jborchel
Posts: 4
Joined: Sun Jul 01, 2018 11:28 am
Delivery Date: 01 Jul 2018

Electric Charge Cost

Sun Jul 01, 2018 11:39 am

I am considering buying or leasing a 2018 Leaf. I know what my current monthly gasoline cost is. I drive about 15,000 miles per year. Can anyone tell me their experience with their electricity bill after owning a Leaf. Was the monthly increase less than your former gas bill? If so, how much.

Is there an generally accepted cost per gallon comparison at a charging station with a typical gasoline car similar to the Leaf? Currently for my Buick compact 4 cylinder I pay about $3.70/gallon for about 23 mpg.

Also, I've read that it is best to only charge your Leaf to 80% on a regular basis. Can this be programmed so that when you charge overnight it will not exceed 80%?

cwerdna
Posts: 7921
Joined: Fri Jun 03, 2011 4:31 pm
Delivery Date: 28 Jul 2013
Location: SF Bay Area, CA

Re: Electric Charge Cost

Sun Jul 01, 2018 11:51 am

jborchel wrote:Can anyone tell me their experience with their electricity bill after owning a Leaf. Was the monthly increase less than your former gas bill? If so, how much.

What someone tells you may not apply to you at all. We could be off by a factor of 4 or more on the former.

Can you please point us to the rate schedule for your electric provider and what tiers you typically hit (if on a tiered plan)? Can you also provide us a typical month in terms of usage in kWh and the total cost for the electric portion?

For example, someone on E-1 in PG&E land (page 1 of https://www.pge.com/tariffs/tm2/pdf/ELEC_SCHEDS_E-1.pdf) will certainly get pushed into tier 3 by that kind of usage and charging at home exclusively. Some or all of that EV charging while on that plan would be 40.337 cents/kWh. If one assumes 3.5 miles/kWh (coming out of the wall, to help account for charging losses), it's about 11.52 cents/mile at that crazy high rate.

In comparison, these two places have cheap electricity:
http://www.seattle.gov/light/Rates/
http://www.siliconvalleypower.com/for-residents/rates - city of Santa Clara, CA only

PG&E serves much/most (?) of Nor Cal but not Santa Clara! I am in PG&E-land. :(

$3.70 / 23 = ~16 cents mile

(For comparison, my 06 Prius, I can average typically 44 to 50 mpg... I need to be doing mostly longer drives and keeping my speed below 70 mph to get 50 mpg on tank. $3.70 / 44 = ~8.4 cents/mile.)

My electric bill has gone up almost 0 because almost all of my charging is done for free at work. I also often use free level 2 charging on weekends. It's about 5 miles from home and on the way home from work and many places. Very little of my charging in a given year is done at home. I'd guess less than 100 kWh in a whole year.
jborchel wrote:I am considering buying or leasing a 2018 Leaf.
Can this be programmed so that when you charge overnight it will not exceed 80%?

Not on the car side. The feature on the car to limit charging to 80% was removed from US models starting with model year 2014.

'13 Leaf SV w/premium package (owned)
'13 Leaf SV w/QC + LED & premium packages (lease over, car returned)
'06 Prius

Please don't PM me with Leaf questions. Just post in the topic that seems most appropriate.

GerryAZ
Gold Member
Posts: 1727
Joined: Mon Nov 22, 2010 6:47 pm
Delivery Date: 12 Jun 2011
Location: Phoenix, AZ

Re: Electric Charge Cost

Sun Jul 01, 2018 2:10 pm

The electric rate plan really makes a difference. Give us your electric rate information and we can give more accurate answers. Almost all of my charging is at home off peak. I am averaging 1,500 miles per month and the car adds somewhere between $30 and $45 per month depending upon how I allocate portions of the taxes and basic service charges on the bill. It was toward the low end until this spring when the utility changed the rate structure of the time-of-use with peak demand charge plan that I am on. It is now toward the high end, but still much cheaper than driving my other vehicles for commuting. My 52-mile round trip commute (26 each way) takes about 16 kWh if charging at 6 kW rate, a little more if charging at a slower rate.

Don't worry about charging to 100 percent, just don't leave the car parked for extended time at high charge levels.
Gerry
Silver LEAF 2011 SL rear ended (totaled) by in-attentive driver 1/4/2015 at 50,422 miles
Silver LEAF 2015 SL purchased 2/7/2015

smkettner
Posts: 7143
Joined: Mon Aug 09, 2010 10:13 pm
Delivery Date: 26 Feb 2014
Location: Orange County, CA

Re: Electric Charge Cost

Sun Jul 01, 2018 4:36 pm

15,000 miles / 4 = 3,750 kWh x 12 cents per kWh = $450 per year or $37.50 per month.

Your mileage may vary and the rate you pay may vary.
1 bar lost at 21,451 miles, 16 months.
2 bar lost at 35,339 miles, 25 months.
LEAF traded at 45,400 miles for a RAV4-EV

Flyct
Posts: 203
Joined: Tue Nov 03, 2015 12:04 am
Delivery Date: 02 Dec 2015
Leaf Number: 307113
Location: Bradenton, Florida, US

Re: Electric Charge Cost

Mon Jul 02, 2018 7:22 am

As others stated, it depends on your electric rate.

Here I pay about 10 cents/KWH. Looking at actual electric usage and the inefficiency of the Charger my measured electric usage equates to about 2.4 cents/mile or $24/mo for each 1000 miles driven.

Florida Power and Light has a very nice online site where you can review and chart your monthly, daily or hourly electric usage by either kWh or cents.

You can see in my chart below, Last Saturday the charger started at 4am till 7am. It cost about $2.20 to recharge the batteries for the 90 miles of driving I did the days before charging.

You can also see where my poolpump and heater came on from 10am-2pm. It cost me about $1.30 that day to run the pool pump and pool heater.

The total cost for electric usage that day was $6.51. Break down is $2.20 to charge the Leaf, $1.30 for pool and remaining $3.01 for central air conditioner, hot water heater, lights, cooking, tv, fans, etc

Image



Here’s my electric usage by the month for the last year. This is a 3000 sq ft house in a Florida with a pool and a 5 ton, high efficiency air conditioner. We we not Home much March, April and May so usage those months was low.

Image
2018 Gun Metallic Grey Leaf SV with Tech package and All Weather package
2015 Lexus RX450h Hybrid SUV
2017 Ford F-350 Lariat Crew Cab Short Bed Diesel
2017 Grand Design Reflection 337RLS 5th Wheel RV
Blissfully Retired and loving it!

jborchel
Posts: 4
Joined: Sun Jul 01, 2018 11:28 am
Delivery Date: 01 Jul 2018

Re: Electric Charge Cost

Tue Jul 03, 2018 8:48 am

Thank you so much to everybody for those very complete replies. It's obvious that the cost of electrical charging at home is far less than I am paying for gasoline currently. My monthly cost averaged $139 for gas over the year I have owned the Buick compact and I'm guessing that mt cost for the 2018 Leaf will be around $50/month or less. I drove a demo yesterday and the salesman said that PG&E has a nighttime rate for charging EVs so that would help also. I need to call PG&E as I live in Sacramento and we have summertime heat that pushes me into higher tiers during July, August and September. But right now it looks good from here.

Maybe my most important issue though was my experience in the demo drive. For the past year we have been babysitting two of our daughter's small kids once a quarter while she travels for her job. She owns a 2015 or 2016 Leaf so I have been driving it twice a day each time we visit. This is when I fell in love with the experience. However, there was a difference with her car and the demo that concerns me. Although the 2018 ride is much, much improved, the 2018 seems much lighter and less substantial to the older Leaf. I checked the web and the 2018 weighs at least 100 pounds more but it didn't feel that way. I like the heavier feel. The demo was the cheapest model. If I step up a grade or two will I get a different(hopefully heavier) feel or has Nissan made features the only difference? I know this seems like a stupid question but I have learned over the years that these little things come back to haunt.

cwerdna
Posts: 7921
Joined: Fri Jun 03, 2011 4:31 pm
Delivery Date: 28 Jul 2013
Location: SF Bay Area, CA

Re: Electric Charge Cost

Tue Jul 03, 2018 4:37 pm

^^^
https://www.pge.com/en_US/residential/r ... -plan.page has the current rate choices. Some of the plans with cheap nighttime electricity will kill you in the day and in some cases, many of a typical person's waking hours.

If you were on E-1 and all your electricity used to charge the Leaf were in the highest tier of over 40 cents/kWh, then the 1250 miles / 3.5 miles/kWh = ~357 kWh. 357 kWh * $0.40/kWh = ~$143. That'd be your marginal cost of charging that Leaf.

What's your baseline territory (https://www.pge.com/en_US/residential/s ... lineamount)? Do you have nat gas heating or is your place all electric only?

'13 Leaf SV w/premium package (owned)
'13 Leaf SV w/QC + LED & premium packages (lease over, car returned)
'06 Prius

Please don't PM me with Leaf questions. Just post in the topic that seems most appropriate.

GerryAZ
Gold Member
Posts: 1727
Joined: Mon Nov 22, 2010 6:47 pm
Delivery Date: 12 Jun 2011
Location: Phoenix, AZ

Re: Electric Charge Cost

Tue Jul 03, 2018 5:12 pm

I have not yet driven a 2018, but since the weight is slightly higher it should not feel less substantial. I suspect the demo had its tires inflated to Nissan's recommended pressure. My experience with 2011 (16-inch wheels) and 2015 (17-inch wheels) is that the cars feel much more stable with tires inflated to 44 psi. It is likely that your daughter's car has the tires inflated higher than the demo.
Gerry
Silver LEAF 2011 SL rear ended (totaled) by in-attentive driver 1/4/2015 at 50,422 miles
Silver LEAF 2015 SL purchased 2/7/2015

jborchel
Posts: 4
Joined: Sun Jul 01, 2018 11:28 am
Delivery Date: 01 Jul 2018

Re: Electric Charge Cost

Tue Jul 03, 2018 5:17 pm

I'm in Baseline Territory S. I have gas heating.

cwerdna
Posts: 7921
Joined: Fri Jun 03, 2011 4:31 pm
Delivery Date: 28 Jul 2013
Location: SF Bay Area, CA

Re: Electric Charge Cost

Wed Jul 04, 2018 1:57 am

You can see your baseline at an URL I already posted and it should be on your bill, for your plan.

Rate schedules:
E-1 - already given
EV-A and EV-B https://www.pge.com/tariffs/assets/pdf/tariffbook/ELEC_SCHEDS_EV%20(Sch).pdf - pages 1, 3 and 4
ETOU-A and B: https://www.pge.com/tariffs/tm2/pdf/ELE ... _E-TOU.pdf - pages 2, 4 - 6
E-TOU-C3: https://www.pge.com/tariffs/assets/pdf/ ... TOU-C3.pdf - pages 2 and 4 - This sounds like E-TOU-C at https://www.pge.com/en_US/residential/r ... -plan.page "Time-of-Use (Peak Pricing 4 - 9 p.m. Every Day)". This is new to me. It is not a choice for me when I visit https://pge.opower.com/ei/x/rate-comparison and compare all rate plans.

I'm on E-6 (https://www.pge.com/tariffs/tm2/pdf/ELEC_SCHEDS_E-6.pdf), which is closed to new customers.

'13 Leaf SV w/premium package (owned)
'13 Leaf SV w/QC + LED & premium packages (lease over, car returned)
'06 Prius

Please don't PM me with Leaf questions. Just post in the topic that seems most appropriate.

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