Leaf won't start - a story

Hi one and all,

I provide the following for information as I was unable to find the same issue here.

A few days ago I was unable to start our leaf which had been parked in the garage for two days due to a snowstorm. After much internetting I decided to change the 12volt (4 and half years old).

The new battery did not change the situation. Car would turn on but, only go into P mode or Neutral.

We ended up having the car towed to the only leaf dealer in Nova Scotia! The tech there got the car running and carried out a 2hour diagnostic test. He found error codes which he cleared before the 2hour test. He found a code that suggested trouble with a fast charger but, we had not used one in several weeks.

The conclusion was that the 12volt had died and caused an error code to prevent start up.

Looking at obd2dongle and leaf spy so we can deal with it next time.

Expensive 12volt battery.

Hope this helps someone

Cheers

This is a very common problem. The search feature here isn't good, but it should have yielded it. What terms did you search?

Thanks leftie,
I forget exactly, but leaf won't start, 12 volt battery and other combinations.

i just didn't come up with a scenario quite like ours. Wouldn't jump start, just felt like an expensive garden ornament, lol.

All running nicely now. I may put a trickle charger on the 12 volt just for peace of mind.

cheers

nmleaf650 said:

The conclusion was that the 12volt had died and caused an error code to prevent start up.

Looking at obd2dongle and leaf spy so we can deal with it next time.

Click to expand...

This is a big part of why you could never had figured this out: the "casual" Leaf owner doesn't have access to error codes (or even know what LeafSpy is). So the moral of the story (and one that is probably responsible for at least 10% of all posts on this forum) is: replace the 12v battery before it becomes a problem. The Leaf (and many EVs) are highly dependent on a healthy 12v battery, which is why I replaced the stock lead-acid version with a LiFePO version early on...and have never had a "dead" 12v battery.
It's a good example of you can "pay me now or pay me later".

Check out this thread...good info...

http://www.mynissanleaf.com/viewtopic.php?f=30&t=27429#p544804

OP: you stated "...expensive 12V battery...". It shouldn't be expensive. I bought my Bosch AGM 61R at PepBoys for $151 US, with a 4-year full replacement warranty.

I agree with Stanton. In modern cars (EV and ICE), everythin is computer driven, and once voltage drops below a certain point, nothing will "boot up", as low voltage could damage sensitive computer parts. So, you get in the car, and NOTHING HAPPENS.

If you're interested in preventing the inconvenience of a no-start situation, replace the 12V battery before it fails.

Thanks to one and all.

As you say change it before it's knackered!

However, we had had no problems oil it wouldn't start. Hey ho.

As for battery price, we paid about $140cdn, when I referred to the expensive battery I meant the 350 tow charge and 400+ dealer charge!

Cheers

All of the networked computers in modern cars (petroleum or electric) don't function correctly if the 12V battery drops too low. I had an office vehicle a few years ago (2008 SUV) that would not start if the battery got a bit low. Even though there was plenty of power to crank the V8 engine at what sounded like normal speed, the engine management system would not provide fuel or ignition so it would not start. I always carried a booster battery with that vehicle and had to use it if I ran accessories too much without letting the engine idle.

An EV seems to be worse because it doesn't have large starting current (with slow cranking) so you don't notice the battery is getting weak until it fails.

nmleaf650 said:

Thanks to one and all.

As you say change it before it's knackered!

However, we had had no problems oil it wouldn't start. Hey ho.

As for battery price, we paid about $140cdn, when I referred to the expensive battery I meant the 350 tow charge and 400+ dealer charge!

Cheers

Click to expand...

I'm glad you mentioned the $$, because that proves my point: you could install a LiFePO4 battery for less than what you paid...and it will far outlast any lead-acid version. This isn't directed at you, but $$ are the biggest reason/complaint given by those who don't want to go Lithium 12v. In a car like the Leaf, it can make a huge difference.

Just want to confirm if ya'll think my 12V is finally dead. 6 year old 2013 MY, never replaced the 12V. This morning, vehicle would only make relay clicking sounds, dashboard display does not light up, but interesting to see the headlight indicator turn on, along with the rear side lights.

After reading the thread here, I'm guessing I need to replace it (after jumping it with my 2018 MY). Will I need to clear a bunch of error codes (using LeafSpy) that may show up after battery jumped?

jdcbomb said:

Just want to confirm if ya'll think my 12V is finally dead. 6 year old 2013 MY, never replaced the 12V. This morning, vehicle would only make relay clicking sounds, dashboard display does not light up, but interesting to see the headlight indicator turn on, along with the rear side lights.

After reading the thread here, I'm guessing I need to replace it (after jumping it with my 2018 MY). Will I need to clear a bunch of error codes (using LeafSpy) that may show up after battery jumped?

Click to expand...

You don't just "decide" to change the battery. Age has nothing to do with the state of the battery.

All you need is a battery voltage meter. Measure the resting voltage and when you have some load on the battery.

nmleaf650 said:

...The conclusion was that the 12volt had died and caused an error code to prevent start up. ...

Click to expand...

Yep. When I had a weak battery problem, there was somewhere around 30 error codes I had to clear. Reminds me of a short program I wrote once that generated over 600 pages of compiler errors, all for one missing semi-colon.

Given the age of the battery, the smart thing would be to replace it with a fully-charged new one - AGM if possible. You may not have to clear any codes.

jdcbomb said:

Just want to confirm if ya'll think my 12V is finally dead. 6 year old 2013 MY, never replaced the 12V. This morning, vehicle would only make relay clicking sounds, dashboard display does not light up, but interesting to see the headlight indicator turn on, along with the rear side lights.

After reading the thread here, I'm guessing I need to replace it (after jumping it with my 2018 MY). Will I need to clear a bunch of error codes (using LeafSpy) that may show up after battery jumped?

Click to expand...

Update: so I was right the 12V batt is dead. After letting it get "jumped" by my 2018 LEAF for about 20 min, the 2013 MY when started (put into drive initially looked normal then threw every possible error on the dash. The range went from 38 miles to 0 within 15 seconds of booting.

I can theoretically get it towed (for free due to insurance) to AutoZone for a new 12V batt, but I'm hoping to get this thing at least started up and drive it there myself...so I don't have to wait for the tow.

Am I out of luck here given the system seems to hate the low voltage in the 12V and should get it towed? Or should I give it another half hour on the jump and drive it there or will I risk the entire thing shutting down on the road? Or can I clear all the errors using leafspy on this almost dead battery and get it to go down the road a few miles?

You need to use an external charger, not a jumpstart - that's dangerous. Overnight on a maintainer, or 2 hours with an actual automotive charger should be enough, unless the battery won't hold a charge any longer.

LeftieBiker said:

You need to use an external charger, not a jumpstart - that's dangerous. Overnight on a maintainer, or 2 hours with an actual automotive charger should be enough, unless the battery won't hold a charge any longer.

Click to expand...

Thanks for the tips. Unfortunately, I don't have a maintainer easily available and want to get this solved by tomorrow. I ended up leaving it on a jump for additional half hour and it appears to be acting normal...but would need to let it sit until tomorrow morning until the auto store opens again.

Update: 12V Battery seemed to be performing fine since last night after the extended jump (30 min total). I put it on my 240V EVSE for about 30 min, then drove it for at least 20 more miles today. Finally, around lunch time took it to AutoZone, where I was ready to buy a new battery, but their tester showed "65%" health, sufficient CCA, and that the battery was still "GOOD". So I drove away without replacing it.

This 2013 MY had been sitting for about 3 days straight without driving anywhere or turning on, with about 68 pct SOC. I do recall I had left this vehicle sitting un-driven or for nearly a month last year, without any startup issue. Should i still replace this battery?

As a side note I nearly got in a heated argument with an idiot AZ employee who refused to test my 12V until he got approval from his manager as he didn't want to "kill himself" testing my vehicle I tried explaining to him this vehicle was off and that this a REGULAR car battery I wanted tested. He pointed to some warning on the testing tool saying DO NOT USE ON HYBRID VEHICLE BATTERY. He angrily then told me to wait. I then complained to the manager and said this guy was being rude and dismissive even though I KNOW they can test it. Very bizarre and uncalled for.

The battery may just need a full charge, so I suggest you get a maintainer like a Battery Tender, and use it at least once a month to fully top off the battery. Sitting unused shouldn't drain the 12 volt battery, but sitting plugged in but not charging for a long time will.

Some mild hybrid systems use a 48 volt accessory battery system, because the low voltage battery actually helps move the car, and has to restart the engine after every stop. Those testers can be used on any 12 volt system.

powersurge said:

jdcbomb said:

Just want to confirm if ya'll think my 12V is finally dead. 6 year old 2013 MY, never replaced the 12V. This morning, vehicle would only make relay clicking sounds, dashboard display does not light up, but interesting to see the headlight indicator turn on, along with the rear side lights.

After reading the thread here, I'm guessing I need to replace it (after jumping it with my 2018 MY). Will I need to clear a bunch of error codes (using LeafSpy) that may show up after battery jumped?

Click to expand...

You don't just "decide" to change the battery. Age has nothing to do with the state of the battery.

All you need is a battery voltage meter. Measure the resting voltage and when you have some load on the battery.

Click to expand...

Really? I'd NEVER keep a battery for 6 years, no need to check it. It's going to continue to cause intermittent issues. I wouldn't continue to drive it, just hoping it's going to heal itself.

Replace the battery. Avoid the inconvenience to you, and the strain on the electronics of your car. $150-180. Done.

FYI, the process couldn't be easier...hold-down clamp, two terminal clamps. 15 minutes.

In some climates, under some conditions, a battery will last 7-10 years. I've gotten 7 occasionally. But yes, replacing a 6 year old battery is advisable, because age, after all, does have something to do with battery life!

Yea I definitely plan to soon. It doesn't seem AS urgent as I previously thought so. Pretty amazing with how long these small 12V can last though. The AutoZone employee that did test it (a her) was also amazed that it lasted that long. She said it made sense that it did given it does get topped off by the panel (SL) and the main battery.