannot give that money to AV.

Click to expand...

So no RV cord after all.

Click to expand...

Most likely I will get by on the included L1 for some time until the evse thing shakes out a bit. If there was an option for just a cord and no junk I would far and away prefer that set up. There is absolutely no reason for all the evse equipment IMO. If there is a hack to bypass it I would be all for it.

I am still looking for a super basic no options L2 evse. Similar to the included L1 but 16a L2 power. I am hoping the Leviton is close enough and has a low (<$350) price.

Click to expand...

YOu can hack it with under $5 in parts for the pilot signal.

EVDRIVER said:

YOu can hack it with under $5 in parts for the pilot signal.

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Do you know of some good instructions in order to generate a proper pilot signal? I've been running into issues since it requires a 12 volt, 1 khz, PWM signal and the electrical engineering "force" isn't strong enough in me...

Anyway, back to Mary's original question.

I, for one, have been very vocal on this issue and I think most of the more active members know well where I stand. I am planning to start contacting local electrical contractors for estimates to do the EVSE installation work. I have not decided upon which unit to use, but I hope the Levaton one will be available next month (not likely but I can hope) and then just get it all done in November or December at the latest though what with holidays and all I don't know if I can get anyone in December. None the less, I will try my hardest to get it done by 31 December because any Electrical Contractor can do the EVSE installation and you get the tax credit, 50% off up to $2000 (Any installation costs above $4000 you pay in full) and damn Congress for not extending this and all the <excised> for not allowing this teeny weeny little bit of <booga wooga>STIM-U-LUS<wooooooo> that will, like the ARRA has, create #$^ jobs already! Grrr.

Okay, I'm calm again. Sorry! Anyway, yes, I plan to be installed by 31 Dec, local contractor and EVSE producer willing. If they extend the credit in the lame-duck session and I've not installed yet, I'll definitely wait!

It should be possible to do the electrical modifications and additions now, for a 2010 tax credit, wiring to a 240v socket (in a "junction box") on a 40-amp dual breaker (**), putting the socket in-service (completely inspected and ready to use) now, for plug-in charging. Label it "EV Charging Only" and take a picture of it. Most likely, the costs of doing this qualify for the EVSE Tax Credit, I suspect.

Then plug-in (or possibly "mount") any "new" L2 EVSE later, when it beomes available.

(**) I would include dual 20-amp breakers for twin 120v duplex sockets (one on each 120v "phase"). This will be for the initial (and later, when needed) Level 1 charging, to be used with the Nissan "included" EVSE, if one needs to specify the EVSE type that one intends to use.

It will also provide for convenient testing of "Two-120v-makes-240v" adapter cords.

garygid said:

It should be possible to do the electrical modifications and additions now, for a 2010 tax credit, wiring to a 240v socket (in a "junction box") on a 40-amp dual breaker (**), putting the socket in-service (completely inspected and ready to use) now, for plug-in charging. Label it "EV Charging Only" and take a picture of it. Most likely, the costs of doing this qualify for the EVSE Tax Credit, I suspect.

Then plug-in (or possibly "mount") any "new" L2 EVSE later, when it beomes available.

(**) I would include dual 20-amp breakers for twin 120v duplex sockets (one on each 120v "phase"). This will be for the initial (and later, when needed) Level 1 charging, to be used with the Nissan "included" EVSE, if one needs to specify the EVSE type that one intends to use.

It will also provide for convenient testing of "Two-120v-makes-240v" adapter cords.

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Technically that is incorrect. The station must be operational to get the credit as per the IRS rules, now I know several ways to make the above situation work but I'm commenting on the official rules here.

Since the car comes with an L1 why would the installation of the recommended dedicated circuit not qualify?
Plug the L1 in and take a picture if you must.

IRS does not give deductions, you must take them. I would take my audit chances.

smkettner said:

Since the car comes with an L1 why would the installation of the recommended dedicated circuit not qualify?
Plug the L1 in and take a picture if you must.

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Because it's not permanently mounted.

Now, if you screwed the L1 EVSE that comes with the LEAF to the wall, I would have a hard time believing they could complain about that!

Is there something in the EVSE tax credit that specifies or requires either 240v or hard-wired configurations only?

garygid said:

Is there something in the EVSE tax credit that specifies or requires either 240v or hard-wired configurations only?

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Link to IRS form for tax credit http://www.irs.gov/pub/irs-pdf/f8911.pdf
The instructions are on page 2 and describe what a "qualified" station is. Basically, "in service" and a couple of other benign provisions.

So, an "in Service" installation for a transportable, plug-in L1 (or L2) EVSE is ... would seem to be ... an appropriately-wired, well-labeled, fully-functional, legally permitted and inspected wall socket (or set of sockets).
Right?

garygid said:

So, an "in Service" installation for a transportable, plug-in L1 (or L2) EVSE is ... would seem to be ... an appropriately-wired, well-labeled, fully-functional, legally permitted and inspected wall socket (or set of sockets).
Right?

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If the contrary is "out of service", then yes, ready to be used sounds like "in service" to me.

"In Service" might leave the IRS room to do whatever they want, but it seems to be something like, connected, powered on, and ready to use, rather than "being used" right now, or even has been used.

With some things it might mean after first use, but a rental car might be "in service" when it is ready and available to rent, not later, when it is first rented.

If your "installation" is ready for visitors that might drop by and use your Charging-Connection with their plug-in EVSE, that might mean your "dock" is "in Service", even if you do not yet own an EVSE.

This is primarily based upon my (limited) "experience" from placing my PV system "in Service".

I'm not a lawyer, nor do I play one on TV, but I would think that the EVSE is "in service" after it has been purchased, installed, received the final inspection, power is supplied to it, and it is ready to use. It would be temporarily out-of-service if it was broken or otherwise inoperative, until repaired and returned to service. It could be permenetly removed-from-service at it's end-of-life. This should be independent of whether an EV is in service. In theory, an EVSE might serve 0 or more EVs, and an EV might be serviced by 1 or more EVSEs. I think the thing which protects the IRS is that one is losing money by buying an EVSE which they are not planning to use, since the IRS only pays 50%.

The instructions for Line 15 are particularly interesting: it appears you can claim the credit twice if you move during the tax year but install EVSE at both locations. This would lead me to believe that the credit is tied to the EVSE and the EV is not required to claim it.

However the instructions state: "Original use of the property began with you." In many cases of folks here original use of the property will begin at a later date by the taxpayer claiming the credit. I think this is their way of insuring the you intend to use the EVSE and will use it, not merely resell it. I would think that, especially when transactions border the year boundry, tha the IRS might be willing to accept that you are placing the EVSE in-service in preparation for using it with the soon-to-be-acquired EV.

Is it possible to request to install one now while waiting for Leaf order?

Everyone- No car required, it's irrelevant. You need a receipt for labor and the device showing the work is paid and completed. They don't have a clue what an EVSE is or L1, L2, hardwired, not hardwired, etc. Just make sure you have a receipt for payment in 2010 for everything. Photos are not needed. It's a simple tax deduction, let's not make it so complex.