Battery below 80% but not all regen bubbles available?

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EricBayArea

Well-known member
Joined
Aug 10, 2011
Messages
672
Location
Walnut Creek, CA
This morning I was driving to work and as typical I charged to 80% last night and then turned on preheating (while it was plugged into my Blink) 10 minutes before I unplugged and left for the office. It's not uncommon that at 80% or 80%+ (after preheating while plugged) I will see one or maybe two regen bubble unavailable for a short amount of time.

I didn't pay too much attention when I initially left, but about 10 miles into my drive, with 8 battery bars remaining, when heading downhill, I noticed that I had one regen bubble not available. For what it's worth, The first part of my journey is mostly uphill so it eats away at a couple battery bars quickly, but then I reach a nice long downhill and with traffic this morning I was using a lot of regen. Eventually, about 10 miles later (at a total of 20 miles into my drive) that last regen bubble came back.

It was about 48 degrees outside this morning but I still had 5 battery temp bars. The Leaf is garaged so the temperature stays pretty constant.

Any thoughts?
 
I've seen this as well, but it seems the fourth circle showed up when I lightly applied the brake.
 
EricBayArea said:
I didn't pay too much attention when I initially left, but about 10 miles into my drive, with 8 battery bars remaining, when heading downhill, I noticed that I had one regen bubble not available.....
It was about 48 degrees outside this morning but I still had 5 battery temp bars. The Leaf is garaged so the temperature stays pretty constant.
Click to expand...

That 5th battery temp bar unfortunately could be 50F, or 70F. I'll assume closer to the former, therefore, it seems that the battery cell voltages in the 4.00v - 4.05v (80% charge) are still protected from regen at whatever battery temp you happened to have.

I've noticed the same thing with temps now in the 40s in the morning.
 
TonyWilliams said:
That 5th battery temp bar unfortunately could be 50F, or 70F. I'll assume closer to the former, therefore, it seems that the battery cell voltages in the 4.00v - 4.05v (80% charge) are still protected from regen at whatever battery temp you happened to have.

I've noticed the same thing with temps now in the 40s in the morning.
Click to expand...

Yeah, temperature was my guess as well. Just wanted to check with others.

To PhatBoyG, I was applying the brakes (although I don't recall how much pressure I was giving) when I saw 4 regen "points" light up. The 5th was still not activated.
 
EricBayArea said:
This morning I was driving to work and as typical I charged to 80% last night and then turned on preheating (while it was plugged into my Blink) 10 minutes before I unplugged and left for the office. It's not uncommon that at 80% or 80%+ (after preheating while plugged) I will see one or maybe two regen bubble unavailable for a short amount of time.
Click to expand...

Did you compare it to the energy info screen? The bubbles react slowly to changes in energy use so that they aren't bouncing up and down constantly. They show more of a recent average use than instant use. The energy info screen will show you what's happening at any given instant.
 
Since it's my son's car ... I don't drive it too often. But exactly this happened this week ( it may have happened before without him noticing ). The last regen bubble was on/off even after battery being down 5 bars. At one point even the second to last (highest) regen bubble was "off". Monday it happened mid-day (5 temp bars), yesterday (on way to 15k service) it was colder (4 temp bars).

The "missing" regen bubble sometimes came back after coming to a stop, but went away again after accelerating to 30-40mph. Only after (!) arriving the dealer did the final regen bubble "stay" ( down to 4-5 battery bars ).

I will contact Nissan.

( Sorry for the late reply ... I have been trying to catch back up with the forum ... )
 
This is "normal" behavior. The amount of regenerative braking that the car allows depends on multiple factors, most notably SOC, temperature of the battery pack (less regen in colder or very hot temperatures), and recent charge/discharge "stress" on the pack.

Here's an example.
 
abasile said:
This is "normal" behavior. The amount of regenerative braking that the car allows depends on multiple factors, most notably SOC, temperature of the battery pack (less regen in colder or very hot temperatures), and recent charge/discharge "stress" on the pack.

Here's an example.
Click to expand...
Thanks for that. How many (few) battery temp bars have you been seeing ? ( In our NorCal case ... yes it's been just below freezing over-night, but Monday's "random" behaviour was at higher temps. )
 
I'd venture a guess that the battery could benefit from an equalization charge....

If its been a while since you did a 100% charge (couple weeks to a month, with recharges daily), you might try a single 100% charge. The first discharge cycle after that wont tell you much, but after the next 80% charge, I'd expect you'd see more normal behavior.
 
I have also just started noticing this same behavior. The sporadic last regen bubble. I have watched it in tandem with the energy screen and when there is no last regen bubble, you will only get 20kW regen power. And yes when I slow down to a point while "brake feathering" the last bubble show up but then will disappear again once your speed picks up. I am supposed to get some TCU update or something because my Carwings shows no history since Oct. Not sure about this TCU update but maybe this bubble phenomenon will be included somehow in this new update. Only 4300 mi. on mine so I was just going to wait until the 7500 point to bring it in.

Anyone get a TCU update?
 
brettcgb said:
I'd venture a guess that the battery could benefit from an equalization charge....

If its been a while since you did a 100% charge (couple weeks to a month, with recharges daily), you might try a single 100% charge. The first discharge cycle after that wont tell you much, but after the next 80% charge, I'd expect you'd see more normal behavior.
Click to expand...
I see the same bubble behavior and I charge to 100% 5 days per week.
 
When the climate control timer or remote app are used it is possible that the battery will charge while the climate control is functioning. While connected to level 2 charging 3.3kW is available; if less than 3.3kW is used by the climate control the excess will be used to charge the Li-Ion battery. Although 10 bars are displayed the actual state of charge covers a range and may be on the high side of that range after pre-conditioning the car.

This always happens to me during the summer in Phoenix, where the A/C must run for an extended period for pre-conditioning. I usually end up with 11 bars when my timer is set for 80%.

I hope this is helpful.
 
EricBayArea said:
This morning I was driving to work and as typical I charged to 80% last night and then turned on preheating (while it was plugged into my Blink) 10 minutes before I unplugged and left for the office. It's not uncommon that at 80% or 80%+ (after preheating while plugged) I will see one or maybe two regen bubble unavailable for a short amount of time.

I didn't pay too much attention when I initially left, but about 10 miles into my drive, with 8 battery bars remaining, when heading downhill, I noticed that I had one regen bubble not available. For what it's worth, The first part of my journey is mostly uphill so it eats away at a couple battery bars quickly, but then I reach a nice long downhill and with traffic this morning I was using a lot of regen. Eventually, about 10 miles later (at a total of 20 miles into my drive) that last regen bubble came back.

It was about 48 degrees outside this morning but I still had 5 battery temp bars. The Leaf is garaged so the temperature stays pretty constant.

Any thoughts?
Click to expand...
Now that I've been looking for (and seeing) this, I've got a different theory.

The presence or absence of of regen bubbles seems to be related to battery state of charge (SOC>80%) where the battery charge current is limited, and vehicle speed which determines how much regen power (current) is available.

I believe that the vehicle speed is actively being considered. It has been decided that the available regen current (due to vehicle speed) is too high to return all of it to the battery. When this occurs, regen current is limited (brakes are used to slow the vehicle), and a regen bubble is turned off to indicate the situation.

As the vehicle slows, the available regen current falls below the maximum allowed charging current for the batteries SOC, and the bubble returns. All regen current is then used to charge the battery.
 
You could be right about that. I charged to 80% last night, as I almost always do. My car lives outside, and it has finally started raining, breaking the month-long cold snap, so I saw 5 battery temp bars this morning (for the first time in weeks). I was a mile from home and going about 35 mph, slowing to turn. I glanced down and saw I had a missing regen bubble. It was back the next time I looked, after turning.

Ray
 
brettcgb said:
I believe that the vehicle speed is actively being considered. It has been decided that the available regen current (due to vehicle speed) is too high to return all of it to the battery. When this occurs, regen current is limited (brakes are used to slow the vehicle), and a regen bubble is turned off to indicate the situation.....
Click to expand...
I just saw this thread but posted something similar on another. Here's an example from my high school physics: KE=1/2 * M * V^2 and for a 1620 kg car+driver going about 60 mph, I calculate 585 KJ. If stopped in 10 sec, that's 58.5 KW of regen (assuming 100% efficiency), more than the car can accept.

Reddy
 
Reddy said:
brettcgb said:
I believe that the vehicle speed is actively being considered. It has been decided that the available regen current (due to vehicle speed) is too high to return all of it to the battery. When this occurs, regen current is limited (brakes are used to slow the vehicle), and a regen bubble is turned off to indicate the situation.....
Click to expand...
I just saw this thread but posted something similar on another. Here's an example from my high school physics: KE=1/2 * M * V^2 and for a 1620 kg car+driver going about 60 mph, I calculate 585 KJ. If stopped in 10 sec, that's 58.5 KW of regen (assuming 100% efficiency), more than the car can accept.

Reddy
Click to expand...
Please don't confuse the matter with math... ;)

Seriously, its all good.
 

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