JMZingale12
Posts: 3
Joined: Sat Feb 10, 2018 11:23 am
Delivery Date: 22 Dec 2017
Leaf Number: 300729

Rapid Energy Loss in the Middle of Battery

Sat Feb 10, 2018 11:58 am

Hello All,

I've searched for quite a while on here, but haven't found a thread on the issue that I am having. I have seen posts on overall battery loss or bars, but my issue is different. I have a 2017 30kWh Model S. When I am driving to and from work, which is a mixture or side roads and some highway. MY round trip is around 44 miles and typically I use around 38% of my battery. This is great and I love that fact that I'm not using an gas anymore.

My issue is when the car get to between 55% and 25%. Normally, I get about 1.2 miles per battery % used. However, one I get to around the 55% used mark I experience RAPID battery loss. Between the 55% and 25% marks I get either .3 or .4 miles per battery % used. Then, once the car gets to the 25% the battery use goes back up to around 1.2 miles per battery % used. Has anyone else experienced this issue?

I'm keeping track of this on a spreadsheet, and I probably going to film this using my GoPro head-mounted camera to show Nissan what the issue is. I'm also tempter to just bring them the car when the battery is around the 55% mark. I'd appreciate and thoughts or insight anyone might have on this.

DaveinOlyWA
Posts: 12874
Joined: Sat Apr 24, 2010 7:43 pm
Delivery Date: 16 Feb 2018
Leaf Number: 314199
Location: Olympia, WA
Contact: Website

Re: Rapid Energy Loss in the Middle of Battery

Sat Feb 10, 2018 12:02 pm

so you get about 9 miles of range on the 55 to 25% SOC part? How well do you do going back down the hill?

sorry. meant to hit backspace and missed...

What is your range on an entire charge? Because that is all that matters. You are relying too much on LEAF instrumentation which... is... not a good idea. Way too many variables to make this conclusion unless you have repeated results over several different portions of your route
2011 SL; 44,598 miles. 2013 S; 44,840 miles.2016 S30 deceased. 29,413 miles. 2018 S40; 5775 miles, 488 GIDs, 38 kwh 113.37 Ahr available, SOH 98.21, Hx 115.75
My Blog; http://daveinolywa.blogspot.com" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

LeftieBiker
Posts: 8647
Joined: Wed May 22, 2013 3:17 am
Delivery Date: 31 May 2013
Location: Upstate New York, US

Re: Rapid Energy Loss in the Middle of Battery

Sat Feb 10, 2018 1:53 pm

To put it another way, it's likely that the middle of your route has terrain that is sucking energy because of climbing hills or driving above 60MPH. Or are you saying that your Leaf used to use less energy there than it does now...?
Scarlet Ember 2018 Leaf SL W/ Pro Pilot
2009 Vectrix VX-1 W/18 Leaf modules, & 3 EZIP E-bicycles.
PLEASE don't PM me with Leaf questions. Just post in the topic that seems most appropriate.

cmwade77
Posts: 122
Joined: Tue Nov 14, 2017 5:04 pm
Delivery Date: 15 Nov 2017

Re: Rapid Energy Loss in the Middle of Battery

Sat Feb 10, 2018 3:19 pm

Just to confirm, you have ruled out things like: Speed, terrain, AC Usage, etc., right?

JMZingale12
Posts: 3
Joined: Sat Feb 10, 2018 11:23 am
Delivery Date: 22 Dec 2017
Leaf Number: 300729

Re: Rapid Energy Loss in the Middle of Battery

Sat Feb 10, 2018 4:47 pm

Yes, I have ruled out the variables. In fact, I've run the route at different battery percentages. My normal drive home from work is 22 miles. When I leave work at 84% I get home with 64%. When I drive home, using the same route, but starting at 61% I get home with 24%.

DaveinOlyWA
Posts: 12874
Joined: Sat Apr 24, 2010 7:43 pm
Delivery Date: 16 Feb 2018
Leaf Number: 314199
Location: Olympia, WA
Contact: Website

Re: Rapid Energy Loss in the Middle of Battery

Sat Feb 10, 2018 4:55 pm

JMZingale12 wrote:Yes, I have ruled out the variables. In fact, I've run the route at different battery percentages. My normal drive home from work is 22 miles. When I leave work at 84% I get home with 64%. When I drive home, using the same route, but starting at 61% I get home with 24%.


Now you need LEAF Spy. What you are describing makes no sense but a weak cell can play havoc with your instrumentation. Have you tried resetting your miles/kwh meter at 55% or whenever this drop in performance starts to see what it says?
2011 SL; 44,598 miles. 2013 S; 44,840 miles.2016 S30 deceased. 29,413 miles. 2018 S40; 5775 miles, 488 GIDs, 38 kwh 113.37 Ahr available, SOH 98.21, Hx 115.75
My Blog; http://daveinolywa.blogspot.com" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

JMZingale12
Posts: 3
Joined: Sat Feb 10, 2018 11:23 am
Delivery Date: 22 Dec 2017
Leaf Number: 300729

Re: Rapid Energy Loss in the Middle of Battery

Sat Feb 10, 2018 5:04 pm

I just downloaded LeafSpy Pro and got the reader from Amazon today. I'm interested to see what happens. To me it seems like the cells in the middle are bad, but it is hard to tell right now. I just started playing around with LeafSpy today, and will see what happens over the next couple of weeks.

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RegGuheert
Posts: 6178
Joined: Mon Mar 19, 2012 4:12 am
Delivery Date: 16 Mar 2012
Leaf Number: 5926
Location: Northern VA

Re: Rapid Energy Loss in the Middle of Battery

Sat Feb 10, 2018 6:31 pm

DaveinOlyWA wrote:Now you need LEAF Spy. What you are describing makes no sense but a weak cell can play havoc with your instrumentation.
This was my first thought, as well. If there is a cell-pair failing, something like this could occur. OTOH, the BMS should eventually adjust in such a way that it thinks the battery is nearly dead before the bad cell-pair drops out.

BTW, is this happening in very cold temperatures? I see one particular cell-pair drop out worse than the others, but only in the severe cold.

Good job jumping on this quickly. If a cell-pair is failing, it can go quickly. Of course it will be covered under warranty, but you should be concerned that the car might not get you home one day.
RegGuheert
2011 Leaf SL Demo vehicle
10K miles: Apr 14, 2013, 20K miles (55.7Ah): Aug 7, 2014, 30K miles (52.0Ah): Dec 30, 2015, 40K miles (49.8Ah): Feb 8, 2017, 50K miles (47.2Ah): Dec 7, 2017.
Enphase Inverter Measured MTBF: M190, M215, M250, S280

DaveinOlyWA
Posts: 12874
Joined: Sat Apr 24, 2010 7:43 pm
Delivery Date: 16 Feb 2018
Leaf Number: 314199
Location: Olympia, WA
Contact: Website

Re: Rapid Energy Loss in the Middle of Battery

Sat Feb 10, 2018 6:38 pm

RegGuheert wrote:
DaveinOlyWA wrote:Now you need LEAF Spy. What you are describing makes no sense but a weak cell can play havoc with your instrumentation.
This was my first thought, as well. If there is a cell-pair failing, something like this could occur. OTOH, the BMS should eventually adjust in such a way that it thinks the battery is nearly dead before the bad cell-pair drops out.

BTW, is this happening in very cold temperatures? I see one particular cell-pair drop out worse than the others, but only in the severe cold.

Good job jumping on this quickly. If a cell-pair is failing, it can go quickly. Of course it will be covered under warranty, but you should be concerned that the car might not get you home one day.


Bad cells worsen as SOC goes down. He claims normalcy when below 25%
2011 SL; 44,598 miles. 2013 S; 44,840 miles.2016 S30 deceased. 29,413 miles. 2018 S40; 5775 miles, 488 GIDs, 38 kwh 113.37 Ahr available, SOH 98.21, Hx 115.75
My Blog; http://daveinolywa.blogspot.com" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

User avatar
RegGuheert
Posts: 6178
Joined: Mon Mar 19, 2012 4:12 am
Delivery Date: 16 Mar 2012
Leaf Number: 5926
Location: Northern VA

Re: Rapid Energy Loss in the Middle of Battery

Sat Feb 10, 2018 6:49 pm

DaveinOlyWA wrote:Bad cells worsen as SOC goes down. He claims normalcy when below 25%
Good point. That's weird.
RegGuheert
2011 Leaf SL Demo vehicle
10K miles: Apr 14, 2013, 20K miles (55.7Ah): Aug 7, 2014, 30K miles (52.0Ah): Dec 30, 2015, 40K miles (49.8Ah): Feb 8, 2017, 50K miles (47.2Ah): Dec 7, 2017.
Enphase Inverter Measured MTBF: M190, M215, M250, S280

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