lkkms2
Gold Member
Posts: 329
Joined: Wed Jul 20, 2011 8:10 am
Delivery Date: 30 Dec 2016
Leaf Number: 302025
Location: San Diego/National City, CA

Re: 2016-2017 model year 30 kWh bar losers and capacity losses

Sun Oct 14, 2018 5:36 am

Just lost my 1st capacity bar on my 2017 Leaf after 17094 miles and 1 year 10 months. (QC = 265, L2 = 451/timer)

At time of purchase AHr = 81.32. Now 66.52 so a little over 18% capacity loss. (First year at 9500 miles lost about 10.5% per AHr readings).

Note: this is before the Nissan SW update which I am planning to do at the time of my 2nd Annual Battery Check in Dec (2018) or Jan (2019).
2011 Leaf SL purchased 6-22-2011, sold 1-18-2017 with new battery.
2017 Leaf SV with Premium Package purchased 12-30-2016

SageBrush
Posts: 2841
Joined: Sun Mar 06, 2011 2:28 am
Delivery Date: 13 Feb 2017
Location: Colorado

Re: 2016-2017 model year 30 kWh bar losers and capacity losses

Sun Oct 14, 2018 8:28 am

lkkms2 wrote:Note: this is before the Nissan SW update which I am planning to do at the time of my 2nd Annual Battery Check in Dec (2018) or Jan (2019).

I've forgotten, does the software update also result in higher displayed Ahr ?
2013 LEAF 'S' Model with QC & rear-view camera
Bought off-lease Jan 2017 from N. California
Car is now enjoying an easy life in Colorado
3/2018: 58 Ahr, 28k miles
-----
2018 Tesla Model 3 LR, Delivered 6/2018

joeriv
Posts: 174
Joined: Sun Mar 24, 2013 1:33 pm
Location: Fairfield County CT

Re: 2016-2017 model year 30 kWh bar losers and capacity losses

Sun Oct 14, 2018 8:41 am

Yes.
2017 Leaf S with QC, JUN mfg date

amissionleaf
Posts: 13
Joined: Mon Oct 08, 2018 1:53 pm
Delivery Date: 23 Mar 2017
Leaf Number: 302367

Re: 2016-2017 model year 30 kWh bar losers and capacity losses

Mon Oct 15, 2018 7:26 pm

johnlocke wrote:
amissionleaf wrote:Leaf battery degradation vary between packs and owners but for a specific pack the degradation would be kind of consistent. According to the graph of the degradation over months on this forum, I would guess the miles read when 4th bar is lost would be about 3.6x of the miles read when the first bar is lost. Being that said, if you lose your 1st bar at 30000 miles, most likely you will lose your 4th bar around 108000 miles if no changes in location, charging pattern and driving habit. then most likely you won't get a free battery replacement.

If the first bar drops at 30K mi. that represents a 17% loss of capacity. He will drop the next bar at 77%, the third bar at about 70% and the fourth at 64%. So somewhere around 60k-65K mi. he will lose the fourth bar and be eligible for a new battery. The numbers may vary slightly but should be close to the mark. This assumes the driving habits and distances remain relatively constant. Battery degradation seems to remain consistent unless conditions change. YMMV.


Do you still remember when did your first bar drop and at what mileage?
2014 S; 33500 miles, returned with 12 bars.
2017 SV; 20000+ miles, sw update 10/8/18, feels like 15 miles range back,. SOH 91.5% on 10/19/18

amissionleaf
Posts: 13
Joined: Mon Oct 08, 2018 1:53 pm
Delivery Date: 23 Mar 2017
Leaf Number: 302367

Re: 2016-2017 model year 30 kWh bar losers and capacity losses

Fri Oct 19, 2018 6:41 pm

amissionleaf wrote:just to report that my '17 leaf got a firmware update today. I don't have any leafspy data but I feel the update added about 15 - 20 miles to the remaining range reading. the longest range I saw in last summer was about 125 miles with a full charge. Today the range is around 105 with a full charge before the update, and showing 102 remaining + 22 driven right after update. The car was built 11/2016 and I got it in march 2017, now has 20250 miles on it.


I got a BAFX bt obd2 scanner today (I should have had it prior to the sw update) and got my first battery stats using the leafspy lite from andriod play store. The data is:

AHr=72.72
SOH=91.50%
Hx=76.22%
4 QC and 820 L1/L2

I have never done the QC, so that must be done by dealer before I had it. is this pack in healthy state? according to the formula from this site: https://flipthefleet.org/2018/30-kwh-ni ... reporting/
SOH_post = 57 + 0.43 x SOH_pre, my SOH prior to the update would be only around 80% and should have lost 1 bar already. the calculated AHr_new = 72.72/.915 = 79.5 was quite bit small (should be around 82?)

Looks like my pack degrades at a rate of 4.32% per 10,000 miles, that leads to the edge of the warranty around 64% of SOH at 100,000 miles

Any comment?
2014 S; 33500 miles, returned with 12 bars.
2017 SV; 20000+ miles, sw update 10/8/18, feels like 15 miles range back,. SOH 91.5% on 10/19/18

amissionleaf
Posts: 13
Joined: Mon Oct 08, 2018 1:53 pm
Delivery Date: 23 Mar 2017
Leaf Number: 302367

Re: 2016-2017 model year 30 kWh bar losers and capacity losses

Sun Oct 21, 2018 7:30 pm

lkkms2 wrote:Just lost my 1st capacity bar on my 2017 Leaf after 17094 miles and 1 year 10 months. (QC = 265, L2 = 451/timer)

At time of purchase AHr = 81.32. Now 66.52 so a little over 18% capacity loss. (First year at 9500 miles lost about 10.5% per AHr readings).

Note: this is before the Nissan SW update which I am planning to do at the time of my 2nd Annual Battery Check in Dec (2018) or Jan (2019).


According to the formula SOH_post = 57 + 0.43 * SOH_pre = 57 + 0.43 * (66.52/81.32 * 100) = 57 + 0.43 * 81.8 = 92.17
so at your second annual battery check time, your SOH_pre would be around 80% , and your SOH_post around 91.5%

remember to post the data here after you have your 2nd Annual Battery Check
2014 S; 33500 miles, returned with 12 bars.
2017 SV; 20000+ miles, sw update 10/8/18, feels like 15 miles range back,. SOH 91.5% on 10/19/18

bedoig
Posts: 8
Joined: Mon Oct 28, 2013 1:20 pm
Delivery Date: 28 Oct 2013

Re: 2016-2017 model year 30 kWh bar losers and capacity losses

Mon Oct 22, 2018 1:27 pm

Checking in. My rough timeline (I didn't track this very thoroughly):

Sep-2017 - 79% SOH, one bar lost
Dec-2017 - 72% SOH, still at one bar loss
...
Didn't track / post, but lost bars two and three in this period
...
Sep-2018 - 63% SOH, still at three bar loss
Oct-2018 - 59% SOH, still at three bar loss

For the record I haven't done the battery firmware update yet. I kind of wanted to drop the fourth bar first just to document it.

Conventional wisdom around here has seemed to indicate loss of the fourth bar around 64% SOH but I'm now well below that. Anybody have any thoughts on what other metrics drive the bar losses? I'm assuming there is some kind of time / distance requirement on top of the direct measurements the battery is providing. Feels like I should have dropped that next bar already. My real world range from 100% down to several miles below VLB is now somewhere in the 70-80 mile range. This isn't going to cut it during the winter for my 67 mile round trip commute.

Image

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Hmm... images don't seem to be working. Shared folder should be here though: https://photos.app.goo.gl/hJ8RPakgdu2X5Q138

DaveinOlyWA
Posts: 13275
Joined: Sat Apr 24, 2010 7:43 pm
Delivery Date: 16 Feb 2018
Leaf Number: 314199
Location: Olympia, WA
Contact: Website

Re: 2016-2017 model year 30 kWh bar losers and capacity losses

Mon Oct 22, 2018 6:42 pm

For the record I haven't done the battery firmware update yet. I kind of wanted to drop the fourth bar first just to document it.


hmmm....

Conventional wisdom around here has seemed to indicate loss of the fourth bar around 64% SOH but I'm now well below that.


Since you have not done the update, how do you know you are well below "anything?"
2011 SL; 44,598 miles. 2013 S; 44,840 miles.2016 S30 deceased. 29,413 miles. 2018 S40; 11,987 miles, 485 GIDs, 37.6 kwh 110.89 Ahr , SOH 96.00, Hx 115.22
My Blog; http://daveinolywa.blogspot.com" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

bedoig
Posts: 8
Joined: Mon Oct 28, 2013 1:20 pm
Delivery Date: 28 Oct 2013

Re: 2016-2017 model year 30 kWh bar losers and capacity losses

Tue Oct 23, 2018 8:57 am

DaveinOlyWA wrote:hmmm.... Since you have not done the update, how do you know you are well below "anything?"


Obviously I'm comparing to the original state of the car as delivered by Nissan and the condition it was operated under until a few months ago when conditions were changed. A before and after view of a four bar loser seemed like useful information to gather to me. If you don't have anything productive to add please just don't respond.

wch
Posts: 3
Joined: Thu Mar 22, 2018 11:15 am
Delivery Date: 22 Feb 2018
Leaf Number: 312159

Re: 2016-2017 model year 30 kWh bar losers and capacity losses

Tue Oct 23, 2018 9:43 am

I just got the firmware update, and my SoH went from 85.78% to 93.75%. I have a 2016 SL with 4400 miles, which I bought essentially new about 8 months ago.

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