Keefeollers
Posts: 11
Joined: Sun Oct 15, 2017 12:42 pm
Delivery Date: 15 Oct 2017
Leaf Number: 006384

Re: I Replaced All the Cells in my Leaf's Battery- Now I Have Some Problems

Sun Oct 15, 2017 5:09 pm

cliff wrote:I would also recommend the service manual. The P31E7 just indicates that P0AA6 has
been detected. A cause of the P0AA6 can be the battery heaters, but they were not
in all 2011 LEAF's. With all the CAN errors, my first thought would be for the non-high
voltage connector to the battery, though P0AA6 could be from many different causes
inside the battery. Also odd to see the 3rd CAN-bus errors from the AV, is the 12 volt
battery charged?


I found the 2012 service manual and I have looked at some of the error codes I have. Troubleshooting now.

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Nubo
Posts: 4848
Joined: Fri May 28, 2010 11:01 am
Delivery Date: 31 Oct 2014
Location: Vallejo, CA

Re: I Replaced All the Cells in my Leaf's Battery- Now I Have Some Problems

Mon Oct 16, 2017 3:07 pm

Not sure where the BMS components are located... Are you using BMS from the new pack or the old pack? Perhaps the BMS modules are "registered" to the ECU in some way over CAN. So if the new battery modules you used, contain their own (new) BMS then that could be an issue. Just speculating.
I noticed you're still working with polymers.

alozzy
Posts: 1072
Joined: Fri Jan 20, 2017 4:25 pm
Delivery Date: 18 Jan 2017
Location: Vancouver, BC
Contact: Website

Re: I Replaced All the Cells in my Leaf's Battery- Now I Have Some Problems

Mon Oct 16, 2017 9:36 pm

Cool project, hope you get this figured out as it gives the rest of us hope for future battery reconditioning.

This might be useful to you:

http://www.nicoclub.com/manuals/Leaf/2011%20Leaf/br.pdf (Brake system)
http://www.nicoclub.com/manuals/Leaf/20 ... af/brc.pdf (Brake control system)
http://www.nicoclub.com/manuals/Leaf/20 ... af/evc.pdf (EV control system)
http://www.nicoclub.com/manuals/Leaf/2011%20Leaf (all the other manuals, if you need them)

All the DTC codes you posted are covered in those manuals, if you know how to diagnose the issues properly (I don't, I'm just good at digging info online).

Good luck!
Vancouver, CA owner of a 2013 Ocean Blue SV + QC, purchased 01/2017 in WA
Zencar 12/20/24/30A L1/L2 portable EVSE
1-1/4" Curt #11396 hitch
After market, DIY LED DRLs
LeafSpy Pro + Konnwei KW902 ELM327 BT OBDII dongle
Loving my first BEV :D

thurakyawswar
Posts: 1
Joined: Fri Jun 22, 2018 8:36 am
Delivery Date: 22 Jun 2018
Leaf Number: 010925

Re: I Replaced All the Cells in my Leaf's Battery- Now I Have Some Problems

Sun Aug 12, 2018 8:44 am

Keefeollers wrote:
cliff wrote:I would also recommend the service manual. The P31E7 just indicates that P0AA6 has
been detected. A cause of the P0AA6 can be the battery heaters, but they were not
in all 2011 LEAF's. With all the CAN errors, my first thought would be for the non-high
voltage connector to the battery, though P0AA6 could be from many different causes
inside the battery. Also odd to see the 3rd CAN-bus errors from the AV, is the 12 volt
battery charged?


I found the 2012 service manual and I have looked at some of the error codes I have. Troubleshooting now.



Have u found solution now ?

DaveinOlyWA
Posts: 13133
Joined: Sat Apr 24, 2010 7:43 pm
Delivery Date: 16 Feb 2018
Leaf Number: 314199
Location: Olympia, WA
Contact: Website

Re: I Replaced All the Cells in my Leaf's Battery- Now I Have Some Problems

Sun Aug 12, 2018 9:45 am

Just guessing here but when Nissan replaces pack, they "have to" reset the BMS. Not sure if this is required for cell swaps (I am guessing it is) or whether you can do this at home.
2011 SL; 44,598 miles. 2013 S; 44,840 miles.2016 S30 deceased. 29,413 miles. 2018 S40; 8743 miles, 485 GIDs, 37.6 kwh 111.39 Ahr , SOH 96.49, Hx 114.98
My Blog; http://daveinolywa.blogspot.com" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

Keefeollers
Posts: 11
Joined: Sun Oct 15, 2017 12:42 pm
Delivery Date: 15 Oct 2017
Leaf Number: 006384

Re: I Replaced All the Cells in my Leaf's Battery- Now I Have Some Problems (Solved)

Tue Aug 14, 2018 11:55 am

thurakyawswar wrote:
Keefeollers wrote:
cliff wrote:I would also recommend the service manual. The P31E7 just indicates that P0AA6 has
been detected. A cause of the P0AA6 can be the battery heaters, but they were not
in all 2011 LEAF's. With all the CAN errors, my first thought would be for the non-high
voltage connector to the battery, though P0AA6 could be from many different causes
inside the battery. Also odd to see the 3rd CAN-bus errors from the AV, is the 12 volt
battery charged?


I found the 2012 service manual and I have looked at some of the error codes I have. Troubleshooting now.



Have u found solution now ?


Well, I forgot this thread existed for a while. Oops

Sort of? The issue was that when we lifted the vertical bank of cells back into the case I accidentally put it down on an alignment peg. (batteries are heavy and I am weak) This punctured one of the cells and that was causing all the error codes. Bought a new cell, for WWAAYY too much money, and success, the car drives!

But all is not well in Leaf town. No siree.

We expected the car to recognize the new cells had different voltages and adjust itself accordingly. NOPE. We still had exactly the same range as we did before. Understandably, we were pissed. $5k on the car, $500 on towing it back from Arizona, $3k on the replacement cells, All that work and no change in range? Priceless.

Now, my guess is that the BMS had to be reset to accept the new cells, but there was no way we could really do that. So we had to just eat our losses and drive it how it was. Which sucked because it couldn't even make it halfway across town. AND I did a goof and screwed up the steering components by turning the wheel while a front tire was still tied down to a trailer; I bent a whole bunch of stuff. This cost us another $1k or so to fix.

So, let's tally up how much we spent on this. By my count we are in this for more than $9,500 and all we have is a car with 26 miles of range. woohoo. We could have bought a used Leaf that had more range and was a newer model for that price. (Which we did)

If you've read this far, this would be the point in the story where all is lost for our heroes and there seems to be no way out. But things get better.

You see, as we continued to drive the car, our range was steadily increasing. One month it was 26 miles, the next 30 miles, and so on. Eventually, around June of this year, we had over 60 miles worth of range! Ha! Now this is a car we can use. Take that, oil companies. We will bring you down, one trip to the grocery store at a time.

Of course, we don't know if it will stay this way. All throughout winter we were sitting at 25-35 miles of range. It could be that the warmer temperatures are giving us more range and when winter comes again we will lose it. Who knows? We'll just have to wait and see.

We also have added a janky battery heating system which we haven't even used yet. Go figure

Overall, I'd say the project worked. We set out to give the car more range than when we bought it and we succeeded. However, if anyone else wants to take on a project like this, be smarter than I was. Don't break your steering rack, or your suspension, or your batteries, or spend way too much trying to get it to work because you are just that stubborn.

Heck, I read an article that said Nissan was offering refurbished batteries for Leafs now. Maybe just do that instead. (I just looked it up and apparently this is only in Japan? Someone correct me if I'm wrong.)

If anyone has any more questions I'll do my best to not forget about this thread again.

Cheers,
Keefe

Lothsahn
Posts: 47
Joined: Thu Apr 05, 2018 4:35 pm
Delivery Date: 04 Jan 2018
Leaf Number: 007797

Re: I Replaced All the Cells in my Leaf's Battery- Now I Have Some Problems (Solved)

Tue Aug 14, 2018 12:21 pm

Keefeollers wrote:
thurakyawswar wrote:
Keefeollers wrote:
I found the 2012 service manual and I have looked at some of the error codes I have. Troubleshooting now.



Have u found solution now ?


Well, I forgot this thread existed for a while. Oops

Sort of? The issue was that when we lifted the vertical bank of cells back into the case I accidentally put it down on an alignment peg. (batteries are heavy and I am weak) This punctured one of the cells and that was causing all the error codes. Bought a new cell, for WWAAYY too much money, and success, the car drives!

But all is not well in Leaf town. No siree.

We expected the car to recognize the new cells had different voltages and adjust itself accordingly. NOPE. We still had exactly the same range as we did before. Understandably, we were pissed. $5k on the car, $500 on towing it back from Arizona, $3k on the replacement cells, All that work and no change in range? Priceless.

Now, my guess is that the BMS had to be reset to accept the new cells, but there was no way we could really do that. So we had to just eat our losses and drive it how it was. Which sucked because it couldn't even make it halfway across town. AND I did a goof and screwed up the steering components by turning the wheel while a front tire was still tied down to a trailer; I bent a whole bunch of stuff. This cost us another $1k or so to fix.

So, let's tally up how much we spent on this. By my count we are in this for more than $9,500 and all we have is a car with 26 miles of range. woohoo. We could have bought a used Leaf that had more range and was a newer model for that price. (Which we did)

If you've read this far, this would be the point in the story where all is lost for our heroes and there seems to be no way out. But things get better.

You see, as we continued to drive the car, our range was steadily increasing. One month it was 26 miles, the next 30 miles, and so on. Eventually, around June of this year, we had over 60 miles worth of range! Ha! Now this is a car we can use. Take that, oil companies. We will bring you down, one trip to the grocery store at a time.

Of course, we don't know if it will stay this way. All throughout winter we were sitting at 25-35 miles of range. It could be that the warmer temperatures are giving us more range and when winter comes again we will lose it. Who knows? We'll just have to wait and see.

We also have added a janky battery heating system which we haven't even used yet. Go figure

Overall, I'd say the project worked. We set out to give the car more range than when we bought it and we succeeded. However, if anyone else wants to take on a project like this, be smarter than I was. Don't break your steering rack, or your suspension, or your batteries, or spend way too much trying to get it to work because you are just that stubborn.

Heck, I read an article that said Nissan was offering refurbished batteries for Leafs now. Maybe just do that instead. (I just looked it up and apparently this is only in Japan? Someone correct me if I'm wrong.)

If anyone has any more questions I'll do my best to not forget about this thread again.

Cheers,
Keefe



For your spring/fall/winter range, consider getting one of these:
http://betterev.tabetalt.no/Produkt/nis ... er-kit-v2#

See this for more information:
viewtopic.php?f=37&t=11412&start=140

The issue is that the 2011/2012 Leafs often turn the heater on when it doesn't need to be on, eating your additional range. This happens when the temperature isn't TOO hot or TOO cold. The kit I linked is a switch you can install yourself to disable the heater when you don't need it.

Note: It's listed as 200.00 NOK, but that's actually only around $24. Compared to the battery work you did, that should be an easy job!

Lothsahn
Posts: 47
Joined: Thu Apr 05, 2018 4:35 pm
Delivery Date: 04 Jan 2018
Leaf Number: 007797

Re: I Replaced All the Cells in my Leaf's Battery- Now I Have Some Problems (Solved)

Tue Aug 14, 2018 12:32 pm

But all is not well in Leaf town. No siree.

We expected the car to recognize the new cells had different voltages and adjust itself accordingly. NOPE. We still had exactly the same range as we did before. Understandably, we were pissed. $5k on the car, $500 on towing it back from Arizona, $3k on the replacement cells, All that work and no change in range? Priceless.


Was that just the GOM (Guess of miles) or the actual distance the car was able to travel? My car reports 50 miles on the GOM when I start it, but I'd be lucky to actually get 25... In other words, was the new capacity immediately available to you but the GOM was wrong, or you really weren't even able to get the car across town?

And yes, you're right that the refurb program is Japan only, for now.

Keefeollers
Posts: 11
Joined: Sun Oct 15, 2017 12:42 pm
Delivery Date: 15 Oct 2017
Leaf Number: 006384

Re: I Replaced All the Cells in my Leaf's Battery- Now I Have Some Problems (Solved)

Tue Aug 14, 2018 1:08 pm

Lothsahn wrote:
But all is not well in Leaf town. No siree.

We expected the car to recognize the new cells had different voltages and adjust itself accordingly. NOPE. We still had exactly the same range as we did before. Understandably, we were pissed. $5k on the car, $500 on towing it back from Arizona, $3k on the replacement cells, All that work and no change in range? Priceless.


Was that just the GOM (Guess of miles) or the actual distance the car was able to travel? My car reports 50 miles on the GOM when I start it, but I'd be lucky to actually get 25... In other words, was the new capacity immediately available to you but the GOM was wrong, or you really weren't even able to get the car across town?

And yes, you're right that the refurb program is Japan only, for now.


Good question, the answer? We didn't really test it too much. It was like 6 months ago but I remember my dad saying that he was able to drive the car around our neighborhood for a good bit after the GOM hit zero and the car died. I don't remember the exact number but I think he said he could drive it 12-20 miles beyond the point where the car hit zero. I went through my text history and this happened in mid November of 2017. The car rated the range at around 25 to 30 miles max at this time.

So I guess in a way the change was immediate but there were too many variables to really tell. That replacement cell for the one I punctured? It was super out of whack with all the other cells. Using leaf spy, it hit as much as 120mv of difference between the others. This could have limited the charging of the other cells, preventing us from getting more range. Perhaps it just took 9 months for the battery to balance.

As far as getting the car across town, I could get the car to the other side of town but by that point the car had single digit miles left on the GOM. The only time we really took the car close to across town (before the range increase) was to get the steering fixed. It's about 14.5 miles to the repair shop and we started with about 30-ish miles I think? We got there with 13 miles left. When we got the car back it had 9 miles left and we towed it back, not wanting it to get stuck anywhere.

Another interesting thing is that after we replaced the cells, regen braking was very limited. We only really got 5-7 kw of regen max. But now we get much more regen 20-25 kw. Why? you got me.

It has been a while since I've looked at leaf spy but I can check it out and see if the battery has balanced. I don't have the car right now but I'll check on it when I do. Are there any other stats you want me to look at while I'm at it?

LeftieBiker
Posts: 9222
Joined: Wed May 22, 2013 3:17 am
Delivery Date: 31 May 2013
Location: Upstate New York, US

Re: I Replaced All the Cells in my Leaf's Battery- Now I Have Some Problems

Tue Aug 14, 2018 3:26 pm

When we got the car back it had 9 miles left and we towed it back, not wanting it to get stuck anywhere.


I understand your caution in this circumstance, but in case you don't know, there is usually roughly 5-10 miles of range left when the GOM stops showing numbers and just displays dashes. From your Dad's test I'd say you can safely use all the GOM's displayed range.
Scarlet Ember 2018 Leaf SL W/ Pro Pilot
2009 Vectrix VX-1 W/18 Leaf modules, & 3 EZIP E-bicycles.
PLEASE don't PM me with Leaf questions. Just post in the topic that seems most appropriate.

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