dylorama
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Delivery Date: 10 Sep 2018

questions about supplied 30 amp leaf 2018 EVSE

Wed Jul 25, 2018 8:11 am

Hi there

New to the forum. I am getting my 2018 leaf at the end of august, just in time (hopefully) to sneak in the Ontario EV rebate. I have some questions about level 2 charging that I have not been able to find answers to. I am currently in a rented house, so I am reluctant to fork out for any funds to install any dedicated level 2 charging equipment. My plan is to use level 1 charging almost exclusively, and on the odd time when I would not be able to charge to 100% the night before some serious driving, simply use a level 2 with a beefy RV extension cord from either the stove or dryer plug. I’m confident that with a reasonable amount of planning this will fully meet my family’s driving needs.

Because the on-board charger is limited to 6.6 KW (27.5 Amps at 240 Volts), I had decided that a 24 Amp Nema 14-50 EVSE would be best. Coupled with a 14-50 to 14-30 adapter, I would be able to safely plug into any dryer or stove outlet (for example if staying at a friend’s place out of town) without drawing too much power. Yes, I would not be getting the most I could from a 50 or 40 amp circuit (by 3.5 amps), but I would also have the flexibility to safely use 30 amp circuits as well. Makes sense to me.
I was surprised to learn then, that the Leaf comes with a 30 amp 14-50 EVSE. Completely goes against what I thought was a completely logical compromise, given the limits of the on-board charger.

So now my questions:

When almost all 240 volt plugs in north America are either 30, 40, or 50 amps (for a draw of 24, 32, or 40 amps), why would they put in a charger that tops out at 27.5 amps? Why not match one of those standards? Is there a non-north American context I don’t know about?

Why supply an EVSE that does not match the on-board charger? And, does this thing try to draw 30 amps, but tops out at 27.5 amps, or is it rated at 30 amps and will only safely draw 24 amps (80%)?

Following up on the last question – With a 14-50 to 14-30 adapter, would I be able to use the included EVSE with a 30 amp dryer outlet? If it draws 24 amps (80% of 30), then yes, but if it draws 27.5 amps then maybe, but probably not safely, and definitely not within the specifications of a nema 14-30 circiut.

Anyway, that’s it. Any insight would be greatly appreciated.

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EVDRIVER
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Re: questions about supplied 30 amp leaf 2018 EVSE

Wed Jul 25, 2018 8:15 am

Because car makers are generally clueless about charging and Nissan in particular. The design of the new cable they made demonstrates this clearly.

alozzy
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Re: questions about supplied 30 amp leaf 2018 EVSE

Wed Jul 25, 2018 11:22 am

If you want to use an existing dryer outlet, it's likely plugged into a NEMA 14-30R. However, the OBC on the LEAF will pull 27.5A and that can't be adjusted on the car.

So, you'll need to either purchase an EVSE that will limit the charging rate to 24A (the Zencar 32A portable EVSE will do that), or you'll need to use the stove receptacle (likely NEMA 14-50R), in which case you can use the stock EVSE.

Note that older receptacles may not match the above specs, so you need to check before purchasing any EVSE.
Last edited by alozzy on Wed Jul 25, 2018 10:41 pm, edited 1 time in total.
Vancouver, CA owner of a 2013 Ocean Blue SV + QC, purchased 01/2017 in WA
Zencar 12/20/24/30A L1/L2 portable EVSE
1-1/4" Curt #11396 hitch
After market, DIY LED DRLs
LeafSpy Pro + Konnwei KW902 ELM327 BT OBDII dongle
Loving my first BEV :D

alozzy
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Re: questions about supplied 30 amp leaf 2018 EVSE

Wed Jul 25, 2018 11:28 am

I should have mentioned that, on the 14-50 plug of my Zencar 32A EVSE, I removed the neutral blade as the EVSE doesn't use the neutral and that let's me plug into either a 14-30R or a 14-50R.

I also made an adapter cable (be very careful and don't use RV adapters as they aren't wired correctly) that let's me charge on a TT-30R (120V @ 30A) at campgrounds, or on a standard 120V receptacle too - all with the same Zencar EVSE.
Vancouver, CA owner of a 2013 Ocean Blue SV + QC, purchased 01/2017 in WA
Zencar 12/20/24/30A L1/L2 portable EVSE
1-1/4" Curt #11396 hitch
After market, DIY LED DRLs
LeafSpy Pro + Konnwei KW902 ELM327 BT OBDII dongle
Loving my first BEV :D

GerryAZ
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Re: questions about supplied 30 amp leaf 2018 EVSE

Wed Jul 25, 2018 9:00 pm

Actually, the current that the onboard charger draws depends upon the supply voltage and battery state of charge. It is about 27 amperes at 240 volts, about 26.8 amperes at 242 volts, and lower if the voltage is higher. It will draw 30 amperes at 212 volts and could go up to 32 amperes (based upon specifications published in the 2015 owner manual). In all cases, the current drops as the battery approaches full charge. I consistently see 30.0 amperes when I charge at my workshop at about 212 volts. So far, the voltage has never dropped enough to cause the current to go higher

You could use the Nissan EVSE with a 14-50 range receptacle and RV extension cord, but not with a 14-30 dryer receptacle at 240 volts. There are other threads which document that the Nissan EVSE will not work on 208 volts. If you need to charge from dryer receptacles or on 208 volts, you will need a different EVSE.
Gerry
Silver LEAF 2011 SL rear ended (totaled) by in-attentive driver 1/4/2015 at 50,422 miles
Silver LEAF 2015 SL purchased 2/7/2015

Solarninja
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Joined: Sun Jul 08, 2018 8:11 am
Delivery Date: 08 Jul 2018
Leaf Number: 306817

Re: questions about supplied 30 amp leaf 2018 EVSE

Sat Jul 28, 2018 10:28 am

Just my experiance...i ran a 30 amp dedicated circuit for my 2018 leaf yesterday...it tripped after about 10 mins of charging, so i grabbed my amp meter and flipped it back on
Image 31.4 amps... also very hot to the touch...i would HIGHLY reccomend 8gauge wire, 40 amp dedicated plug for charging these vehicles...especially in hot climates because they are obviously capable of drawing WAY more than the claimed 27~a i keep seeing thrown around on this thread

alozzy
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Re: questions about supplied 30 amp leaf 2018 EVSE

Sat Jul 28, 2018 4:11 pm

The 27.5A you see is based on this:

240V * 27.5A = 6.6 kW (supposedly what the OBC draws)

This, of course, doesn't account for loses. So, based on what you are seeing on your amp meter, the losses must be close to 4A. I'm surprised losses are that high, but it's likely because the wire gauge is too light.

If you intended to charge at 30A, I'm not sure why you put in a 30A circuit. On a 30A circuit, I personally wouldn't exceed 24A (with my Zencar 32A portable EVSE, I use a 30A circuit but I set the amperage to 24A - the cable never gets even warm).
Vancouver, CA owner of a 2013 Ocean Blue SV + QC, purchased 01/2017 in WA
Zencar 12/20/24/30A L1/L2 portable EVSE
1-1/4" Curt #11396 hitch
After market, DIY LED DRLs
LeafSpy Pro + Konnwei KW902 ELM327 BT OBDII dongle
Loving my first BEV :D

DaveinOlyWA
Posts: 13328
Joined: Sat Apr 24, 2010 7:43 pm
Delivery Date: 16 Feb 2018
Leaf Number: 314199
Location: Olympia, WA
Contact: Website

Re: questions about supplied 30 amp leaf 2018 EVSE

Sun Jul 29, 2018 6:30 am

Are you sure you won't be getting a dual voltage EVSE with the car? It comes with QC package in S, or Tech package in SV or standard with SL

As far as voltages goes; its an international car so they could tailor it for each country (which they do to a point) or do a one size fits all to lower costs.
2011 SL; 44,598 miles. 2013 S; 44,840 miles.2016 S30 deceased. 29,413 miles. 2018 S40; 11,987 miles, 485 GIDs, 37.6 kwh 110.89 Ahr , SOH 96.00, Hx 115.22
My Blog; http://daveinolywa.blogspot.com" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

DaveinOlyWA
Posts: 13328
Joined: Sat Apr 24, 2010 7:43 pm
Delivery Date: 16 Feb 2018
Leaf Number: 314199
Location: Olympia, WA
Contact: Website

Re: questions about supplied 30 amp leaf 2018 EVSE

Sun Jul 29, 2018 6:31 am

alozzy wrote:The 27.5A you see is based on this:

240V * 27.5A = 6.6 kW (supposedly what the OBC draws)

This, of course, doesn't account for loses. So, based on what you are seeing on your amp meter, the losses must be close to 4A. I'm surprised losses are that high, but it's likely because the wire gauge is too light.

If you intended to charge at 30A, I'm not sure why you put in a 30A circuit. On a 30A circuit, I personally wouldn't exceed 24A (with my Zencar 32A portable EVSE, I use a 30A circuit but I set the amperage to 24A - the cable never gets even warm).


2018 EVSE is plenty heavy enough. Losses should be less than 10%
2011 SL; 44,598 miles. 2013 S; 44,840 miles.2016 S30 deceased. 29,413 miles. 2018 S40; 11,987 miles, 485 GIDs, 37.6 kwh 110.89 Ahr , SOH 96.00, Hx 115.22
My Blog; http://daveinolywa.blogspot.com" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

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EVDRIVER
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Re: questions about supplied 30 amp leaf 2018 EVSE

Sun Jul 29, 2018 7:41 am

Solarninja wrote:Just my experiance...i ran a 30 amp dedicated circuit for my 2018 leaf yesterday...it tripped after about 10 mins of charging, so i grabbed my amp meter and flipped it back on
Image 31.4 amps... also very hot to the touch...i would HIGHLY reccomend 8gauge wire, 40 amp dedicated plug for charging these vehicles...especially in hot climates because they are obviously capable of drawing WAY more than the claimed 27~a i keep seeing thrown around on this thread


If you have a 240V Nissan EVSE it needs to be on a 50A 14-50 outlet with a 50A breaker by code in most municipalities of the USA and likely Canada as well. You should never have this EVSE on a 30A circuit and you really should hire a professional to inspect your wiring as it never should have been on the wrong circuit type.

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