After 2 weeks with a Bolt, here's everything I miss about the Leaf

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I miss not knowing if I’ll have enough juice to make it home.

I miss knowing the exact location of every charge station in my area.

I miss driving <55mph on an empty freeway after working late, for fear that I won’t make it home if I go any faster.

I miss relying on heated seats to keep me warm in the winter, for fear that I won’t make it home if I run the heater.

I miss driving with the windows down on a noisy freeway in the summer, for fear that I won’t make it home if I run the AC.

I miss constantly wiping down the inside of my fogged windshield, for fear that I won’t make it home if I run the defrost.

I miss that feeling I used to get when I had zero juice left and there was a gas guzzling SUV parked at the only charge station around.

I miss spending my lunch hour eating at whatever charge station I can find.

I miss that feeling I used to get in the pit of my stomach when I was merging onto the freeway before being able to get up to the same speed as traffic.

I miss that feeling I used to get when it rained, and the car would hydroplane at anything over 55mph.

I miss having to rely on a horn that clearly belongs on a child’s tricycle when I’m about to be run off the road by a gas guzzling SUV.

I miss replacing very expensive windshield wipers every 3-6 months.

I miss having to buy a new set of tires after only 20K miles.

I miss having to replace the brake fluid after only 20K miles.

I miss needing a wheel alignment after only 20K miles.

I miss having to buy my own spare tire, jack, and tire iron (which, oh by the way, I was very glad I had at point).

I miss being told by the service department that I’ve been degrading the battery by frequently using the quick charger.

I miss having both remote batteries die on me, even though I only ever used one remote.

I miss the fact that the charge port door locks automatically, and can’t be opened without a key, even though there’s clearly nothing to steal in there.

I missing having to replace the plastic hub caps because I hit a pot hole on tires that sit so close to the rims.

I miss having to trick the charge timer into charging during the best time-of-use hours.

But most of all, I miss having a lease payment that's 15% higher than a car with 3 times the range, and twice the acceleration. That’s what I miss the most.
 
I leased a '13 Leaf SV w/both packages for 2 years. I've owned a use '13 SV w/premium only since July 2015 to replace it.
ElectricMonkey said:
I miss not knowing if I’ll have enough juice to make it home.

I miss knowing the exact location of every charge station in my area.

I miss driving <55mph on an empty freeway after working late, for fear that I won’t make it home if I go any faster.

I miss relying on heated seats to keep me warm in the winter, for fear that I won’t make it home if I run the heater.

I miss driving with the windows down on a noisy freeway in the summer, for fear that I won’t make it home if I run the AC.

I miss constantly wiping down the inside of my fogged windshield, for fear that I won’t make it home if I run the defrost.

I miss that feeling I used to get when I had zero juice left and there was a gas guzzling SUV parked at the only charge station around.

I miss spending my lunch hour eating at whatever charge station I can find.

I miss that feeling I used to get in the pit of my stomach when I was merging onto the freeway before being able to get up to the same speed as traffic.

I miss that feeling I used to get when it rained, and the car would hydroplane at anything over 55mph.
I've not had these problems. I've only had one very close call once over my 4 years of Leaf driving.
ElectricMonkey said:
I miss replacing very expensive windshield wipers every 3-6 months.

I miss having to buy a new set of tires after only 20K miles.

I miss having to replace the brake fluid after only 20K miles.

I miss needing a wheel alignment after only 20K miles.
I never replaced the wipers on my 2 year leased Leaf. I bought refills from a Honda dealer for cheap (don't have the receipt handy but I'm pretty sure was under $20 total) around March 2017 as they were streaking badly at that point: http://www.mynissanleaf.com/viewtopic.php?p=489698#p489698 on the used Leaf I bought in July 2015.

My original leased Leaf had enough tread left on its original tires after past 23K miles to not get dinged by NMAC at lease return. Three tires on my used Leaf with under 24K miles were very worn. I replaced all 4 w/Ecopia EP422 Plus. 23K miles later and all still have plenty of tread.

I never changed the brake fluid on my leased Leaf nor the used one I have now. Been looking to test the fluid since Nissan's recommended intervals seem excessive and silly.

Leased Leaf never needed an alignment. Used Leaf I had an alignment done when I bought the 4 tires. Alignment still looks ok: no uneven wear. I did buy lifetime alignment, so I need to find some time to get it checked and re-adjusted, if needed.
ElectricMonkey said:
I miss having to buy my own spare tire, jack, and tire iron (which, oh by the way, I was very glad I had at point).

I miss being told by the service department that I’ve been degrading the battery by frequently using the quick charger.
Never experienced the above. The latter point is moot on my current one, as well. It doesn't have a CHAdeMO inlet.
ElectricMonkey said:
I miss the fact that the charge port door locks automatically, and can’t be opened without a key, even though there’s clearly nothing to steal in there.
It's better than Teslas where their flap closes automatically. It is NOT conducive to plug sharing.
ElectricMonkey said:
I missing having to replace the plastic hub caps because I hit a pot hole on tires that sit so close to the rims.

I miss having to trick the charge timer into charging during the best time-of-use hours.
Never had plastic hub caps. Never had a problem.

I'm not sure what you mean by trick. Most of my charging is done for free at work. If you want to charge at cheaper rates, you're going to have a set a timer somewhere or manually plug in or unplug at the right times.
 
I don't get the point of this thread, the OP just seems to be trying to rub our noses in it. Enjoy your Bolt, but serious who but you cares. Go hangout in the Bolt forums or do something useful instead.

Meanwhile, I'll still enjoy my Leaf and I'll not resent it for all the things it isn't. It's shortcomings, particularly with respect to range, are well documented so why on earth did you buy a Leaf in the first place?

I might get excited about a Bolt when I can buy a used one for less than $10K. Until then, meh.
 
ElectricMonkey said:
Smells like progress. Congrats on the new car. Nissan had definitely been resting on their laurels for a couple of years now awaiting some serious competition in the EV space. It will be interesting to see how LEAF2 rises to the challenge.

In the meantime I'm more than satisfied with my 24kWH LEAF, and haven't made up my mind yet on how to handle the upcoming lease ending late this year. I could go either way: LEAF2, non-Nissan EV, buy out the lease, or just fall back to 1-car family until the dust settles. One thing's for certain, EVs will continue to improve.

I'd definitely be interested in a more detailed owner review if you're so-inclined.
 
Hey Electric Monkey....

Your long list of complains is a very nice "literary expose", however it is totally off mark. You sound like you are looking for every negative quality that a car can have.

Most of your complaints have nothing to do with the Leaf as a specific car. if all those things actually happened to you, you are the most unlucky person driving... I loved all of your ways of "worrying if I will get home". I have never "worried about getting home". If you indeed worried so much about getting home, then you either did not charge the car enough, or drove distances farther than the Leaf is capable. Then you are guilty of not planning your charging. Also, it is impossible for you to say that the Leaf is not able to reach highway speed. The Leaf is a faster car than most cars its size. I will not try to argue any more of your points because I do not have the interest in wasting my time.

I think the MAIN aspect of your Leaf complaints comes to the fact that you LEASED the car. I have seen this all too often that people make complaints by comparing the product against all of the benefits of a product in a completely different class (e.g., gas car). As a leaser, you never had any investment in the car you were RENTING... Of course, when you rent a car, it is easy to complain about it because you can easily find complaints, much like you can complain about your service at a restaurant.

Go be happy that you gave back your Leaf, and join the other forum...
 
I think the MAIN aspect of your Leaf complaints comes to the fact that you LEASED the car. I have seen this all too often that people make complaints by comparing the product against all of the benefits of a product in a completely different class (e.g., gas car). As a leaser, you never had any investment in the car you were RENTING... Of course, when you rent a car, it is easy to complain about it because you can easily find complaints, much like you can complain about your service at a restaurant.

That's pretty much nonsense. I leased my Leaf, with no initial expectation of buying it, and that has had no effect on what I've thought or written about the car.
 
I agree, that whether or not the guy leased the vehicle has little to no bearing on the usability of the vehicle. Keep in mind on range that many people take the rated range at face value, which isn't any good if you're going 70mph on the freeway. Even when I go 45mph, my Leaf will never ever get the rated 80 miles of range. Sure, it's due to degradation, and yes, I was aware of that prior to purchasing my Leaf used, but not all people knew that prior to purchase, especially those who purchased a 2011 or 2012 Leaf brand new.

Sure, maybe he could have simply moved on without coming here and saying, "Man, I didn't know how bad I had it until I didn't have it bad." I'm sure I'll be thinking the exact same things when I get my Tesla Model 3, and no longer have to plan my trips based upon HVAC usage, driving 60mph on the freeway instead of 70mph, taking back roads to take my daughter to dance class so that way I don't have to stop at a charging location on my way back. The Leaf works great for me as a commuter car, but honestly it sucks for everything else. Every day I'm tempted to go buy a used Tesla and just extract the battery pack from my Leaf for off-grid storage, scrapping the rest of the vehicle. No kidding.

Instead I will do the financially responsible thing and limp along with my Leaf until I get my Model 3 in mid to late 2018.. It's OK. I waited 20 years to get my Leaf, I can wait 1 more year for my Tesla.
 
This thread doesn't appear to be a comparison at all, but a LEAF bashing.

I've acquired (leased) my third LEAF as a company car. I am quite impressed by all the little improvements, with one exception... the car accelerates slower. I particularly like the much improved DC charge rate, nearly fully charging in just 30 minutes. This is a company car, and it doesn't need more than 100 miles of range. We pay $270 per month on a 36 month lease, zero down. We will get the $2500 state rebate.

We are looking at getting a second company car, and the two major contenders are the Bolt EV or the Mercedes B-Class ED / B250e. I wouldn't probably consider a LEAF v2.0, simply because a 40kWh car won't be a major improvement over a 30kWh car for us. Plus, I'm sure it will be silly expensive because it's new. Another possibility is a used 2012-2014 Toyota RAV4 EV (my daily driver). We can't really consider the insanely cheap Fiat 500e, since the car needs to be able to haul packages and people.

Currently, our office manager is driving my personal Mercedes B-Class (lease expires Oct 2017), and I'm confident that the stark Bolt EV interior and relatively uncomfortable seats will be a shock. We don't need 238 miles of range ever, so that's not a selling point. But, the Bolt is ridiculously cheap now, with lease deals almost on par with a legacy LEAF. I can't seem to find a real deal on the Mercedes (the lease on the current one is about $650).

So, the Bolt EV is at the top of the list, based on a cheap lease, ability to carry people and packages, and we still get the $2500 California state rebate.
 
This thread doesn't appear to be a comparison at all, but a LEAF bashing.
...
So, the Bolt EV is at the top of the list, based on a cheap lease, ability to carry people and packages, and we still get the $2500 California state rebate.

Leaf bashing was actually my intention. I'm just having fun with you guys. Some of you are taking me too seriously. Obviously technology has moved considerably in the last 3 years, which was the point of leasing, rather than buying.

Yes, I'm on the Bolt forum as well. The most important thing I've seen discussed there is what type of seat cushion to buy :mrgreen: And people are pissed that they've got to spend extra money on a seat cushion! That cracks me up. I've literally spent more on a bottle of wine!

If you want a comparison, the Bolt gets 3 times the range and twice the acceleration for 15% less lease payment (in my experience). It has "self healing" tires so you don't need a spare, jack, and tool (which I actually had to use). The tires seem to have more tread, so it shouldn't hydroplane in the rain or need new tires so soon. The base model doesn't have cheap, plastic hub caps like the Leaf, and the distance from tire to rim should keep the rims from hitting the ground on pot holes. The ride, handling, and comfort feel about the same to me, personally, although I've read plenty of opinions that differ. The horn sounds identical to my neighbor's full-sized pickup truck, versus some little bird chirping in your ear, so people can actually hear you when you need them to.

Regarding acceleration, we have a relatively short, uphill, HOV ramp near work, and people are going 80mph+ at the top. My Leaf was only able to reach maybe 55 to 60mph by then. I almost got run off the road a bunch of times. With the Bolt, I have to actually be careful not get going too fast on that ramp.

Anyway, Nissan did a good enough job on the Leaf that I don't actually regret Leasing it 3 years ago, but really I'm just happy that there are better options today.
 
ElectricMonkey said:
I miss replacing very expensive windshield wipers every 3-6 months.

Who told you to do that? I live in Southern California (where the heat and smog love to degrade rubber parts) and I NEVER replaced the wipers on my Leaf for the entire 3 year lease period. They worked just fine the entire time.

I miss having to replace the brake fluid after only 20K miles.

Nissan's recommended interval is every 2 years, on par with the recommendations of many other manufacturers and independent mechanics. Any more frequent than that and you were just wasting money. Some feel that every 2 years is itself too frequent.

I miss needing a wheel alignment after only 20K miles.

I never needed one in 3 years either, as evidenced by the wear on the tires. If your local roads suck that badly, the Bolt probably won't be any better.

I miss having to buy my own spare tire, jack, and tire iron (which, oh by the way, I was very glad I had at point).

Does the Bolt come with these?

I miss having both remote batteries die on me, even though I only ever used one remote.

Not unique to Nissan, the ones on the eGolf are just as bad if not worse.

I missing having to replace the plastic hub caps because I hit a pot hole on tires that sit so close to the rims.

The Leaf S (the only version to use steelies and hubcaps) has 205/55/16 tires, so the sidewalls are 4.4 inches tall. The Bolt uses 215/50/17, and on alloy rims, and the sidewalls are 4.2 inches tall. So the Leaf's tires are actually slightly taller than the Bolt's, but barely.

If your local road conditions and/or your driving are so bad that you keep having to replace plastic hubcaps, the Bolt will end up being more expensive. You don't have to replace hubcaps, but a bent alloy rim is a different story.

I miss having to trick the charge timer into charging during the best time-of-use hours.

Unfortunately that is a downside with the Leaf S. Not an issue with Leaf SV/SL owners.
 
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