VitaminJ
Posts: 384
Joined: Tue Jan 03, 2017 11:46 am
Delivery Date: 07 Jan 2017
Leaf Number: 415775
Location: Morrison, CO
Contact: YouTube

Re: 2013-2014 bar losers and capacity losses

Thu Feb 09, 2017 12:41 pm

bpnugent, what are your driving habits? I mean what % do you usually park at? Do you go to low battery or very low battery warning or turtle regularly or at all? It sounds like you charged to 80% until recently. Also you have about 20k more miles than most 13s I've seen and more L1/L2 charges so you must drive a lot! Lastly what is the build date on the driver's door jam?
2013 Ocean Blue SV w/ QC and LED
- +0.2 mi/kwh Aeromods
- 2lb 5Ah LiFe 12v battery

DaveinOlyWA
Posts: 12325
Joined: Sat Apr 24, 2010 7:43 pm
Delivery Date: 10 Nov 2016
Leaf Number: 314199
Location: Olympia, WA
Contact: Website

Re: 2013-2014 bar losers and capacity losses

Sat Feb 11, 2017 9:52 am

bpnugent wrote:I just lost my first capacity bar on my 2013 Nissan Leaf. Here are my stats:

MY13 (took delivery 10/13)
Location: Northern Colorado
Date of loss: 2/6/17
Mileage at loss: 51604
AHr: 55.18
SOH: 84%
Hx: 81.57
L1/L2 charges: 3029
QC: 37

I try to leave my LEAF outside at night to cool off the battery. We moved to charging to 100% in the morning every weekday (just prior to departure) in the last year or so to make up for capacity loss.


So you do generally charge in your garage? I would think that Colorado would not see consistently high temps? But I guess that depends on your elevation
2011 SL; 44,598 miles. 2013 S; 44,840 miles.2016 S30 (build 10/2016)"low water marks" 27,000 miles.363GID Ahr 79.13Hx95.17%kwh28.1QCs238,L2's 251
My Blog; http://daveinolywa.blogspot.com" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

bpnugent
Posts: 6
Joined: Mon Oct 07, 2013 11:26 am
Delivery Date: 05 Oct 2013
Leaf Number: 417259
Location: Northern Colorado

Re: 2013-2014 bar losers and capacity losses

Mon Feb 13, 2017 10:47 am

VitaminJ wrote:bpnugent, what are your driving habits? I mean what % do you usually park at? Do you go to low battery or very low battery warning or turtle regularly or at all? It sounds like you charged to 80% until recently. Also you have about 20k more miles than most 13s I've seen and more L1/L2 charges so you must drive a lot! Lastly what is the build date on the driver's door jam?


I do try to park overnight between 30% and 50%. I read somewhere that 30% is the sweet spot for degradation, but I don't want to sacrifice all of the convenience of being able to hop into the car at a moment's notice. Like I said, I do try to park outside to get the battery as cold as possible. I realize this sacrifices short term capacity for longer life, but I've preferred this trade-off. I've never seen the turtle, but I have gotten under 1kW remaining in LeafSpy ("---" on both battery display and miles) around 10-15 times. I tried to keep it at 80% for as long as I could, but the capacity loss was starting to bug my wife (the primary driver) starting around a year ago. I very rarely kept it charged at 100% for very long and targeted departure time to charge completion as close as I could. My wife is the taxi driver, and we live about 4 miles from the edge of town, so she accumulates quite a bit just doing that.

I didn't check the door jamb this morning, but I custom ordered it and it only sat on the lot a few days before I picked it up on 10/4/2013.

bpnugent
Posts: 6
Joined: Mon Oct 07, 2013 11:26 am
Delivery Date: 05 Oct 2013
Leaf Number: 417259
Location: Northern Colorado

Re: 2013-2014 bar losers and capacity losses

Mon Feb 13, 2017 10:52 am

DaveinOlyWA wrote:
bpnugent wrote:I just lost my first capacity bar on my 2013 Nissan Leaf. Here are my stats:

MY13 (took delivery 10/13)
Location: Northern Colorado
Date of loss: 2/6/17
Mileage at loss: 51604
AHr: 55.18
SOH: 84%
Hx: 81.57
L1/L2 charges: 3029
QC: 37

I try to leave my LEAF outside at night to cool off the battery. We moved to charging to 100% in the morning every weekday (just prior to departure) in the last year or so to make up for capacity loss.


So you do generally charge in your garage? I would think that Colorado would not see consistently high temps? But I guess that depends on your elevation


I do primarily charge and store in my garage during the day, and try to get it outside at night. The temperature difference between the high and low on any given day is pretty high- 30 degrees or so. Dry and 5,000 feet. There are really only a couple of months where you can see temps in the 90's fairly consistently. I've only seen my temperature bars get to 7 twice ever, and I'm usually able to get down to 5 bars overnight even in the worst months.

krex
Posts: 4
Joined: Wed Mar 01, 2017 7:20 pm
Delivery Date: 02 Mar 2017

Re: 2013-2014 bar losers and capacity losses

Thu Mar 09, 2017 2:33 pm

I took possession of a used 2013 SV (Build 07/13) last week. It had one bar missing and I inspected it with LeafSpy prior. Prior to delivery, it was 53.60 AHr, but in the last week it has already dropped to 53.2 AHr, and I've barely driven it! I have only charged to 100% once but otherwise, it has been between 30-80% SOC.

While I hate to use the term "normal".... is this consistent with other user's experience? I am in Houston Texas, but the weather has been mild the last week. Battery capacity warranty runs through August 2018.

dhanson865
Moderator
Posts: 1477
Joined: Wed May 25, 2011 7:12 am
Leaf Number: 16156
Location: Tennessee

Re: 2013-2014 bar losers and capacity losses

Thu Mar 09, 2017 3:49 pm

bpnugent wrote:I just lost my first capacity bar on my 2013 Nissan Leaf. Here are my stats:

MY13 (took delivery 10/13)
Date of loss: 2/6/17


How about the date of manufacture from the driver door jamb label?
2012 Leaf tires 195/65/15 Dunlop Enasave 01 A/S, 15" Rims
wiki/index.php?title=Real_World_Battery_Capacity_Loss
(leaf range chart)
(efficiency 3.x KW vs 6.x KW)
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silverone
Posts: 94
Joined: Sat Jan 02, 2016 4:29 pm
Delivery Date: 03 Jan 2017
Location: Eastern OH

Re: 2013-2014 bar losers and capacity losses

Thu Mar 09, 2017 4:18 pm

Leaf Spy varies wildly with ambient temperatures in my experience. My reading has been +/- up to 7AHr with daily monitoring over 2 months.
2013 SL with Premium package - build date 5/13. 12 bar car with 47,000 miles and counting... Trying to nurse 12 bars to 60,000 miles and beyond if possible!

2014 Volt - 46,000+ miles

cwerdna
Gold Member
Posts: 7260
Joined: Fri Jun 03, 2011 4:31 pm
Delivery Date: 28 Jul 2013
Location: SF Bay Area, CA

Re: 2013-2014 bar losers and capacity losses

Thu Mar 09, 2017 4:21 pm

silverone wrote:Leaf Spy varies wildly with ambient temperatures in my experience. My reading has been +/- up to 7AHr with daily monitoring over 2 months.

I've never seen swings in AHr THAT wide in my over 1 year of monitoring, almost daily.

If the values are valid (e.g. actually connected w/green rectangle and counter inside changing), I'd say the AHr values have not varied more than about 2 from the highest to lowest in a several month rolling period and that's really extreme. Generally, it's within 1.0 AHr in a rolling 1 month period. (No, I don't have a spreadsheet where I input the numbers but I do take screenshots and make a rough note.)

'13 blue Leaf SV w/premium package (owned)
'13 blue Leaf SV w/QC + LED & premium packages (lease over, car returned)
'06 Prius

silverone
Posts: 94
Joined: Sat Jan 02, 2016 4:29 pm
Delivery Date: 03 Jan 2017
Location: Eastern OH

Re: 2013-2014 bar losers and capacity losses

Thu Mar 09, 2017 4:55 pm

cwerdna wrote:
silverone wrote:Leaf Spy varies wildly with ambient temperatures in my experience. My reading has been +/- up to 7AHr with daily monitoring over 2 months.

I've never seen swings in AHr THAT wide in my over 1 year of monitoring, almost daily.

If the values are valid (e.g. actually connected w/green rectangle and counter inside changing), I'd say the AHr values have not varied more than about 2 from the highest to lowest in a several month rolling period and that's really extreme. Generally, it's within 1.0 AHr in a rolling 1 month period. (No, I don't have a spreadsheet where I input the numbers but I do take screenshots and make a rough note.)


Our temperature swings may be much higher. Here are some sample values of high and low peaks with most other daily and intraday readings in line with overall temperature swings. Excerpts from Dropbox logs.

Date.................Ambient(avg)................................AHr
3/9...............................50.......................................62.00
3/4...............................27.......................................66.047
2/24.............................67.......................................59.409
2/18.............................57.......................................64.55
2/3...............................23.......................................67.284
1/23.............................55.......................................62.588
1/17.............................34.......................................65.034
2013 SL with Premium package - build date 5/13. 12 bar car with 47,000 miles and counting... Trying to nurse 12 bars to 60,000 miles and beyond if possible!

2014 Volt - 46,000+ miles

cwerdna
Gold Member
Posts: 7260
Joined: Fri Jun 03, 2011 4:31 pm
Delivery Date: 28 Jul 2013
Location: SF Bay Area, CA

Re: 2013-2014 bar losers and capacity losses

Thu Mar 09, 2017 5:12 pm

^^^
I've never seen swings like that. I suspect some of the outliers are actually invalid values.

I've never even turned on the Dropbox uploading and didn't realize it even existed until now :oops:, as I glossed over that part of settings.

I'm just looking at the AHr, SOH, Hx, etc. screen w/all the cell voltages when I know I have a valid connection and taking screenshots. If other values in the Dropbox data file for that row are totally messed up (e.g. 0 or totally unreasonable) on those outlier AHr readings, then I suspect you weren't connected at the time and they're just garbage uninitialized values. I'd toss the data for those rows completely.

I've seen all sorts of non-sensical and/or useless values when Leaf Spy isn't connected (isn't showing green rectangle in the lower right w/the numbers counting up then starting over).

I just checked all my screenshots going from now back to mid-Dec 2016 and my AHr reading has ALWAYS been 56.xx to 57.xx. The same goes when skimming View Trip Log going all the way back to Oct 2016.

'13 blue Leaf SV w/premium package (owned)
'13 blue Leaf SV w/QC + LED & premium packages (lease over, car returned)
'06 Prius

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