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papayaparty

Member
Joined
Feb 5, 2019
Messages
16
About 6 weeks ago, I got my brand new 62kWh e-plus delivered, and I've done about 3500km so far. I did an 8-day 2000km trip through western Japan, whose longest stretch was on the last day, a 450km ride from Kyoto back to Tokyo.

My impressions so far:
  • This is a pretty good solid car. The difference between 40kWh and 62kWh is huge, and for 2019 in Japan, I think this is the sweet spot in battery size.
  • The motor is in paper more powerful than the non-e-plus version, but with the added weight from the additional battery, it felt pretty much the same as the non-e-plus version.
  • In my 8-day ride through western Japan, I only needed to do one technical charging stop (that is, a stop whose main purpose is to charge the car). Apart from that, every time I charged the car, I was resting in a place where I would have stopped anyways.
  • Most quick chargers in Japan are 40kW, 45 kW, 50kW or 55kW. One 30 minute charge gives around 30% to 35% worth of charge, but of course, as you get closer to 100% charging gets slower, so you get less charge per unit of time used.
  • I never got below 40% battery charge, except on the last day, where I reached home with 14% charge left. With this car, with the charging infrastructure in Japan, range anxiety simply doesn't exist for me.
  • Some places, like the parking near Matsuyama castle, or at Miyajima-guchi, have EV-only spots with charging., which I can use, even if the rest of the parking is full. That was nice.
  • I've always monitored the battery temperature, and it almost always stood at the middle of the gauge. It only went to about 70% after a 450km ride from Kyoto to Tokyo. But this is in spring... I'm interested to know how it will work in the summer.
  • Driving speed is crucial to making a charge give more range. It seemed like 120km/h consumed battery about twice as fast as 80km/h. I never had to force myself to drive slower to save battery though...
  • I wouldn't buy a hypothetical Leaf with even more battery capacity as of 2019: more battery means more weight, which means more power consumption. This means that each charge will give less range. I can imagine how frustrating this must be for Tesla owners when they can't get to one of the very few superchargers available in Japan...
  • However, there's a new generation of 90kW chargers. I tried the only one available in Kyoto, and it was freakin' awesome.
  • I'm paying a flat fee of 2000 yen a month (18 US dollars) to charge as much as I want in public chargers. So the more I drive it, the less it costs to do so.

By the way, I don't have charging at home, and I don't use this car for commuting.

Feel free to ask me anything if you're considering getting this car.
 
I have a question... I assume that you have had a Leaf before (24 or 40 KWH)? Is this Leaf E what we have been waiting for???

I mean, has this new car "made the jump" from second car, ( or commuter car) to being able to function a family's "only car"?

Can you drive it intermediate or long distances without needing to stop for long times to refuel?
 
papayaparty said:
I've always monitored the battery temperature, and it almost always stood at the middle of the gauge. It only went to about 70% after a 450km ride from Kyoto to Tokyo. But this is in spring... I'm interested to know how it will work in the summer.
Click to expand...

Using LeafSpy, the center point of the temp gauge is about 80 deg F. About a 10% movement to the right is about 100 deg F,
per my 2019 40 kWh Leaf and LeafSpy after 30 minutes of a QC with ambient of about 75 deg F. Do you have LeafSpy?
If so, could you take a temp measurement at the 70% point, i.e. at about the 3/4 point on the scale? It's critical that the
battery temp be measured at the end of a lengthy QC session, i.e. greater than 30-45 minutes.
 
@papayaparty : Congrats on getting the 60kwh Leaf. I'm also in the Tokyo area and will be doing a similar trip through the Osaka area during Golden Week. :shock: Yes, I know, probably the worst time of the year to do this, but kids and school.

Not a question about the car, but the trip itself in Japan.
* Speed vs. Range. Any strategy on balancing? (During my trip up to Nagano, I was bit of a lead foot and arrived at Kusatsu area with about 20% and no real place to charge. Thankfully the return trip was downhill, gained about 5% charge, and found a charger to get up to 80%, and then lead foot home to have 6% charge left.)
* Route and charge planning. Anything you used? I'm using the Nissan owners club trip planning feature and the Nissan EV app, but it has a lot to be desired. IE, the trip planner assumes good driving efficiency and recommends stops with an estimated charge left of 20%. Apps like Plugshare, this is configurable but I find the charger locations out of date.
* Any recommended stops? Preferably with a charge spot!
 
powersurge said:
I have a question... I assume that you have had a Leaf before (24 or 40 KWH)? Is this Leaf E what we have been waiting for???

I mean, has this new car "made the jump" from second car, ( or commuter car) to being able to function a family's "only car"?

Can you drive it intermediate or long distances without needing to stop for long times to refuel?
Click to expand...

This is definitely something I can not answer, because everybody's needs are different. For me, it is, but keep in mind that my needs may be different from yours. For example: I live in Japan; there's quick chargers everywhere; I can't/don't charge at home; I don't commute with the car; I can quick charge as much as I want for 2000 yen/month.

For my needs, it's great as my only car, and I use it almost exclusively for traveling. But, if you are interested in being able to do long stretches of driving without even taking a break, then this is not the car for you.
 
lorenfb said:
papayaparty said:
I've always monitored the battery temperature, and it almost always stood at the middle of the gauge. It only went to about 70% after a 450km ride from Kyoto to Tokyo. But this is in spring... I'm interested to know how it will work in the summer.
Click to expand...

Using LeafSpy, the center point of the temp gauge is about 80 deg F. About a 10% movement to the right is about 100 deg F,
per my 2019 40 kWh Leaf and LeafSpy after 30 minutes of a QC with ambient of about 75 deg F. Do you have LeafSpy?
If so, could you take a temp measurement at the 70% point, i.e. at about the 3/4 point on the scale? It's critical that the
battery temp be measured at the end of a lengthy QC session, i.e. greater than 30-45 minutes.
Click to expand...

I did not know about LeafSpy. That looks pretty cool, so I just ordered a dongle to try it out. I'll report on it later.

In terms of temperature, I check it every morning (when I use the car), and it starts at about 30%. After some driving and a 30 min quick charge, it stays around 40%. Only after a 300km drive to Nagoya, with 3 quick charges, it went up to 50%.

The highest I've seen it is at around 70%-80%, after a 450km drive from Kyoto to Tokyo, with about 5 quick charges, including one before leaving.

We'll see how it behaves in the summer, but so far, it seems like temperature is not an issue (at least in Japan)
 
JackTheCommuter said:
@papayaparty : Congrats on getting the 60kwh Leaf. I'm also in the Tokyo area and will be doing a similar trip through the Osaka area during Golden Week. :shock: Yes, I know, probably the worst time of the year to do this, but kids and school.

Not a question about the car, but the trip itself in Japan.
* Speed vs. Range. Any strategy on balancing? (During my trip up to Nagano, I was bit of a lead foot and arrived at Kusatsu area with about 20% and no real place to charge. Thankfully the return trip was downhill, gained about 5% charge, and found a charger to get up to 80%, and then lead foot home to have 6% charge left.)
* Route and charge planning. Anything you used? I'm using the Nissan owners club trip planning feature and the Nissan EV app, but it has a lot to be desired. IE, the trip planner assumes good driving efficiency and recommends stops with an estimated charge left of 20%. Apps like Plugshare, this is configurable but I find the charger locations out of date.
* Any recommended stops? Preferably with a charge spot!
Click to expand...

Speed vs. Range: The faster you ride, the more energy you consume. When driving around 60km/h, I get around 4km per %. If I go 120km/h, I get around 2km per %. If I'm somehow planning my route (see next part), I don't really feel the need to balance speed vs. distance, but if I do need to make the battery last longer, definitely drive slower. I've had to do so twice, because the charger I wanted to use was already being used, so instead of waiting, I just went to the next one (I think this is one of the best advantages of the e-plus, that you have enough juice to not be super strict with your charging route)

Route planning: If you don't already have it, I strongly recommend you use the EVSmart app, which tells you where you can find chargers, with up-to-date information, and very importantly, how fast the chargers are (20kW, 40kW, 50kW, 90kW). I usually know where I'm heading, and while I'm charging, I look at the app, and plan 2 or 3 options for the next charge. As you probably know, most Service Areas, some Parking Areas, and most Michi-no-eki have quick chargers, so I've never felt that I've been even remotely worried about not having where to charge. As a secondary choice, some AEONs, some Lawson/Family Mart, and most Nissan dealers have quick chargers, but have poorer food/resting experience.

Recommended stops: Tokyo-Kyoto is a great way to test the viability of the Leaf. I've done this route with the 24kWh, the 40kWh, and the 62kWh leaf: this is very difficult with the 24kWh (may be impossible via the Shin-Tomei); it is doable with the 40kWh, but requires some planning; and it is definitely doable with the 62kWh with no stress at all. If I were to do it tomorrow with the e-plus, I'd do it like this:

  • Breakfast and charge at Ebina or Ashigara
  • Take the Shin-Tomei expressway: It's much faster, and has the new 120km/h limit segment, but has less charging spots
  • Rest and charge at Surugawan-Numazu, or stretch it to Shizuoka. This is probably the most important charging spot, before the 120km/h segment which can drain your battery really quick
  • Lunch and charge at Kariya
  • Take the Shin-Meishin: again, it's faster, but has less charging spots
  • Rest and charge at Tsuchiyama
  • Arrive at Kyoto with around 50% charge
  • If you're stretching it to Osaka, dinner and charge at Katsuragawa
  • Arrive at Osaka with around 50% charge

If you start with 100%, you will probably not go below 30%, and you have a rest around every 2 hours. You can probably take out one charging stop by driving slower. I'm not sure if the time saving is worth it.

To make the most out of each quick charge, I wouldn't charge unless I'm around 50% or less.
 
papayaparty said:
  • Breakfast and charge at Ebina or Ashigara. Can be stretched to Nakai.
  • Take the Shin-Tomei expressway: It's much faster, and has the new 120km/h limit segment, but has less charging spots
  • Rest and charge at Surugawan-Numazu, or stretch it to Shizuoka. This is probably the most important charging spot, before the 120km/h segment which can drain your battery really quick
  • Lunch and charge at Kariya
  • Take the Shin-Meishin: again, it's faster, but has less charging spots
  • Rest and charge at Tsuchiyama
  • Arrive at Kyoto with around 50% charge
  • If you're stretching it to Osaka, dinner and charge at Katsuragawa
  • Arrive at Osaka with around 50% charge
Click to expand...

I didn't realize the change to allow speeds higher then 80kph (50mph) and now 120kph (74mph)! And I'm not too sure about the other countries, but my 2018 Leaf cruise control tops out at 120kph, can't set speeds any higher.

Thanks for the tips and especially the proposed route. While I do like that Lawson convenience store offer quick charging, I find many of them limited to 20kwh charging. And Aeon markets, at least in the Kawasaki area, aren't in the NCS network. I will definitely be on the look out for the 90kwh chargers, but I would think the Leaf would start throttling the charge rate when the battery reaches 60% charge level or so.
 
papayaparty said:
lorenfb said:
papayaparty said:
I've always monitored the battery temperature, and it almost always stood at the middle of the gauge. It only went to about 70% after a 450km ride from Kyoto to Tokyo. But this is in spring... I'm interested to know how it will work in the summer.
Click to expand...

Using LeafSpy, the center point of the temp gauge is about 80 deg F. About a 10% movement to the right is about 100 deg F,
per my 2019 40 kWh Leaf and LeafSpy after 30 minutes of a QC with ambient of about 75 deg F. Do you have LeafSpy?
If so, could you take a temp measurement at the 70% point, i.e. at about the 3/4 point on the scale? It's critical that the
battery temp be measured at the end of a lengthy QC session, i.e. greater than 30-45 minutes.
Click to expand...

I did not know about LeafSpy. That looks pretty cool, so I just ordered a dongle to try it out. I'll report on it later.

In terms of temperature, I check it every morning (when I use the car), and it starts at about 30%. After some driving and a 30 min quick charge, it stays around 40%. Only after a 300km drive to Nagoya, with 3 quick charges, it went up to 50%.

The highest I've seen it is at around 70%-80%, after a 450km drive from Kyoto to Tokyo, with about 5 quick charges, including one before leaving.

We'll see how it behaves in the summer, but so far, it seems like temperature is not an issue (at least in Japan)
Click to expand...

I have two of these, one in each Leaf;

https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B00QJRYMFC/ref=ppx_yo_dt_b_asin_title_o00_s00?ie=UTF8&psc=1

It's critical that you use LeafSpy to monitor the Leaf's battery temperature, i.e. while Quick Charging (QC), driving at high
speeds (> 70 mph), or climbing long and somewhat steep grades. After the 2019's (40kWh) first QC, 30 minutes with an ambient
temperature of 73, the battery temperature was at 100 deg F. My 24kWh Leaf's battery with many QCs for 20-30 minutes
never resulted in a temperature greater than 95 deg F. Given this temperature rise on the 40kWh battery, it's very
doubtful whether I'll do more than one QC per day, especially when the temperature here is 85 - 90 deg F in a few months.
I also noticed that the battery temperature began to rise significantly with ECO mode off and driving aggressively. Give the
additional 50% more power output of the 40kWh Leaf's motor, higher battery temperatures are to be expected.
By monitoring the Leaf's battery temperature over time, one can attempt to minimize the Leaf's battery degradation
the result of additional high temperatures while driving or charging, given the Leaf's lack of an active TMS (thermal
management system). Other than attempting to limit the temperature rise while charging by having the Leaf's BMS
limit the charging current as a function of the battery temperature, battery temperature monitoring should be
of concern.
 
JackTheCommuter said:
papayaparty said:
  • Breakfast and charge at Ebina or Ashigara. Can be stretched to Nakai.
  • Take the Shin-Tomei expressway: It's much faster, and has the new 120km/h limit segment, but has less charging spots
  • Rest and charge at Surugawan-Numazu, or stretch it to Shizuoka. This is probably the most important charging spot, before the 120km/h segment which can drain your battery really quick
  • Lunch and charge at Kariya
  • Take the Shin-Meishin: again, it's faster, but has less charging spots
  • Rest and charge at Tsuchiyama
  • Arrive at Kyoto with around 50% charge
  • If you're stretching it to Osaka, dinner and charge at Katsuragawa
  • Arrive at Osaka with around 50% charge
Click to expand...

I didn't realize the change to allow speeds higher then 80kph (50mph) and now 120kph (74mph)! And I'm not too sure about the other countries, but my 2018 Leaf cruise control tops out at 120kph, can't set speeds any higher.

Thanks for the tips and especially the proposed route. While I do like that Lawson convenience store offer quick charging, I find many of them limited to 20kwh charging. And Aeon markets, at least in the Kawasaki area, aren't in the NCS network. I will definitely be on the look out for the 90kwh chargers, but I would think the Leaf would start throttling the charge rate when the battery reaches 60% charge level or so.
Click to expand...

Expressways have always had a limit of 100km/h, but there are two segments (part of the Shin-Tomei, and somewhere in Tohoku) that last year tried 110km/h, and this year increased to 120km/h. They're officially still testing them, but very real. By the way, the pro pilot tops at 115km/h in my car. I wouldn't use it when driving above 100km/h though.

I don't know which part of Kawasaki you live in, but if you need quick charging, you will probably have a better time looking for Nissan dealers. Since I'm mostly using my car for leisure driving, I do most of my charging at SA/PAs, and michi-no-ekis. I do recommend the EVSmart app though.
 
lorenfb said:
papayaparty said:
lorenfb said:
Using LeafSpy, the center point of the temp gauge is about 80 deg F. About a 10% movement to the right is about 100 deg F,
per my 2019 40 kWh Leaf and LeafSpy after 30 minutes of a QC with ambient of about 75 deg F. Do you have LeafSpy?
If so, could you take a temp measurement at the 70% point, i.e. at about the 3/4 point on the scale? It's critical that the
battery temp be measured at the end of a lengthy QC session, i.e. greater than 30-45 minutes.
Click to expand...

I did not know about LeafSpy. That looks pretty cool, so I just ordered a dongle to try it out. I'll report on it later.

In terms of temperature, I check it every morning (when I use the car), and it starts at about 30%. After some driving and a 30 min quick charge, it stays around 40%. Only after a 300km drive to Nagoya, with 3 quick charges, it went up to 50%.

The highest I've seen it is at around 70%-80%, after a 450km drive from Kyoto to Tokyo, with about 5 quick charges, including one before leaving.

We'll see how it behaves in the summer, but so far, it seems like temperature is not an issue (at least in Japan)
Click to expand...

I have two of these, one in each Leaf;

https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B00QJRYMFC/ref=ppx_yo_dt_b_asin_title_o00_s00?ie=UTF8&psc=1

It's critical that you use LeafSpy to monitor the Leaf's battery temperature, i.e. while Quick Charging (QC), driving at high
speeds (> 70 mph), or climbing long and somewhat steep grades. After the 2019's (40kWh) first QC, 30 minutes with an ambient
temperature of 73, the battery temperature was at 100 deg F. My 24kWh Leaf's battery with many QCs for 20-30 minutes
never resulted in a temperature greater than 95 deg F. Given this temperature rise on the 40kWh battery, it's very
doubtful whether I'll do more than one QC per day, especially when the temperature here is 85 - 90 deg F in a few months.
I also noticed that the battery temperature began to rise significantly with ECO mode off and driving aggressively. Give the
additional 50% more power output of the 40kWh Leaf's motor, higher battery temperatures are to be expected.
By monitoring the Leaf's battery temperature over time, one can attempt to minimize the Leaf's battery degradation
the result of additional high temperatures while driving or charging, given the Leaf's lack of an active TMS (thermal
management system). Other than attempting to limit the temperature rise while charging by having the Leaf's BMS
limit the charging current as a function of the battery temperature, battery temperature monitoring should be
of concern.
Click to expand...

Last year I rented a 40kWh leaf three times for long trips, and temperature definitely went up noticeably after a quick charge, and the car started throttling the charge after the second quick charge. I haven't experienced this once with the e-plus, and the most charges I've done were on the Kyoto to Tokyo drive (it was actually 5 stops, but 6 charges, as I charged twice in one stop).

It may be because the e-plus may have more cells to choose from when discharging/recharging, and can manage the temperature better simply because it has a larger battery.

But I'll let you know what I get when I start using LeafSpy. I'll report my findings in Celcius though, as I don't use, or even understand Farenheit. I hope you don't mind.
 
papayaparty said:
Expressways have always had a limit of 100km/h, but there are two segments (part of the Shin-Tomei, and somewhere in Tohoku) that last year tried 110km/h, and this year increased to 120km/h. They're officially still testing them, but very real. By the way, the pro pilot tops at 115km/h in my car. I wouldn't use it when driving above 100km/h though.

I don't know which part of Kawasaki you live in, but if you need quick charging, you will probably have a better time looking for Nissan dealers. Since I'm mostly using my car for leisure driving, I do most of my charging at SA/PAs, and michi-no-ekis. I do recommend the EVSmart app though.
Click to expand...

I was cheap and ProPilot didn't fit my use case of mostly around town driving. The car sees about 30km (18mi) of usage daily on surface streets. Coming from the Los Angeles, California (USA), where freeway speeds hover around 140kph, I was surprised by the limitations of the Japan Leaf cruise control. It's a good thing I'm still wired to think speeds above "100" is a felony!

I do use the EV Smart app and was very pleased to see information such as charger occupied and since when it was occupied. Showing the charge rate potential was nice and when I found that Mitsubishi dealers have to 50kwh version, I hopped over to try it out. I came away disappointed as not much difference between the 44kwh version at Nissan dealers. Most of the charging is done at a QC at the local supermarket with a 40kwh version. Thirty minutes of charging results in about 35% increase for 40kw version of the Leaf. I'll use the level 2 charger to top off to 100% before a long trip or when the charge battery charge is under 30%.

@papayaparty : You mentioned a 90kwh charger in Kyoto. Where? I took a "walk" with the EV Smart app in the area and can't find it. How did you find out about this next generation charger?
 
Thanks for the insights from Japan and about the Plus version of Leaf. I've visited there 6x for vacation myself, the last time in 2017. Five of my trips there have included at least 2 days at Tokyo Motor show.

For those unfamiliar, Lawson and Family Mart are two very common convenience store (aka conbini) chains in Japan. 7-Eleven is another. Oddly (at last check), even the US 7-Elevens are now owned by the Japanese parent company.
JackTheCommuter said:
. Showing the charge rate potential was nice and when I found that Mitsubishi dealers have to 50kwh version, I hopped over to try it out. I came away disappointed as not much difference between the 44kwh version at Nissan dealers. Most of the charging is done at a QC at the local supermarket with a 40kwh version. Thirty minutes of charging results in about 35% increase for 40kw version of the Leaf. I'll use the level 2 charger to top off to 100% before a long trip or when the charge battery charge is under 30%.

@papayaparty : You mentioned a 90kwh charger in Kyoto. Where?
Click to expand...
I've noticed you made a bunch of unit errors. Charging rate is expressed in kW, a unit of power. Battery capacity and energy dispensed is in kWh, a unit of energy.

Thus, you should be talking about 50 and 44 kW chargers and 40 kWh version of Leaf.

This has come up many times. See http://www.mynissanleaf.com/viewtopic.php?p=540845#p540845, for example.

Thanks to someone who shall remain unnamed, I learned of "intermediate chargers" in Japan. Apparently, ones below 40 kW tend (?) to be called "intermediate". As I posted at http://www.mynissanleaf.com/viewtopic.php?p=524315#p524315:
cwerdna said:
SageBrush said:
The 2018 LEAF DCFC should come with a big footnote that reads "up to 45 kW, as battery temperature and other variables allows."

Or just give up on the DCFC sham altogether and advertise DC L2+ speeds

Perhaps we need a new acronym: DCSC "DC slow charging."
Click to expand...
FWIW, in Japan, they have "intermediate" (CHAdeMO) chargers.

See https://teslamotorsclub.com/tmc/threads/chademo-make-model-review-%E2%80%94-using-with-a-tesla.42176/page-8#post-961564 and https://teslamotorsclub.com/tmc/threads/chademo-make-model-review-%E2%80%94-using-with-a-tesla.42176/page-8#post-971287. As the 2nd post mentions, they even have some 10 kW CHAdeMO chargers there.
Click to expand...
 
JackTheCommuter said:
@papayaparty : You mentioned a 90kwh charger in Kyoto. Where? I took a "walk" with the EV Smart app in the area and can't find it. How did you find out about this next generation charger?
Click to expand...

Kyoto Nissan Jidousha Jujo-ten:
https://evsmart.net/spot/kyoto/l261009/q261076/v2133/

I found it by accident, searching for chargers near my hotel. It was a bit far away, but when I saw "90kW", I decided I had to see that with my own eyes.

They have the new series of ShinDengen chargers, which have two cables, with a maximum combined output of 90kW, so if there are two cars charging at the same time, they won't get 90kW each.

https://www.shindengen.co.jp/products/new/2018/chademo12.html

Here's a photo of the charger screen showing it is ready for 90kW charging:

https://imgur.com/a/bC8FXsv

The one in Kyoto has both an old 50kW charger, and the new 90kW charger, which means up to three cars can quick charge at the same time. However, the store clerk told me that the charging output of 90kW is only available for the e-plus.

Searching on EVsmart, I found other 90kW chargers:

Hamamatsu, Shizuoka prefecture: https://evsmart.net/spot/shizuoka/l221309/q221325/v1826/
Washinomiya, Saitama prefecture: https://evsmart.net/spot/saitama/l112321/v4024/
Imaichi, Tochigi prefecture: https://evsmart.net/spot/tochigi/l92061/v470/
Ichinomiya, Aichi prefecture: https://evsmart.net/spot/aichi/l232033/v1894/

Unfortunately, there seem to be none in Tokyo, Chiba or Kanagawa... yet.

For reference, the Tesla superchargers seem to be 120kW.
 
cwerdna said:
Thanks to someone who shall remain unnamed, I learned of "intermediate chargers" in Japan. Apparently, ones below 40 kW tend (?) to be called "intermediate". As I posted at http://www.mynissanleaf.com/viewtopic.php?p=524315#p524315:
cwerdna said:
SageBrush said:
The 2018 LEAF DCFC should come with a big footnote that reads "up to 45 kW, as battery temperature and other variables allows."
Click to expand...
Click to expand...
Click to expand...

Intermediate chargers, or "chuusoku juudenki" are I think an unofficial term for the slower, 20kW chargers. I think that as quick chargers "kyuusoku juudenki" get more output, and cars get larger batteries, the definitions will slowly shift.

Quick charging in Japan is usually limited to 30 minutes per charge, and good manners indicate that you should not charge twice in sequence if there are other cars waiting in line, so the theoretical maximum charge you can get is:

90kW quick charger: 45kWh (187% of 24kWh, 107% of 40kWh, 72% of 62kWh)
55kW quick charger: 27.5kWh (114% of 24kWh, 68% of 40kWh, 44% of 62kWh)
50kW quick charger: 25kWh (104% of 24kWh, 63% of 40kWh, 40% of 62kWh)
45kW quick charger (most common): 22.5kWh (94% of 24kWh, 56% of 40kWh, 36% of 62kWh)
40kW quick charger: 20kWh (83% of 24kWh, 50% of 40kWh, 32% of 62kWh)
20kW intermediate charger: 10kWh (42% of 24kWh, 25% of 40kWh, 16% of 62kWh)

But, as you get closer to 100%, the car starts throttling the charge. In my e-plus, I think it starts throttling at around 80%, so if you want to optimize the charging session (especially if you have to pay per-minute), you want to wait until the car loses a lot of charge. In practical terms, I can get from 50% to 82% with a 45kW charger, and from 10% to 80% with two charges in succession.
 
I finally got around to skimming more of this thread.
papayaparty said:
[*] I'm paying a flat fee of 2000 yen a month (18 US dollars) to charge as much as I want in public chargers. So the more I drive it, the less it costs to do so.[/list]
Click to expand...
That is really good. I don't know of anything that cheap in California for either CHAdeMO or SAE Combo.

If we had pricing like that in the US all throughout the US, we could sure get a lot more folks converting to EVs w/DC FC inlets.

Off the top of my head, there is https://www.evsolutions.com/ev-network but that's only for limited parts of WA and OR AND for DC FCing, CHAdeMO only.
 
cwerdna said:
I finally got around to skimming more of this thread.
papayaparty said:
[*] I'm paying a flat fee of 2000 yen a month (18 US dollars) to charge as much as I want in public chargers. So the more I drive it, the less it costs to do so.[/list]
Click to expand...
That is really good. I don't know of anything that cheap in California for either CHAdeMO or SAE Combo.

If we had pricing like that in the US all throughout the US, we could sure get a lot more folks converting to EVs w/DC FC inlets.

Off the top of my head, there is https://www.evsolutions.com/ev-network but that's only for limited parts of WA and OR AND for DC FCing, CHAdeMO only.
Click to expand...

I think this price is subsidized by Nissan, so I wouldn't bet on this continuing in the long run. Let me explain:

Every charger is free to use whatever payment mechanism they want. Many are completely free to use (like in government offices), others are free if you pay for parking. However, most chargers are part of the NCS network, which offers three subscription levels: quick-only (pink elephant), regular-only (green elephant), and combination (pink and green elephants).

https://www.nippon-juden.co.jp/tk/cd/

The combination subscription costs 4200 yen/month, plus 15 yen/minute for quick charging, and 2.5 yen/minute for regular charging.

In contrast, Nissan offers an NCS subscription on their ZESP2 program:

https://www3.nissan.co.jp/vehicles/new/leaf/maintenance.html

The subscription costs 2000 yen/month, and no per-minute costs for quick charging on Nissan dealers, highway, convenience stores, malls, supermarkets, etc. It costs 1.5 yen/minute for regular charging anywhere, and 15 yen/minute for quick charging on non-Nissan dealers (like Toyota or Mitsubishi)

The catch is that this is only available for Nissan EV owners, and you have to get a Nissan credit card (1250 yen/year) where the costs will get charged.
 

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