New Petition To Make Nissan Cover 100% of 2G Upgrade Costs

I encourage every current and potential Leaf owner/lessee to please sign my petition against Nissan. Let's make Nissan cover 100% of the costs for this 2G upgrade. We the consumers should not have to pay for Nissan's poor and greedy manufacturing decisions. They went the cheapest route, when they knew damn well 2G was a dying technology.

https://www.change.org/p/nissan-mot...the-costs-for-the-leaf-ev-2g-cellular-upgrade

No offense but is car wings really any loss?

I never even use telematics in my volt, no need

rmay635703 said:

No offense but is car wings really any loss?

I never even use telematics in my volt, no need

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I do not use the official NissanConnect app, but I do use a third-party app called EVA which essentially piggybacks off of the official app. Having these remote features are essential for activating the climate control. Especially if, like me, you live in a climate that has extreme highs and lows and you do not want to enter an incredibly hot or cold car interior.

But regardless of whether or not you use the features, it's still not right for Nissan to force their customers to pay any money when it was clearly poor and greedy manufacturing decisions that led to this fiasco in the first place.

I agree what Nissan did was wrong, I don't use that feature myself but what I think is really wrong is expecting lessees to pay to upgrade a car that they don't even own, thats ludicrous. I also think expecting someone to pay who's car is under warranty is not right but out of warranty is probably understandable, after all I remember when I purchased my '13 Leaf reading the small print stating that at some point in the near future 2G service may go away and Nissan wouldn't be responsible for 3rd party vendors, still it should be covered under the 3 year warranty.

rmay635703 said:

No offense but is car wings really any loss?

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It's useful to know when your car is done charging, isn't it? Or to remotely check on how much charge you have. Or to remotely turn on the heat, etc.

I do find it helpful to be able to remotely preheat our LEAF at times. However, I refuse to pay to upgrade to 3G. Why can't Nissan sell us an upgrade to LTE instead? Is it really that much more expensive? (I don't know.)

abasile said:

I do find it helpful to be able to remotely preheat our LEAF at times. However, I refuse to pay to upgrade to 3G. Why can't Nissan sell us an upgrade to LTE instead? Is it really that much more expensive? (I don't know.)

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That's exactly why I started this petition. I guarantee that it would of only cost Nissan slightly more money to use LTE, or at the very least 4G. But like with all giant corporations unfortunately, it's about offering the consumer as little as possible to reap the most profits. Which is why I too refuse to pay for this upgrade, I'll gladly wait until my lease runs out in June 2017 and get another EV instead. Please sign this petition and share it with everyone you know, the more signatures we get, the more we can show Nissan how we feel. And hopefully prevent this kind of debacle in future EV models.

So should Nissan "future proof" their cars? They could easily argue in court that 2g was available at the time they were designing the Leaf, and that was a viable option.

I'm more mad that my iPhone never worked with my ML55, and I had to buy a motorola or a Benz phone just to make or receive a phone call. We might all want to believe that Nissan is the evil empire, but many car companies out there screw us all over.

Jedlacks said:

So should Nissan "future proof" their cars? They could easily argue in court that 2g was available at the time they were designing the Leaf, and that was a viable option.

I'm more mad that my iPhone never worked with my ML55, and I had to buy a motorola or a Benz phone just to make or receive a phone call. We might all want to believe that Nissan is the evil empire, but many car companies out there screw us all over.

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All the more reason why we need to start holding them accountable for their actions. I'm not interested in what they may or may not be able to argue in court, 2G was well on its way out the door back in 2010 and they knew better. And there is especially no excuse for them to use 2G tech in a 2014 or 2015 model year vehicle. This is exactly why Tesla has gained such popularity in such a short amount of time, they do not actively seek to screw us all over with outdated tech.

I posted this petition on Nissan Electric's Facebook page and it was deleted a few hours later without a word. I've since reposted it, and will continue to do so. As far as I'm concerned this only further proves their acknowledgement of the fact that they screwed us over.

Agree there's a point for lessees, albeit a small point especially if you're months away from turning in your vehicle. However without knowing the terms of the ATT agreement it's hard for me to agree with the petition.

1-ATT could have offered access to its 2G network for free whereas a 3G connection may have resulted in a small fee to Nissan at time of inception

2- car wings was never intended to be permanently free yet Nissan has yet to offer subscription services and has no immediate plans to do so

3-As an owner of a Leaf, I plan on doing the upgrade. By the time 3G sunsets thinking 4-5 years from now, I'll be in another vehicle. While LTE is nice, the car wings app pushes very little data.

The copay is reasonable particularly if the subscription remains free.

Phatcat73 said:

3-As an owner of a Leaf, I plan on doing the upgrade. By the time 3G sunsets thinking 4-5 years from now, I'll be in another vehicle. While LTE is nice, the car wings app pushes very little data.

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I'm not signing the petition because we've owned our LEAF since 2011 and I don't feel that we're necessarily entitled to a free upgrade. But I still refuse to pay for an upgrade to 3G. Not only would our coverage be more reliable with available LTE, we may very well still have our LEAF in four or five years. In mountainous areas like ours, there seem to be locations where LTE service works well but 2G/3G is lacking or unreliable.

abasile said:

Phatcat73 said:

3-As an owner of a Leaf, I plan on doing the upgrade. By the time 3G sunsets thinking 4-5 years from now, I'll be in another vehicle. While LTE is nice, the car wings app pushes very little data.

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I'm not signing the petition because we've owned our LEAF since 2011 and I don't feel that we're necessarily entitled to a free upgrade. But I still refuse to pay for an upgrade to 3G. Not only would our coverage be more reliable with available LTE, we may very well still have our LEAF in four or five years. In mountainous areas like ours, there seem to be locations where LTE service works well but 2G/3G is lacking or unreliable.

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I don't know of any (current) 3G chip sets that aren't also LTE, so my guess is they installed an LTE/3G modem and are only "activating" the 3G service due to cost considerations. In other words, there's a good chance a future upgrade to LTE could be accomplished via firmware, unlike the older modems that (probably) used older 2G chip sets.
Of course, the only way to be sure is for someone to actually remove one of the (new) modems and examine the chip set, but I wouldn't be surprised if you will have an easier upgrade path to LTE when the time comes. The fact is, 3G coverage is still superior to LTE in non-urban areas, and we certainly don't need LTE bandwidth/speed for the telematics service.
I'm having my modem upgrade installed this Wednesday, and I don't think it's something Nissan should have to do for "free"; after all, they have provided the entire CW/EVconnect service (air time/servers/data storage) for free from day 1.

I suspect they would react better to a class action lawsuit than a petition, at least judging by warranty battery claims and all. :lol: I've yet to decide whether or not I will upgrade it in mine. When it stops working and I don't know the charge level of my car, I might be inclined to do it.

Do I understand correctly that this service is irrelevant to the base (non Nav) LEAF models ?

If so then I'm not an interested party, but if it turns out that my car *can* support carWings I will not support the petition. Nissan was upfront in pointing out that 2G would go away some day and a free upgrade could not be assumed; and to my mind has been generous in offering a free service without any end date.

That said, I would want to know that the subscription will continue to be free if I pay the $200 upgrade price.

I'd rather pay to upgrade, than see them charge a subscription fee, which they have held off from doing, so far...

SageBrush said:

Do I understand correctly that this service is irrelevant to the base (non Nav) LEAF models ?

If so then I'm not an interested party, but if it turns out that my car *can* support carWings I will not support the petition. Nissan was upfront in pointing out that 2G would go away some day and a free upgrade could not be assumed; and to my mind has been generous in offering a free service without any end date.

That said, I would want to know that the subscription will continue to be free if I pay the $200 upgrade price.

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Technically they are not providing this service for free, it was offered as one of my vehicle's included features at a $38k price tag. Think of it like when purchasing a new computer, the retailer includes Microsoft Office in the price. Or think of it like paying for the Adobe Creative Cloud subscription, where as long as you keep making the monthly payments you continue to get the newest updated software versions.

Well my lease is the subscription and Nissan should give me the upgrade. I don't see them charging for any of the safety recall notices that can cause major problems. And some of the time I have my dog in the car while I run into a store in the middle of summer, and it's essential for me to be able to remotely activate the climate control.

kevintylernelson said:

Technically they are not providing this service for free, it was offered as one of my vehicle's included features

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Did Nissan promise free for life upgrades and subscription ? I thought not - in fact, I am under the impression than Nissan stated that would not be the case, but I'm a to-be new owner of a used car and not well versed in the small print.

Addendum: The user manual for the 2013 LEAF on page 9-17 states

.
CARWINGS™ subscription services
will automatically terminate at the end of the initial
free term if you do not wish to renew your subscription
agreement at the prices then in effect.

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So OP, be careful what your wish for. Nissan might accede to your demand to put in a 3G+ modem and then charge you monthly for a subscription.

I am happy not to upgrade to 3G as long as they get rid of the OK at startup.
Now I can't send anymore data to them, can they just get rid of the legal notice?

yorkhung said:

I am happy not to upgrade to 3G as long as they get rid of the OK at startup.
Now I can't send anymore data to them, can they just get rid of the legal notice?

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The 'OK at startup' is in the NAV software and would require a dealer loaded update. Since Nissan has not offered an update, so far, I seriously doubt they ever will. The 2013 forward models changed this to once a month instead of at every startup.

Technically, the car can (and will still try) to send data to Nissan. Without the 2G service available for the radio, it will be unsuccessful at every attempt.