Teflon and Fabric Protection for our LEAFs

Yesterday Malcolm and I had our new LEAFs detailed, including applying two coats of a Teflon product to the paint and also having a fabric protector applied to the interior (among other treatments). We've known our "Detail guy" Jim Sadler for many many years in San Diego. He runs a business called Ultra Protective Systems and is very knowledgable about cars and their paints and finishes. Jim is an expert at polishing out scratches and applying touch up paint. It took Jim about 9 hours to do both of our cars and they turned out great.

Jim has done lots of work for car dealers and private parties in San Diego, and knows his stuff. He used to have a small shop in Kearny Mesa near the car dealers there, but the rent just got to be too much. So now he carries all of his supplies and works mobile, coming to you. If anyone is interested, I would be glad to provide Jim's contact information via PM. I don't get any kickback or finders fees; I'm just a satisfied customer and want Jim to continue doing what he does. His prices are reasonable for the service and expertise he brings to the job.

He was able to spot and remove several small imperfections from both of our cars that were a result of either the manufacturing or transporting process. Both of our cars look fantastic...

No offense, but numerous tests, including one by Consumer Reports, has shown that Teflon paint protection on clear-coated vehicles offers nothing beyond what a good wax job affords...

Randy said:

Yesterday Malcolm and I had our new LEAFs detailed, including applying two coats of a Teflon product to the paint and also having a fabric protector applied to the interior (among other treatments).

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No offense taken...But...I've had several cars treated and I can attest that there are tangible benefits, particularly when washing. The water bead-up and run off that occurs with a teflon-treated car is equivalent to having a good coat of wax on the car for several years. That alone is worth it to me, but there are several other benefits as well.

I usually keep my cars for several years, and getting a teflon coating applied helps me keep the cars looking their best for many years to come...

Each to their own but I have had cars that do exactly the same thing after a couple of years with only wax applied. I, too, tend to keep my cars a long time and my oldest, a 99 BMW with 160K on it, which gets wax maybe every two years or so, looks like it did the day it was new.

I wish someone could point me to at least one unbiased test report that shows that Teflon is any better than wax. I can point to may, including the CR reports, that says it isn't. But it certainly doesn't hurt - except perhaps in the wallet - so why not. Now, Scotchgard on cloth upholstery is another matter and I intend to do that on my Leaf (it's meaningless on cars with leather upholstery, however).

Your car looks great, by the way!

Randy said:

No offense taken...But...I've had several cars treated and I can attest that there are tangible benefits, particularly when washing. The water bead-up and run off that occurs with a teflon-treated car is equivalent to having a good coat of wax on the car for several years. That alone is worth it to me, but there are several other benefits as well.

I usually keep my cars for several years, and getting a teflon coating applied helps me keep the cars looking their best for many years to come...

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Great pics, Randy! How much does Jim charge, and can I get a 'same name' discount?? :lol:

Also, does he do North County (i.e. Oceanside?)

I think I put 12+ coats of Zaino (Z2, Z5) on one of my cars in the first 3 months. It was just awesome. You could watch individual flecks of dust land on the car. The first wash after was almost humorous -- some soft water with light soap the car practically cleaned and dried itself.
Alas, the benefits wore off about six months later.

There's no way I'm ever doing that multi-coat Zaino again. It took hours and hours.
I intend to clean it well, put one coat of Z2 on the Leaf, and call it good.

Undecided on interior fabric protection. I'm worried about smears/dirt than spills. Does the Scotchguard really work for keeping this clean? Make it easier to wipe off? Is it ALREADY in the fabric? I don't know.

What does it cost to have someone spend half a day (!) detailing the Leaf and putting a teflon coat on it?

He normally charges $300 for the inside and out as I described, but since Malcolm and I had our cars together at the same location for the one-two punch, he did us both for $250 each. He does charge $100 less to re-do the same car down the road, and that would include renewing the teflon...

I asked his permission about posting a referral and he was fine with it. I'm not sure how far north he would go, but he lives in Cardiff, so Oceanside shouldn't be any problem.

Randy said:

He normally charges $300 for the inside and out as I described, but since Malcolm and I had our cars together at the same location for the one-two punch, he did us both for $250 each. He does charge $100 less to re-do the same car down the road, and that would include renewing the teflon...

I asked his permission about posting a referral and he was fine with it. I'm not sure how far north he would go, but he lives in Cardiff, so Oceanside shouldn't be any problem.

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Thanks for the info, Randy. If I get the urge to take him up on the service, I'll PM you for the number.

I had a Miata lease and had the system applied.... two years,
no waxing.... and a fabulous, deep shine.

Thanks for posting the pics and info Randy. I'm pretty good at detailing the exterior of my own cars but I am interested in the interior fabric protection. I normally purchase cars with leather seats so this will be the first car in recent times with cloth seats for me. I'm concerned about what the seats are going to look like after my son has been in the car a few times :| . Can you elaborate on what the fabric protection is? In the "old days" I would get a can of Scotch guard and spray them on the seats. I don't even know if that stuff is available any more.

I always thought those paint products made refinishing and paint repair difficult.

Frankly, I'm likely to be less anal about this car than any I have owned in the past as I am going to lease (probably for four years) and not buy for the first time ever, and not actually owning the vehicle takes away some of that incentive to be particularly OCD. I'll certainly keep it in nice condition if only for my own pleasure, but I'll not get as crazy as I usually do with a vehicle I own out-right.

Hi Frank,
What Jim told us about the spray-on fabric protector is that it is an industrial version of a product similiar to 3M's Scotch-Gard, except that it will last a lot longer. If you don't wash it off, it is supposed to last several years. The purpose of the fabric protector is to cause any liquid spills to bead up and give you time to wipe them up before they get soaked into the fabric.

A damp cloth is used to clean the fabric. If you use a cloth that is too wet, then you could wash off some or all of the fabric protector and make it less effective.

I don't know what the qualities of the fabric protector are as far as repelling dirt or making dirt easier to remove from the seats.

GroundLoop said:

I think I put 12+ coats of Zaino (Z2, Z5) on one of my cars in the first 3 months. It was just awesome. You could watch individual flecks of dust land on the car. The first wash after was almost humorous -- some soft water with light soap the car practically cleaned and dried itself.
Alas, the benefits wore off about six months later.

There's no way I'm ever doing that multi-coat Zaino again. It took hours and hours.
I intend to clean it well, put one coat of Z2 on the Leaf, and call it good.

Undecided on interior fabric protection. I'm worried about smears/dirt than spills. Does the Scotchguard really work for keeping this clean? Make it easier to wipe off? Is it ALREADY in the fabric? I don't know.

What does it cost to have someone spend half a day (!) detailing the Leaf and putting a teflon coat on it?

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Was hoping someone else was a Zaino nut Figures it'd be you

++ to Zaino - I've been using Zaino now for a decade on all of my vehicles and it's been truly astounding. Coincidentally, I just spent half of today doing my wife's new car for the first time (which always takes longer) - oww, my arms

To each his own (Randy, Malcolm- the cars look amazing!) - but my Leaf's getting a full Zaino job the first weekend after its home :ugeek:

Hi Randy,
Good looking car!
I'm sending this message from Scarborough, Maine where it is snowing like hell right now! Word is I'll be getting my LEAF in September...but not holding my breath. I'm a retired pharmacist with a reputation for acquiring electronic gadgets hence the nickname Gadge. I'm an energy conservationist having built a super-insulated home in 1986 with 12" thick walls. I plan to go 'carbon neutral' with the LEAF by installing PV solar panels providing the equivalent amount of power my LEAF will require. Since technology in EV's moves quickly now, I plan on a lease rather than purchase.
I trust you're elated to have your LEAF...was it like Christmas when you were a kid?
All the best,
Gadge

Another alternative (for the exterior) is a product I'm having installed tomorrow: Armourfend. It is essentially a nearly invisible, ultra thin non-yellowing urethane film that is applied to areas you want to protect from rock chips, insects and road debris. I'm doing the lower and upper bumper, half of the hood, both rear-view mirrors, door cups (findernail scratches I hate), and the horizontal painted area below the rear trunk lid. The manufacturer is located in El Dorado Hills, California. Take a look at its website www.armourfend.com (phone 916-337-9649).

When I received my Leaf in May, I was surprised at how rough the paint was. It appears that the PDI was just that, nothing was done to the paint.

I have held the position as Chief Concours Judge for the Porsche Club of America, and written a few detailing books, so I went through a mini-Concours prep on the car, and it responded quite well.

First off, I clayed the paint surface of the Leaf, and was amazed I what I found. Claying removes surface contamination from the paint of a car, and the Leaf, even though it was only a month an a half since its manufacture had more contaminants in its paint than a car that had sat outside next to an oil refinery for a year! It took quite a bit of effort to get the paint clean, but it did clean up nicely, and now has the "smooth as a baby's butt" feel to it.

Next I covered the paint with a sealant. For years I have used a product that is primarily for aircraft and boats, called Rejex.



It is a creme product that spreads on easily and simply wipes off. It does have come caveats, it must be applied in the shade and on a surface that is 85 degrees or less, and must be allowed to cure in the shade for 12 hours. I also apply it to the window glass and the wheels.

The upside to this effort is that the surface will remain sharp and slick for 6 months to a year depending on the weather, and application to the windshield allows bugs to bounce off before they explode due to impact. Any that do stick to the windshield come off with a wet towel. Applying Rejex to the wheels keeps brake dust from sticking and keeps wheels much cleaner looking.

I highly recommend Rejex over ANY organic wax product.

For the interior, I spray the cloth seating and door surfaces with 3M Scotchguard Carpet and Upholstery Protector.



This is not your typical spray can Scotchgard, but the commercial version that comes in a gallon bottle, and must be diluted and sprayed on using a pressure sprayer. I give the cloth a good wet application, taking care to keep the spray off of the plastic parts of the interior, (wipe up any overspray immediately), let it dry for a few hours, and this application is good for a year or more. There are no issues with the Scotchgard interacting negatively with the cloth interior materials.

And with that I have protected my Leafs paint from all sorts of contaminates and made bug removal much easier, and have pretty much made the interior stain and spill proof. One last point is that this type of Scotchgard is not available over the counter in California, but can be easily ordered online. It is primarily for carpet and home upholstery, and does an excellent job at keeping carpets clean too.

One last product I recommend for black plastic and rubber parts of the car is Adam's Car Care Products In & Out Detailing Dressing.



This stuff is great for tires, and black plastic parts. It buff up easily, and does not leave a greasy residue.

I highly recommend these products.

Guy With Leaf:

I did some Googling about the Armourfend product since I was unfamiliar with it, and discovered some unhappiness out there with it. Primarily in two areas, using razor blades to trim the product when it is installed (and cutting through the car paint), as well as product yellowing issues....Just thought I'd bring it up to you before you had it done so you could search it out yourself and make an informed decision....

Thanks, Randy

Randy: I just had the Armourfend applied and it looks absolutely beautiful. I spoke to Bob Jackson who runs Armourfend here in the US as well as worldwide and he addressed the issues you mentioned. First, as to cutting in cars, all of his kits are "pre-cut" and have been for nearly 15 years. As to the yellowing, the unfortunate situation is the confusion over the use of the generic name "Armourfend" which has been confused with the actual different film manufacturers whom produce generic paint protection film. The confusion over the name as well as variations in quality have produced inferior, and hence, yellowing film. Armourfend is a patent house/design center and is not a film manufacturer. Bob uses Xpel, a far superior product which does not yellow. He showed me his wife's BMW which has had the Xpel product on it for some 5 years and there is absolutely no yellowing. Bob has a new website going up by the first of September and he said if you would like to contact him with any questions you or other Forum members can contact hims at [email protected] or call him at 916-337-9649.