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TomT
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Joined: Sun Aug 08, 2010 12:09 pm
Delivery Date: 01 Mar 2011
Leaf Number: 000360
Location: Foothills of Granada Hills, CA
Contact: Website

Re: 6600+ ft. of climbing / LEAF in the San Bernardino Mount

Sun Sep 22, 2013 9:25 am

I think those with 2013s that have had a plethora of problems might dispute that... :lol:

abasile wrote:I think the 2011 LEAF is quite well designed for a first-generation car, and the LEAF is getting better with each model year.
59,991 miles/12 bars/289 Gids/68.54 AHr/101% SOH/101.64% Hx 7May15 w/ new Lizard (barely made the warranty).
71,770 miles/12 bars/256 Gids/59.04 AHr/88% SOH/87.92% Hx 3Mar16 at lease return.

Now driving a 2016 Volt Premier. Model 3 reserved.

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abasile
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Delivery Date: 20 Apr 2011
Location: Arrowbear Lake, CA

Re: 6600+ ft. of climbing / LEAF in the San Bernardino Mount

Sun Sep 22, 2013 11:51 am

KJD wrote:If you can, please submit your stats to Stoaty for the battery aging model. The more data samples the better.

viewtopic.php?f=27&t=14275

I should order a cable/adaptor so that I can use the Battery App before losing the top capacity bar, and give Stoaty the data he's requesting. (I confess that I've been content with my trusty GID meter assembled by Gary G. and haven't been sufficiently motivated to acquire my own Android device or cable, but I intend to.)

TomT wrote:
abasile wrote:I think the 2011 LEAF is quite well designed for a first-generation car, and the LEAF is getting better with each model year.

I think those with 2013s that have had a plethora of problems might dispute that... :lol:

You have a point there. Hopefully they'll get those glitches, which appear to be related to moving production to Tennessee, sorted out very soon. However, the 2013 LEAF is definitely improved in that it offers 'B' mode regen and 6 kW charging, features that would be of use to me.
2011 LEAF at 71K miles, pre-owned 2012 Tesla S 85 at 98K miles
LEAF battery: 9/12 bars and < 49 Ah (-28% vs. new)
Tesla battery: 250+ miles of range (-5% vs. new)

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abasile
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Re: 6600+ ft. of climbing / LEAF in the San Bernardino Mount

Tue Apr 29, 2014 4:25 pm

In general, I have not been fastidious about data collection like some folks here. However, it's probably worth a quick update to share where our LEAF's battery capacity stands after three years and 47K miles of driving, the majority in SoCal's San Bernardino Mountains.

When we first picked up our LEAF from Fontana Nissan in 2011, with a full charge, we had to take the longer route home via CA-18 because CA-330 was closed at the time. The drive was at least seven miles longer the way we took, with more elevation changes. We arrived home with "three bars" of charge, which went up to "four bars" after 1.5 hours of trickle charging.

Last night we also left Fontana Nissan with a full charge from their AV L2 charging docks and six battery temperature bars. In fairness, the battery pack was probably a bit out of balance, as our GID meter reported "77.2%" when the charge stopped. We took the most direct route home, using the 210 freeway and CA-330, 31.6 miles in total. We kept our freeway speed to 55 mph and ascended the mountain at about 35 mph (with a few turnouts to let other vehicles pass). We reached home with "14.5%" indicated on the GID meter, which immediately dropped to "13.8%" when we plugged the car in. This was probably slightly lower because of intermittent cross-winds on the drive, but not very different from other, recent drives home after charging at Fontana Nissan.

The bottom line is that if we were to replicate the original, longer drive home done on 4/20/2011, we'd be risking running out of charge. That's a far cry from making it home with "3 bars" of charge, somewhere above "30%" in GIDs. If anything, I suspect our current capacity loss (judging by GIDs at "80%" charge) is somewhat understated.

It's also worth mentioning that I commuted to an employer down in Redlands for nearly two years using the LEAF (well, mostly, as I often biked part of the commute). The battery pack's average temperature was certainly warmer than if all of those miles had been at elevation.
2011 LEAF at 71K miles, pre-owned 2012 Tesla S 85 at 98K miles
LEAF battery: 9/12 bars and < 49 Ah (-28% vs. new)
Tesla battery: 250+ miles of range (-5% vs. new)

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abasile
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Re: 6600+ ft. of climbing / LEAF in the San Bernardino Mount

Sat May 24, 2014 8:10 pm

Just found out today that our LEAF is not the only one in the San Bernardino Mountains! We were in Big Bear today and ended up chatting with another LEAF owner who lives there. He's been living up here for less than a year and just uses the LEAF to drive around the Big Bear area, never down the mountain like we do. He says he knows of one other LEAF owner in Big Bear.

In terms of battery degradation, this is the best area in Southern California for the LEAF. For the last few months since I stopped commuting down the mountain daily, our LEAF's battery capacity has dropped only slightly - we're definitely noticing the difference. It's almost as if it's in a state of arrested decay.
2011 LEAF at 71K miles, pre-owned 2012 Tesla S 85 at 98K miles
LEAF battery: 9/12 bars and < 49 Ah (-28% vs. new)
Tesla battery: 250+ miles of range (-5% vs. new)

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abasile
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Re: 6600+ ft. of climbing / LEAF in the San Bernardino Mount

Tue May 27, 2014 6:13 pm

In recent days, we used the LEAF and our hiking shoes for a trip to Fisherman's Camp, a backcountry spot along Deep Creek. The water level was lower this year, but still high enough for some cold swimming.
Image

The roundtrip involved eight miles of careful driving on Forest Service dirt roads, including a heavily-used crossing of Crab Creek. Of course, the LEAF came home quite dusty.
Image

Unfortunately, the "splash shield" under the LEAF bit the dust. Over the past three years it's been scraped and torn on occasion. While it didn't come into contact with any rocks on this drive, the force of the water in the stream crossings greatly worsened the existing tears.
Image

At the moment it's sort of bungee corded together. The dealer quoted me $258 parts/labor for a new one when I went in for the annual battery check today (all 5 stars...). Truth be told, I'm not about to stop using the LEAF on our local dirt roads, and I'd prefer something more durable from the aftermarket if possible. I have some research to do.
2011 LEAF at 71K miles, pre-owned 2012 Tesla S 85 at 98K miles
LEAF battery: 9/12 bars and < 49 Ah (-28% vs. new)
Tesla battery: 250+ miles of range (-5% vs. new)

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drees
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Re: 6600+ ft. of climbing / LEAF in the San Bernardino Mount

Wed May 28, 2014 1:58 am

abasile wrote:At the moment it's sort of bungee corded together. The dealer quoted me $258 parts/labor for a new one when I went in for the annual battery check today (all 5 stars...). Truth be told, I'm not about to stop using the LEAF on our local dirt roads, and I'd prefer something more durable from the aftermarket if possible. I have some research to do.

Look at rally-style skidplates. You'll need to fab your own from 1/16-3/16" aluminum plate. Cost for raw material will be anywhere from free to $200 or so. Then you'll have to trim the plate to fit and bend to approximate the stock underpanel shape. Will be challenging to punch out the vents that the stock underpanel has.

Expect some increase in noise over stock.

Tony's thread here has good pics: Underneath the Beast; a Tour of the Dark Side
'11 LEAF SL Powered By 3.24 kW Enphase Solar PV

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abasile
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Re: 6600+ ft. of climbing / LEAF in the San Bernardino Mount

Wed May 28, 2014 6:46 am

drees wrote:Look at rally-style skidplates. You'll need to fab your own from 1/16-3/16" aluminum plate. Cost for raw material will be anywhere from free to $200 or so. Then you'll have to trim the plate to fit and bend to approximate the stock underpanel shape. Will be challenging to punch out the vents that the stock underpanel has.

Thanks for the pointers. This would probably be more work than I'm prepared for, but on the other hand, with an additional bungee cord in place the LEAF should be fine until winter provided we drive carefully and avoid Crab Creek. ;-) (Some of the prior damage to the underbody cover came from driving over hard ice.) If I don't get an alternative worked out by October or November, I can always go with another stock underbody panel.

drees wrote:Tony's thread here has good pics: Underneath the Beast; a Tour of the Dark Side

That's a great link! I'd forgotten that thread was so detailed.
2011 LEAF at 71K miles, pre-owned 2012 Tesla S 85 at 98K miles
LEAF battery: 9/12 bars and < 49 Ah (-28% vs. new)
Tesla battery: 250+ miles of range (-5% vs. new)

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abasile
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Re: 6600+ ft. of climbing / LEAF in the San Bernardino Mount

Mon Sep 01, 2014 7:27 am

Over the weekend I received a PM from someone near west LA inquiring about the feasibility of using a LEAF to drive to Big Bear regularly, with a "quick charge" stop in the San Bernardino area. Most of my response is copied (and genericized) below for others who might be interested.

First, the quick chargers at the San Bernardino and Redlands Nissan dealers have been down as far as I'm aware. Even if they are back up, those dealers are not generally good about maintaining them. Thankfully, there is a Blink quick charger at a 7/Eleven store just off the 10 freeway in San Bernardino, and Fontana Nissan also has a quick charger. For an extra $5, you might prefer Fontana Nissan over hanging out at a 7/Eleven (the immediate area is okay, but 7/Eleven draws iffy characters at times). Fontana is further from the base of the mountain, but due to its higher elevation (above 1500' feet) it doesn't take a huge amount of charge to drive to the base of CA-330 from there.

There are some real challenges you should keep in mind. One word of caution about CHAdeMO quick chargers in general is that they are single units, not like Tesla Superchargers where there are a number of units at each location. So if a given quick charger is down, you want to have a backup plan. Also, to charge to 80% typically takes more like 30 minutes, not 20 minutes. For the climb to Big Bear, you'd probably want closer to a full charge which could take closer to an hour. Keep in mind this is with a new LEAF. After some normal battery capacity loss, you might need to stop along the way for more charge. My PlugShare-listed EVSE in Arrowbear is currently the only option (you're more than welcome, but others in the car might not be too happy having to stop). In addition, depending on starting point, you might have to be careful to conserve charge on the long drive to the base of the mountain, given the distance and elevation gain.

In summary, driving from the LA area to Big Bear Lake is doable in a LEAF with some dedication and extra time, but it might not be something you'd want to do very often. Of course, the Tesla Model S (or upcoming Model X) could do it with great ease. The soon to be discontinued Rav4 EV might be able to make it up on a single "range" charge with some caution. With a break for a nice dinner along the way at a charging location, it might be quite easy in a Rav4 EV even without fast charging. The downside is that this vehicle is a Toyota compliance car and you would be supporting a company that is not apparently interested in building EVs right now.

If you have another car that could be used for the drive up the mountain, then I would recommend acquiring a LEAF for reasonable daily use. While you could try using the LEAF for accessing the mountains, it would be best if you aren't left "stuck" having to travel this way. For our family's trips down to the Los Angeles area, we prefer to use our LEAF when we can, but it is good to know that we can fall back on a gasoline car (Prius) when we don't have the extra time or inclination to take the LEAF. (Yes, the Prius is a Toyota, but it was purchased several years ago.)
2011 LEAF at 71K miles, pre-owned 2012 Tesla S 85 at 98K miles
LEAF battery: 9/12 bars and < 49 Ah (-28% vs. new)
Tesla battery: 250+ miles of range (-5% vs. new)

LeafMuranoDriver
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Delivery Date: 01 May 2015
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Re: 6600+ ft. of climbing / LEAF in the San Bernardino Mount

Thu May 21, 2015 8:52 am

abasile and others... Thanks so much for all of this detailed info. I'm thinking about driving my new Leaf from Simi Valley to Lake Arrowhead.

I could leave with 90%+ to go to a QC about 60 miles away... http://api.plugshare.com/view/location/13998 (free w/ No Charge to Charge)

Then was thinking about using the QC at 7-11 in San Bernadino before going up the mountain... http://api.plugshare.com/view/location/3153 (looks to be functioning from Plugshare comments)

Thoughts?
2015 Leaf S w/ QC
Mfg: Jan. '15 // Pur: May '15
Best: 6/27/15 - 1,416 Miles - 292 GIDs - 63.11 Ahr - 22.6 kWh - 100% SOH - 97.2% Hx - 4 QC, 29 L2
Worst: 12/12/15 - 4,616 Miles - 259 GIDs - 55.02 Ahr - 20.1 kWh - 99% SOH - 82.8% Hx - 17 QC, 96 L2

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abasile
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Re: 6600+ ft. of climbing / LEAF in the San Bernardino Mount

Thu May 21, 2015 9:13 am

LeafMuranoDriver wrote:Then was thinking about using the QC at 7-11 in San Bernadino before going up the mountain... http://api.plugshare.com/view/location/3153 (looks to be functioning from Plugshare comments)

This should be comparatively easy in a 2015 LEAF, given the relatively new battery.

Try to get a 90% charge in San Bernardino (that's generally the most the 7/Eleven Blink will give you) even if you have to wait longer. You can never have "too much" charge before coming up here.

Do you have a place to charge in the Lake Arrowhead area? You probably won't need it unless you want to drive around while you're up here, though. You're welcome to charge at my place if you decide to head toward Big Bear. If you need to conserve your charge, then slow down and use turnouts where appropriate to let others pass. Going more slowly on downhill sections will give you more regenerative braking.

Enjoy the trip, and take advantage of the "free" charging! (For us, those quick chargers are as expensive as driving a gas guzzler, though we still use them from time to time.)
2011 LEAF at 71K miles, pre-owned 2012 Tesla S 85 at 98K miles
LEAF battery: 9/12 bars and < 49 Ah (-28% vs. new)
Tesla battery: 250+ miles of range (-5% vs. new)

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