VAB5
Posts: 12
Joined: Sun Jun 04, 2017 7:16 am
Delivery Date: 12 Jun 2017
Leaf Number: 301651

Re: 2016-2017 model year 30 kWh bar losers and capacity losses

Sat Jun 17, 2017 7:34 am

DaveinOlyWA wrote:
VAB5 wrote:No, it's 11 bars now.


edited previous. but prob around 82%


Thanks. How long can I expect before losing the next bar (percentage)?

I got the car with 4,961 miles on it (shipped from AZ to VA), and it wasn't fully charged. I didn't count the capacity bars at the time. I noticed the bar drop the next day after charging to 100%, with 4,983 miles on it. Dealer says it had 12 bars when they shipped it. I'm trying to determine if theirs is a reasonable position, or if it's likely it only had 11 when they had it. Is that possible to determine?

And yes I know I screwed up buying an AZ car, not checking the build date, and not getting a LeafSpy read out. Good thing is that it has the balance of the factory warranty.

DaveinOlyWA
Posts: 12340
Joined: Sat Apr 24, 2010 7:43 pm
Delivery Date: 10 Nov 2016
Leaf Number: 314199
Location: Olympia, WA
Contact: Website

Re: 2016-2017 model year 30 kWh bar losers and capacity losses

Sat Jun 17, 2017 7:55 am

VAB5 wrote:
DaveinOlyWA wrote:
VAB5 wrote:No, it's 11 bars now.


edited previous. but prob around 82%


Thanks. How long can I expect before losing the next bar (percentage)?

I got the car with 4,961 miles on it (shipped from AZ to VA), and it wasn't fully charged. I didn't count the capacity bars at the time. I noticed the bar drop the next day after charging to 100%, with 4,983 miles on it. Dealer says it had 12 bars when they shipped it. I'm trying to determine if theirs is a reasonable position, or if it's likely it only had 11 when they had it. Is that possible to determine?

And yes I know I screwed up buying an AZ car, not checking the build date, and not getting a LeafSpy read out. Good thing is that it has the balance of the factory warranty.


well the next several bars represent roughly 6¼% capacity but...

I have to think you have a good chance as any of gaining back the bar possibly although it would be temporary. You have a car that has literally not been used. Coming from AZ, I can only hope it did not sit out in full Sun at near full charge. Are you the 2nd owner? or was this a loaner or something?
2011 SL; 44,598 miles. 2013 S; 44,840 miles.2016 S30 (build 10/2016)"low water marks" 27,000 miles.363GID Ahr 79.13Hx95.17%kwh28.1QCs238,L2's 251
My Blog; http://daveinolywa.blogspot.com" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

VAB5
Posts: 12
Joined: Sun Jun 04, 2017 7:16 am
Delivery Date: 12 Jun 2017
Leaf Number: 301651

Re: 2016-2017 model year 30 kWh bar losers and capacity losses

Sat Jun 17, 2017 7:58 am

I'm the 2nd owner. It was a corporate car.

DaveinOlyWA
Posts: 12340
Joined: Sat Apr 24, 2010 7:43 pm
Delivery Date: 10 Nov 2016
Leaf Number: 314199
Location: Olympia, WA
Contact: Website

Re: 2016-2017 model year 30 kWh bar losers and capacity losses

Sat Jun 17, 2017 8:29 am

VAB5 wrote:I'm the 2nd owner. It was a corporate car.


yeah figured as much. lemme guess; not used by the engineering dept who would have known better? :?
2011 SL; 44,598 miles. 2013 S; 44,840 miles.2016 S30 (build 10/2016)"low water marks" 27,000 miles.363GID Ahr 79.13Hx95.17%kwh28.1QCs238,L2's 251
My Blog; http://daveinolywa.blogspot.com" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

VAB5
Posts: 12
Joined: Sun Jun 04, 2017 7:16 am
Delivery Date: 12 Jun 2017
Leaf Number: 301651

Re: 2016-2017 model year 30 kWh bar losers and capacity losses

Sat Jun 17, 2017 9:10 am

What is the graph telling me? What are the red/blue lines?

VAB5 wrote:
Image

DaveinOlyWA
Posts: 12340
Joined: Sat Apr 24, 2010 7:43 pm
Delivery Date: 10 Nov 2016
Leaf Number: 314199
Location: Olympia, WA
Contact: Website

Re: 2016-2017 model year 30 kWh bar losers and capacity losses

Sat Jun 17, 2017 9:38 am

Red means active cell balancing is happening. Blue means it isn't. In my experience it would seem that Blue means they are receiving or static and red means they are giving?

**edit**

you see both high and low red/blue so I would keep in mind that the readings displayed may not completely accurately reflex everything that is going on.
2011 SL; 44,598 miles. 2013 S; 44,840 miles.2016 S30 (build 10/2016)"low water marks" 27,000 miles.363GID Ahr 79.13Hx95.17%kwh28.1QCs238,L2's 251
My Blog; http://daveinolywa.blogspot.com" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

jbuntz
Posts: 74
Joined: Thu Dec 08, 2016 5:41 am
Delivery Date: 17 Dec 2016
Leaf Number: 303765
Location: New Braunfels, TX

Re: 2016-2017 model year 30 kWh bar losers and capacity losses

Sat Jun 17, 2017 11:55 am

Here is what mine looks like now. 309 GIDs now.
Image
Mfg 11/15 Del 12/16 TX 2016 SL 30kWh,
30 Apr 2017 5175 mi 324 GID Ahr 70.75 SOH 89% Hx 85.31% kWh 25.1
11 Aug 2017 11 bar 9245 mi 282 GID Ahr 61.68 SOH 77% Hx 75.83% kWh 21.9
21 Oct 2017 10 bars 12000 mi 260 GID Ahr 57.22 SOH 71% Hx 70.58% kWh 20.2

Phatcat73
Posts: 433
Joined: Fri Feb 08, 2013 2:44 pm
Leaf Number: 401511
Location: Buffalo Grove, Il

Re: 2016-2017 model year 30 kWh bar losers and capacity losses

Sun Jun 18, 2017 7:31 am

For comparison, we leased our 2016 SV in January. It sat on the lot for about 6 months with about 125 miles on it. Today, with 4400 miles it's at 79.7 AHr and 100% SOH. Normally see between 120 and 130 miles on the GOM (non ECO/AC off). It originally had 97% SOH and dipped down to 95 a couple months later, however as the weather became warmer and after a few QC, the SOH is now consistently at 100.

For those folks with lower than expected AHr, I suggest a few QC from a low state of charge to full to see if it helps.
2016 SV; purchased 20-Jan-17, <5k, 98% SOH; 01-Apr-17
2013 SV; purchased 6-March-13 44k, 81% SOH; 3-Apr-17
2015 S; purchased 29-July-14, moved to AZ Nov-2014, 19k, 83% SOH; 30-Mar-17
(LD storage) 2009 Ford Escape Hybrid 4x2), 101k

Phatcat73
Posts: 433
Joined: Fri Feb 08, 2013 2:44 pm
Leaf Number: 401511
Location: Buffalo Grove, Il

Re: 2016-2017 model year 30 kWh bar losers and capacity losses

Sun Jun 18, 2017 7:39 am

[quote="VAB5"]What is the graph telling me? What are the red/blue lines?

[quote="VAB5"]

VAB - The lines illustrate a voltage difference with 8mv being the delta. Normally it's a problem when the mv reading is much higher. Looks like your cells are well balanced.

What's alarming is your low SOH at 80%. This represents about a 20% battery range loss which I don't consider normal. I would take it to the dealer and explain you lost about 20% range (w 1 bar loss indicator) and have them check it out.
2016 SV; purchased 20-Jan-17, <5k, 98% SOH; 01-Apr-17
2013 SV; purchased 6-March-13 44k, 81% SOH; 3-Apr-17
2015 S; purchased 29-July-14, moved to AZ Nov-2014, 19k, 83% SOH; 30-Mar-17
(LD storage) 2009 Ford Escape Hybrid 4x2), 101k

DaveinOlyWA
Posts: 12340
Joined: Sat Apr 24, 2010 7:43 pm
Delivery Date: 10 Nov 2016
Leaf Number: 314199
Location: Olympia, WA
Contact: Website

Re: 2016-2017 model year 30 kWh bar losers and capacity losses

Sun Jun 18, 2017 9:48 am

Phatcat73 wrote:
VAB5 wrote:What is the graph telling me? What are the red/blue lines?

VAB5 wrote:
VAB - The lines illustrate a voltage difference with 8mv being the delta. Normally it's a problem when the mv reading is much higher. Looks like your cells are well balanced.

What's alarming is your low SOH at 80%. This represents about a 20% battery range loss which I don't consider normal. I would take it to the dealer and explain you lost about 20% range (w 1 bar loss indicator) and have them check it out.


SOH can be used in to help understand range loss but is not a direct (or indirect) measure. You want to look at things like kwh available at full charge or ahr readings
2011 SL; 44,598 miles. 2013 S; 44,840 miles.2016 S30 (build 10/2016)"low water marks" 27,000 miles.363GID Ahr 79.13Hx95.17%kwh28.1QCs238,L2's 251
My Blog; http://daveinolywa.blogspot.com" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

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