User avatar
mwalsh
Posts: 9482
Joined: Thu Apr 22, 2010 10:10 am
Delivery Date: 05 Jan 2011
Leaf Number: 0213
Location: Garden Grove, CA

Lizard Pack Will Hold Up IF Your Driving Patterns Support It

Mon Feb 22, 2016 10:24 am

Update: See page 6 for some interesting data related to how your driving patterns might affect apparent capacity!

I thought long and hard about simply continuing in the "Lizard Pack Holding Up" thread, but I think it's time to start admitting that all Lizard packs do not appear to be created equal. On the one hand I'm glad I got this one without having to pay for it, but this is looking ever more likely that it will be as bad if not worse than the original pack:

12/30/15: AHr=63.80 CAP=97.26% Hlth=100.00% Hx=100.00% Gids=277. Mileage: 56,588
1/24/16: AHr=63.53 CAP=96.85% Hlth=95.57% Hx=95.57% Gids=278. Mileage: 56,886


2/22/16: AHr=62.55 CAP=95.35% Hlth=93.99% Hx=93.99% SOH=98% Gids=273. Mileage: 57,363
Last edited by mwalsh on Sat May 21, 2016 12:16 am, edited 4 times in total.
2011 Blue Ocean SL with 72,000 miles.
2015 pack under warranty 12/30/15.
Tinted windows.
Michelin MXV4 tires.
L1 EVSE upgrade.
FIAMM horns.
Superbright LED lighting.
2013 sun visors.
LED shifter.
Heated seats.
GT-R map lamp lenses.
AV L2 EVSE.

User avatar
DNAinaGoodWay
Posts: 2757
Joined: Mon Dec 17, 2012 1:43 am
Delivery Date: 03 Dec 2012
Leaf Number: 23156
Location: Central Massachusetts

Re: Lizard Pack NOT Holding Up

Mon Feb 22, 2016 10:39 am

Seems that way, from the posts in the 2015 battery thread, some perform better than others. Generally the cooler climates outperforming the hotter areas.
'12 SL last reading @ 2 yr, 22k, 260 GIDs, 62.35 Ahr

'15 SV w/QC, Mfd 5/14, Leased 8/14, 292 GIDs, 64.38 Ahr when new
@ 36 months, 34k, 270 GID, 57.49 Ahr

'17 Bolt LT



6.72 kW Array

LeafMuranoDriver
Posts: 326
Joined: Wed May 13, 2015 8:15 am
Delivery Date: 01 May 2015
Leaf Number: 323189
Location: Los Angeles, CA

Re: Lizard Pack NOT Holding Up

Mon Feb 22, 2016 12:43 pm

Definitely disappointing when we've been told the new batteries should perform better.

I know my '15 sure hasn't performed as I expected.
2015 Leaf S w/ QC
Mfg: Jan. '15 // Pur: May '15
Best: 6/27/15 - 1,416 Miles - 292 GIDs - 63.11 Ahr - 22.6 kWh - 100% SOH - 97.2% Hx - 4 QC, 29 L2
Worst: 12/12/15 - 4,616 Miles - 259 GIDs - 55.02 Ahr - 20.1 kWh - 99% SOH - 82.8% Hx - 17 QC, 96 L2

User avatar
JeremyW
Posts: 1526
Joined: Sun Nov 13, 2011 12:53 am
Delivery Date: 23 Jun 2012
Leaf Number: 19136
Location: San Gabriel, CA

Re: Lizard Pack NOT Holding Up

Mon Feb 22, 2016 12:49 pm

DNAinaGoodWay wrote:Seems that way, from the posts in the 2015 battery thread, some perform better than others. Generally the cooler climates outperforming the hotter areas.

Well yeah, that's the way the originals were, too. Brian Brockman's "in an effort" message just turned out to be a small buffer above 100% SOH so that the car could last at best a summer longer in hot weather.

Great going there Nissan. :evil:
Former 2012 SL leasee 6/23/12 - 9/23/15
Now driving Honda Fit EV, License plate: CHADEMO
2000 Honda Insight for long trips

User avatar
DNAinaGoodWay
Posts: 2757
Joined: Mon Dec 17, 2012 1:43 am
Delivery Date: 03 Dec 2012
Leaf Number: 23156
Location: Central Massachusetts

Re: Lizard Pack NOT Holding Up

Mon Feb 22, 2016 2:43 pm

Doesn't bode well for the Leaf 2. Best to keep leasing.
'12 SL last reading @ 2 yr, 22k, 260 GIDs, 62.35 Ahr

'15 SV w/QC, Mfd 5/14, Leased 8/14, 292 GIDs, 64.38 Ahr when new
@ 36 months, 34k, 270 GID, 57.49 Ahr

'17 Bolt LT



6.72 kW Array

Evoforce
Posts: 677
Joined: Wed Mar 04, 2015 9:58 pm
Delivery Date: 28 Feb 2015
Location: Fountain Hills Arizona

Re: Lizard Pack NOT Holding Up

Tue Feb 23, 2016 12:14 am

I wish there wasn't a need for this thread. I, like the rest of you, was counting on these batteries being better. I have a couple of project cars that I was going to convert to leaf guts. Not now, especially when the battery is only lasting 2 years here. I have to decide if there is a way to effectively cool these batteries first. I may have to use a different manufacturers guts with better durability.
Last edited by Evoforce on Fri Feb 26, 2016 8:00 pm, edited 1 time in total.
*2011 Leaf 1 bought 2/28/15 @ 28,000ish mi 10 bar (8 bars @ 11/25/15 @ 37,453 ) (New lizard @ 39,275 mi @ 1/20/2016) Now 52,166 mi.
*Tesla Model S 61,000 mi
*2011 Leaf 2 bought 4/28/15 @ 24,000ish mi 12 bar (new lizard Dec. 2014 @ 22,273 mi) Now 35,485 mi

arnis
Posts: 762
Joined: Sat Jan 23, 2016 3:21 pm
Delivery Date: 23 Jul 2014
Leaf Number: 015896
Location: Estonia, Europe

Re: Lizard Pack NOT Holding Up

Tue Feb 23, 2016 6:57 am

How is Lizard pack identified and how can you be sure that you have the latest version of Leaf 24kWh pack?
Promises from Dealers are not worth much.
Short range EVs <30kWh -- Medium range: 30-60kWh -- Long range: >60kWh
Charging: Trickle <3kW -- Normal 3-22kW -- Fast 50-100kW -- Supercharging >100kW

memoryisram
Posts: 12
Joined: Fri Dec 05, 2014 8:26 am
Delivery Date: 19 Dec 2011
Leaf Number: 2335
Location: Northern CA

Re: Lizard Pack NOT Holding Up

Tue Feb 23, 2016 9:38 am

Replaced my failing pack in May 2015 with 48,136 miles, lizard pack was stats were:

AHr: 66.54
SOH: 100%
Hx: 101%

Now in Feburary 2016 with 58,686 miles on the odometer after living in much colder climate with the car in a cooled garage:

AHr: 61.67
SOH: 99%
Hx: 92.58%

90% of my charges are L1/L2, I rarely see more than 5 temp bars on the dash. I did notice a dip in the AHr earlier but it seemed to rebound after I drove it to VLBW and back to 100%. Just another point of data for those interested.

Evoforce
Posts: 677
Joined: Wed Mar 04, 2015 9:58 pm
Delivery Date: 28 Feb 2015
Location: Fountain Hills Arizona

Re: Lizard Pack NOT Holding Up

Tue Feb 23, 2016 9:41 pm

arnis wrote:How is Lizard pack identified and how can you be sure that you have the latest version of Leaf 24kWh pack?
Promises from Dealers are not worth much.


There was a lawsuit in the United States, Klee v Nissan and the remedy was that Nissan had to replace the degraded batteries with lizard or better chemistry. If they don't do it and it becomes known, at the least I would think, would be another round of new batteries and lawsuits.

The packs are sent to the dealers when qualifying at 8 bars and are ordered from the manufacturer at that time and not stockpiled at the dealer. The dealer does nothing in the transaction but the ordering, paperwork, installation and the return of the depleted battery back to the manufacturer. The manufacturer has the responsibility of providing the proper battery for installation.

The name of the thread is Amended Settlement in Klee v. Nissan. That thread explains the lawsuit in detail.
Last edited by Evoforce on Wed Mar 23, 2016 10:29 pm, edited 1 time in total.
*2011 Leaf 1 bought 2/28/15 @ 28,000ish mi 10 bar (8 bars @ 11/25/15 @ 37,453 ) (New lizard @ 39,275 mi @ 1/20/2016) Now 52,166 mi.
*Tesla Model S 61,000 mi
*2011 Leaf 2 bought 4/28/15 @ 24,000ish mi 12 bar (new lizard Dec. 2014 @ 22,273 mi) Now 35,485 mi

User avatar
mwalsh
Posts: 9482
Joined: Thu Apr 22, 2010 10:10 am
Delivery Date: 05 Jan 2011
Leaf Number: 0213
Location: Garden Grove, CA

Re: Lizard Pack NOT Holding Up

Sat Mar 19, 2016 7:35 am

mwalsh wrote:12/30/15: AHr=63.80 CAP=97.26% Hlth=100.00% Hx=100.00% Gids=277. Mileage: 56,588
1/24/16: AHr=63.53 CAP=96.85% Hlth=95.57% Hx=95.57% Gids=278. Mileage: 56,886
2/22/16: AHr=62.55 CAP=95.35% Hlth=93.99% Hx=93.99% SOH=98% Gids=273. Mileage: 57,363


Actually a slight improvement over last month:

3/19/16: AHr=62.92 CAP=95.91% Hlth=94.76% Hx=94.76% SOH=98% Gids=278. Mileage: 57,841

Needing to go back to my old job yesterday for a meeting and almost fully discharging the pack before recharging it overnight might have made the difference. Hard to say.
2011 Blue Ocean SL with 72,000 miles.
2015 pack under warranty 12/30/15.
Tinted windows.
Michelin MXV4 tires.
L1 EVSE upgrade.
FIAMM horns.
Superbright LED lighting.
2013 sun visors.
LED shifter.
Heated seats.
GT-R map lamp lenses.
AV L2 EVSE.

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