alozzy
Posts: 714
Joined: Fri Jan 20, 2017 4:25 pm
Delivery Date: 18 Jan 2017
Location: Vancouver, BC
Contact: Website

Re: After 2 weeks with a Bolt, here's everything I miss about the Leaf

Thu Jul 27, 2017 12:53 am

I don't get the point of this thread, the OP just seems to be trying to rub our noses in it. Enjoy your Bolt, but serious who but you cares. Go hangout in the Bolt forums or do something useful instead.

Meanwhile, I'll still enjoy my Leaf and I'll not resent it for all the things it isn't. It's shortcomings, particularly with respect to range, are well documented so why on earth did you buy a Leaf in the first place?

I might get excited about a Bolt when I can buy a used one for less than $10K. Until then, meh.
Vancouver, CA owner of a 2013 Ocean Blue SV + QC, purchased 01/2017 in WA
Zencar 12/20/24/30A L1/L2 portable EVSE
1-1/4" Curt #11396 hitch
After market, DIY LED DRLs
LeafSpy Pro + Konnwei KW902 ELM327 BT OBDII dongle
Loving my first BEV :D

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Nubo
Posts: 4508
Joined: Fri May 28, 2010 11:01 am
Delivery Date: 31 Oct 2014
Location: Vallejo, CA

Re: After 2 weeks with a Bolt, here's everything I miss the Leaf

Thu Jul 27, 2017 2:53 am

ElectricMonkey wrote::?:
Smells like progress. Congrats on the new car. Nissan had definitely been resting on their laurels for a couple of years now awaiting some serious competition in the EV space. It will be interesting to see how LEAF2 rises to the challenge.

In the meantime I'm more than satisfied with my 24kWH LEAF, and haven't made up my mind yet on how to handle the upcoming lease ending late this year. I could go either way: LEAF2, non-Nissan EV, buy out the lease, or just fall back to 1-car family until the dust settles. One thing's for certain, EVs will continue to improve.

I'd definitely be interested in a more detailed owner review if you're so-inclined.
I noticed you're still working with polymers.

powersurge
Posts: 768
Joined: Wed Oct 21, 2015 10:24 am
Delivery Date: 06 Dec 2014
Location: Long Island, NY

Re: After 2 weeks with a Bolt, here's everything I miss about the Leaf

Thu Jul 27, 2017 4:13 am

Hey Electric Monkey....

Your long list of complains is a very nice "literary expose", however it is totally off mark. You sound like you are looking for every negative quality that a car can have.

Most of your complaints have nothing to do with the Leaf as a specific car. if all those things actually happened to you, you are the most unlucky person driving... I loved all of your ways of "worrying if I will get home". I have never "worried about getting home". If you indeed worried so much about getting home, then you either did not charge the car enough, or drove distances farther than the Leaf is capable. Then you are guilty of not planning your charging. Also, it is impossible for you to say that the Leaf is not able to reach highway speed. The Leaf is a faster car than most cars its size. I will not try to argue any more of your points because I do not have the interest in wasting my time.

I think the MAIN aspect of your Leaf complaints comes to the fact that you LEASED the car. I have seen this all too often that people make complaints by comparing the product against all of the benefits of a product in a completely different class (e.g., gas car). As a leaser, you never had any investment in the car you were RENTING... Of course, when you rent a car, it is easy to complain about it because you can easily find complaints, much like you can complain about your service at a restaurant.

Go be happy that you gave back your Leaf, and join the other forum...

LeftieBiker
Posts: 7383
Joined: Wed May 22, 2013 3:17 am
Delivery Date: 31 May 2013
Location: Upstate New York, US

Re: After 2 weeks with a Bolt, here's everything I miss about the Leaf

Thu Jul 27, 2017 4:49 am

I think the MAIN aspect of your Leaf complaints comes to the fact that you LEASED the car. I have seen this all too often that people make complaints by comparing the product against all of the benefits of a product in a completely different class (e.g., gas car). As a leaser, you never had any investment in the car you were RENTING... Of course, when you rent a car, it is easy to complain about it because you can easily find complaints, much like you can complain about your service at a restaurant.


That's pretty much nonsense. I leased my Leaf, with no initial expectation of buying it, and that has had no effect on what I've thought or written about the car.
2013 "Brilliant Silver" SV with Premium Package and no QC, and 2009 Vectrix VX-1 with 18 Leaf cells.

The most offensive, tasteless phrase in use here is "Pulled the trigger." I no longer respond to posts that use it.

Durandal
Posts: 315
Joined: Wed Sep 21, 2016 8:55 am
Delivery Date: 22 Sep 2016
Leaf Number: 025018
Location: Central Arkansas

Re: After 2 weeks with a Bolt, here's everything I miss about the Leaf

Thu Jul 27, 2017 7:21 am

I agree, that whether or not the guy leased the vehicle has little to no bearing on the usability of the vehicle. Keep in mind on range that many people take the rated range at face value, which isn't any good if you're going 70mph on the freeway. Even when I go 45mph, my Leaf will never ever get the rated 80 miles of range. Sure, it's due to degradation, and yes, I was aware of that prior to purchasing my Leaf used, but not all people knew that prior to purchase, especially those who purchased a 2011 or 2012 Leaf brand new.

Sure, maybe he could have simply moved on without coming here and saying, "Man, I didn't know how bad I had it until I didn't have it bad." I'm sure I'll be thinking the exact same things when I get my Tesla Model 3, and no longer have to plan my trips based upon HVAC usage, driving 60mph on the freeway instead of 70mph, taking back roads to take my daughter to dance class so that way I don't have to stop at a charging location on my way back. The Leaf works great for me as a commuter car, but honestly it sucks for everything else. Every day I'm tempted to go buy a used Tesla and just extract the battery pack from my Leaf for off-grid storage, scrapping the rest of the vehicle. No kidding.

Instead I will do the financially responsible thing and limp along with my Leaf until I get my Model 3 in mid to late 2018.. It's OK. I waited 20 years to get my Leaf, I can wait 1 more year for my Tesla.
Pulled the trigger on going EV on 10/2016 with a 2012 Leaf, and a Tesla Model 3 reservation expected to receive in June 2018.

Phatcat73
Posts: 433
Joined: Fri Feb 08, 2013 2:44 pm
Leaf Number: 401511
Location: Buffalo Grove, Il

Re: After 2 weeks with a Bolt, here's everything I miss about the Leaf

Thu Jul 27, 2017 7:50 am

I prefer the suspension/ insulation of the Leaf vs the econobox feel of the Bolt.
2016 SV; purchased 20-Jan-17, <5k, 98% SOH; 01-Apr-17
2013 SV; purchased 6-March-13 44k, 81% SOH; 3-Apr-17
2015 S; purchased 29-July-14, moved to AZ Nov-2014, 19k, 83% SOH; 30-Mar-17
(LD storage) 2009 Ford Escape Hybrid 4x2), 101k

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TonyWilliams
Posts: 10032
Joined: Sat Feb 19, 2011 1:48 am
Location: San Diego
Contact: Website

Re: After 2 weeks with a Bolt, here's everything I miss about the Leaf

Thu Jul 27, 2017 8:21 am

This thread doesn't appear to be a comparison at all, but a LEAF bashing.

I've acquired (leased) my third LEAF as a company car. I am quite impressed by all the little improvements, with one exception... the car accelerates slower. I particularly like the much improved DC charge rate, nearly fully charging in just 30 minutes. This is a company car, and it doesn't need more than 100 miles of range. We pay $270 per month on a 36 month lease, zero down. We will get the $2500 state rebate.

We are looking at getting a second company car, and the two major contenders are the Bolt EV or the Mercedes B-Class ED / B250e. I wouldn't probably consider a LEAF v2.0, simply because a 40kWh car won't be a major improvement over a 30kWh car for us. Plus, I'm sure it will be silly expensive because it's new. Another possibility is a used 2012-2014 Toyota RAV4 EV (my daily driver). We can't really consider the insanely cheap Fiat 500e, since the car needs to be able to haul packages and people.

Currently, our office manager is driving my personal Mercedes B-Class (lease expires Oct 2017), and I'm confident that the stark Bolt EV interior and relatively uncomfortable seats will be a shock. We don't need 238 miles of range ever, so that's not a selling point. But, the Bolt is ridiculously cheap now, with lease deals almost on par with a legacy LEAF. I can't seem to find a real deal on the Mercedes (the lease on the current one is about $650).

So, the Bolt EV is at the top of the list, based on a cheap lease, ability to carry people and packages, and we still get the $2500 California state rebate.

ElectricMonkey
Posts: 80
Joined: Sat Aug 16, 2014 11:55 am
Delivery Date: 16 Aug 2014

Re: After 2 weeks with a Bolt, here's everything I miss about the Leaf

Thu Jul 27, 2017 10:44 am

This thread doesn't appear to be a comparison at all, but a LEAF bashing.
...
So, the Bolt EV is at the top of the list, based on a cheap lease, ability to carry people and packages, and we still get the $2500 California state rebate.


Leaf bashing was actually my intention. I'm just having fun with you guys. Some of you are taking me too seriously. Obviously technology has moved considerably in the last 3 years, which was the point of leasing, rather than buying.

Yes, I'm on the Bolt forum as well. The most important thing I've seen discussed there is what type of seat cushion to buy :mrgreen: And people are pissed that they've got to spend extra money on a seat cushion! That cracks me up. I've literally spent more on a bottle of wine!

If you want a comparison, the Bolt gets 3 times the range and twice the acceleration for 15% less lease payment (in my experience). It has "self healing" tires so you don't need a spare, jack, and tool (which I actually had to use). The tires seem to have more tread, so it shouldn't hydroplane in the rain or need new tires so soon. The base model doesn't have cheap, plastic hub caps like the Leaf, and the distance from tire to rim should keep the rims from hitting the ground on pot holes. The ride, handling, and comfort feel about the same to me, personally, although I've read plenty of opinions that differ. The horn sounds identical to my neighbor's full-sized pickup truck, versus some little bird chirping in your ear, so people can actually hear you when you need them to.

Regarding acceleration, we have a relatively short, uphill, HOV ramp near work, and people are going 80mph+ at the top. My Leaf was only able to reach maybe 55 to 60mph by then. I almost got run off the road a bunch of times. With the Bolt, I have to actually be careful not get going too fast on that ramp.

Anyway, Nissan did a good enough job on the Leaf that I don't actually regret Leasing it 3 years ago, but really I'm just happy that there are better options today.

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jlv
Posts: 570
Joined: Thu Apr 24, 2014 6:08 pm
Delivery Date: 30 Apr 2014
Leaf Number: 424487
Location: Massachusetts

Re: After 2 weeks with a Bolt, here's everything I miss about the Leaf

Thu Jul 27, 2017 11:15 am

You obviously didn't have the TCU upgrade done on your LEAF, or otherwise 12V battery problems would be on your list, too.
'13 SL+Prem (mfg 12/13, leased 4/14, bought 5/17)Tesla S 75D (3/17)
Model 3 reservation
(Probably no LEAF2 for me)

RonDawg
Posts: 2714
Joined: Sat Jan 12, 2013 3:46 am
Delivery Date: 11 Jan 2013
Leaf Number: 027089
Location: SoCal

Re: After 2 weeks with a Bolt, here's everything I miss about the Leaf

Thu Jul 27, 2017 11:52 am

ElectricMonkey wrote:I miss replacing very expensive windshield wipers every 3-6 months.


Who told you to do that? I live in Southern California (where the heat and smog love to degrade rubber parts) and I NEVER replaced the wipers on my Leaf for the entire 3 year lease period. They worked just fine the entire time.

I miss having to replace the brake fluid after only 20K miles.


Nissan's recommended interval is every 2 years, on par with the recommendations of many other manufacturers and independent mechanics. Any more frequent than that and you were just wasting money. Some feel that every 2 years is itself too frequent.

I miss needing a wheel alignment after only 20K miles.


I never needed one in 3 years either, as evidenced by the wear on the tires. If your local roads suck that badly, the Bolt probably won't be any better.

I miss having to buy my own spare tire, jack, and tire iron (which, oh by the way, I was very glad I had at point).


Does the Bolt come with these?

I miss having both remote batteries die on me, even though I only ever used one remote.


Not unique to Nissan, the ones on the eGolf are just as bad if not worse.

I missing having to replace the plastic hub caps because I hit a pot hole on tires that sit so close to the rims.


The Leaf S (the only version to use steelies and hubcaps) has 205/55/16 tires, so the sidewalls are 4.4 inches tall. The Bolt uses 215/50/17, and on alloy rims, and the sidewalls are 4.2 inches tall. So the Leaf's tires are actually slightly taller than the Bolt's, but barely.

If your local road conditions and/or your driving are so bad that you keep having to replace plastic hubcaps, the Bolt will end up being more expensive. You don't have to replace hubcaps, but a bent alloy rim is a different story.

I miss having to trick the charge timer into charging during the best time-of-use hours.


Unfortunately that is a downside with the Leaf S. Not an issue with Leaf SV/SL owners.
Blue Ocean 2012 Leaf SV, lost that 1st bar on 11/21/2015 at 26,435 miles.
Lease returned on 12/23/2015. Final LeafStat figures: 225 Gids, 17.44 kWH, SOC 91.89%, SOH 82.36%, 69.49% HX, 54.57 Ahr, battery temp 61.8 F
Now driving a 2015 VW eGolf SEL

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