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IssacZachary
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Posts: 741
Joined: Fri Jan 13, 2017 9:57 am
Delivery Date: 15 Nov 2016
Leaf Number: 420789
Location: Gunnison, CO, USA

Re: Winter has cut my love for my Leaf :(

Sun Jan 07, 2018 11:03 am

Deoc wrote:The heat pump has its limits, below 35-30F the heat pump can't get more heat from the outside so the resistance heater has to work, this one is inside the car and doesnt use any liquids on the 2013 and up models, so blocking the grill doesnt do anything,

Yes, at a certain temperature the heat pump stops working and it goes to resistance heat. But it's closer to 5*F-10*F when I've noticed it go from heat pump to resistance heat in my 2013 SL. And even then, the outside temperature isn't likely going to stay at such freezing temperatures all winter long. Some days are warmer than others. Even here where I've driven my Leaf in -35*F weather one day in a week it can be 40*F. It seems to me that it's better to keep air flow to the heat exchangers because of this. After all, this isn't an ICE that needs to be kept at boiling temperatures with it's own heat. Instead we're trying to heat up a freezing cold heat exchanger with no noteworthy source of heat except cold ambient air.
LeftieBiker wrote:You seem to be thinking that the grille block seals the motor compartment. That doesn't happen. People have run the A/C with one in place. It just reduces airflow.

That's the point. It reduces air flow. You don't want to reduce air flow over a heat exchanger. This I know. After all, I own a 1972 air cooled VW Beetle. The more air that flows through it the more heat is exchanged. The less air that flows through it the less heat is exchanged. The less heat is exchanged the less efficient it is. The less efficient it is, more energy is used.
2013 SL 50,000 miles.
12 bars until 44,300 miles on June 2, 2017. :D
11 bars current. :)
The Nissan Leaf is the fourth best long distance car for highway driving. >>Best Long Distance Cars<<

LeftieBiker
Posts: 8391
Joined: Wed May 22, 2013 3:17 am
Delivery Date: 31 May 2013
Location: Upstate New York, US

Re: Winter has cut my love for my Leaf :(

Sun Jan 07, 2018 2:37 pm

That's the point. It reduces air flow. You don't want to reduce air flow over a heat exchanger. This I know. After all, I own a 1972 air cooled VW Beetle. The more air that flows through it the more heat is exchanged. The less air that flows through it the less heat is exchanged. The less heat is exchanged the less efficient it is. The less efficient it is, more energy is used.


Let me put this another way. I've been using the grille block for four Winters now (I'm usually late remembering it, though) and the range is either unaffected or it increases slightly. You argument makes sense on paper, but in application I suspect that the system's physical parameters cancel out the benefit of having increased airflow when that air is close to the lower limit of the system's capabilities. My own thinking, based on my experiences, is that it would prefer smaller amounts of warmer air.
2013 "Brilliant Silver" SV with Premium and no QC, a 2009 Vectrix VX-1 W/18 Leaf modules, and 3 EZIP E-bicycles.
PLEASE don't PM me with Leaf questions. Just post in the topic that seems most appropriate.

Levenkay
Posts: 460
Joined: Mon Sep 26, 2011 10:01 pm
Delivery Date: 16 May 2013
Leaf Number: 302737
Location: Portland, OR

Re: Winter has cut my love for my Leaf :(

Sun Jan 07, 2018 10:51 pm

LeftieBiker wrote:in application I suspect that the system's physical parameters cancel out the benefit of having increased airflow when that air is close to the lower limit of the system's capabilities. My own thinking, based on my experiences, is that it would prefer smaller amounts of warmer air.
Hadn't thought about this before, but that sounds plausible; the heat pump might be able to suck up heat dissipated from the motor and inverter that way, if it isn't being whooshed out of the engine compartment.

LeftieBiker
Posts: 8391
Joined: Wed May 22, 2013 3:17 am
Delivery Date: 31 May 2013
Location: Upstate New York, US

Re: Winter has cut my love for my Leaf :(

Sun Jan 07, 2018 11:29 pm

The Bolt, though it lacks a heatpump, scavenges heat from the drive electronics and uses it to slightly heat the cabin even with the heat off - though I assume not with the A/C on.
2013 "Brilliant Silver" SV with Premium and no QC, a 2009 Vectrix VX-1 W/18 Leaf modules, and 3 EZIP E-bicycles.
PLEASE don't PM me with Leaf questions. Just post in the topic that seems most appropriate.

tadmcmichael
Posts: 1
Joined: Tue Feb 21, 2017 11:20 am
Delivery Date: 21 Feb 2017
Leaf Number: 327971

Re: Winter has cut my love for my Leaf :(

Mon Jan 08, 2018 5:02 am

We are in Atlanta and have had a bit of a cold snap for a couple of weeks. Range has been diminished as would be expected. However, what I didn’t expect is that the counter is showing far less range after turning the car on after charging. Car showed 72 Miles this morning vs 92 Miles a month ago. Is it normal for the onboard computer to compensate for the cold weather?

LeafSpy says SOH is 94% is 2015 Leaf S on Level 1 charging.

powersurge
Posts: 911
Joined: Wed Oct 21, 2015 10:24 am
Delivery Date: 06 Dec 2014
Location: Long Island, NY

Re: Winter has cut my love for my Leaf :(

Mon Jan 08, 2018 5:35 am

Full heat uses same energy as driving the car. 100 miles ranged turns into 40-50 miles range.

use electric blanket from cigarette lighter
set heat to 68 degrees and only 1-2 bars of blower speed
hats and gloves and heated seats and steering wheel

It is not as bad as OP described it.

Foschas
Posts: 70
Joined: Thu Jul 30, 2015 6:35 pm
Delivery Date: 31 Jul 2015
Leaf Number: 320277
Location: Mass

Re: Winter has cut my love for my Leaf :(

Mon Jan 08, 2018 10:47 am

My 2015 with 12 bars and 30K is also not liking my commute either. Use all the tricks and still get dashed lines with my 44 miles back road round trip in the zero degree weather we had. Was not so bad last year for me because I could quick charge at my dealer. The dealers QC has been down for 10 months now though and it’s the only one around.
So I use my level two and need at least 2 hours before I can think about another very limited trek.

Deaf ears at my dealer though. New QC has been installed for three months and still no go. So I feel your pain. No fun being limited by your car’s range

LeftieBiker
Posts: 8391
Joined: Wed May 22, 2013 3:17 am
Delivery Date: 31 May 2013
Location: Upstate New York, US

Re: Winter has cut my love for my Leaf :(

Mon Jan 08, 2018 12:06 pm

We are in Atlanta and have had a bit of a cold snap for a couple of weeks. Range has been diminished as would be expected. However, what I didn’t expect is that the counter is showing far less range after turning the car on after charging. Car showed 72 Miles this morning vs 92 Miles a month ago. Is it normal for the onboard computer to compensate for the cold weather?


The range estimator (called the "Guess O Meter" because of its inaccuracy, especially at the beginning of a trip) goes by the car's energy efficiency over the last few minutes before it was previously shut off. So if you were using the heat on the last trip it will show less available range for that reason.
2013 "Brilliant Silver" SV with Premium and no QC, a 2009 Vectrix VX-1 W/18 Leaf modules, and 3 EZIP E-bicycles.
PLEASE don't PM me with Leaf questions. Just post in the topic that seems most appropriate.

jake14mw
Posts: 130
Joined: Sun Nov 12, 2017 9:53 pm
Delivery Date: 13 Nov 2017
Location: Connecticut, USA

Re: Winter has cut my love for my Leaf :(

Sun Jan 14, 2018 5:14 pm

I just completed my Level 2 Install, and it certainly helps make the car feel more capable. Now, on the weekend, when I take a longer morning trip, my car is useable again in a couple of hours.

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Stanton
Posts: 2033
Joined: Thu Feb 03, 2011 10:56 am
Delivery Date: 01 Sep 2011
Leaf Number: 7458
Location: Plano, TX
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Re: Winter has cut my love for my Leaf :(

Mon Jan 15, 2018 8:26 am

jake14mw wrote:I just completed my Level 2 Install, and it certainly helps make the car feel more capable. Now, on the weekend, when I take a longer morning trip, my car is useable again in a couple of hours.


Congrats: I really can't see long-term use of a Leaf without L2 charging.
Not only that, pre-heating with L1 is a losing battle (even L2 is on the edge).
2011 Blue Ocean SV w/floor mats & window tint
12v LiFePO4 battery & FIAMM 74100 horns
Wet Okole seat covers (front)
Tor's low-power heater mod
2013 sun visor
3G modem upgrade
L2 EVSE Upgrade
Battery Pack replaced (Rev E) @51 months and 41k miles

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