Randy3
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Location: Fresno, CA

Re: Why not just display estimated number of kWh left?

Sun Dec 09, 2012 12:14 pm

As to displaying the number of kWh left, I'm all for it. It's similar to displaying the number of gallons left in an ICE instead of displaying the "range" (like what many ICE cars have). BTW, in my experience the "range" display in my 2011 Honda Insight isn't all that accurate either.

I've learned certain driving behaviors that will increase my miles/kWh. If the display included the number of kWh left, it may be a better reminder to adjust my driving behavior as needed, when needed.

Nissan just had a tech look over my LEAF for possible battery capacity loss issues. They provided their "report" to me. I thought the report would include a statement of battery capacity (like, 21 kWh at 100% capacity). But no, their report doesn't even indicate that they checked this. I suspect that Nissan doesn't want LEAF owners to know (or, to easily determine) their car battery's capacity.

But when the LEAF becomes more prevalent at used car outlets, wise LEAF shoppers will need to have a way to verify battery condition, including capacity. It appears that even brand new LEAF's have a wide variance in battery capacity. Right now, it looks like the GID meter is the only tool we have to take this measurement.

I'd like to have see a sticker on each new BEV that states the total battery kWh when the car left the factory.
Randy
Fresno, CA
2012 Mitsubishi i-MiEV

jlsoaz
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Re: Why not just display estimated number of kWh left?

Sun Dec 09, 2012 2:08 pm

Randy3 wrote:...
I've learned certain driving behaviors that will increase my miles/kWh. If the display included the number of kWh left, it may be a better reminder to adjust my driving behavior as needed, when needed.


Yes, this is first thought I had on this... where I am coming from initially. Not at all trying to "get" Nissan or cause trouble for them, but rather trying to make a suggestion on vehicle improvement... just trying to figure out how much energy I have left and keep an eye on it... a cousin of the gauge that I can display as to miles/kWh at any given moment.

Does anyone know if Teslas or Volts or iMiEVs or CODAs display the estimated kWh remaining to drive on?

Randy3 wrote:[...]
It appears that even brand new LEAF's have a wide variance in battery capacity. Right now, it looks like the GID meter is the only tool we have to take this measurement.
...


I didn't realize this variance could apply to new Leafs. I guess unfortunately I can see how this might make Nissan hesitate to display it. Still, ... I don't know that my/our suggestions are good ones in this area, but I request that they be given consideration.

Another business-minded way for Nissan to look at this is that if entire cottage industries inevitably spring up around certain early-adopter questions/suggestions on new products (EVSE upgrade to the charge cords, GID meters to gauge energy use, etc.) then this springing-up can be used by the manufacturer as a way to keep a short-list of potential improvement areas.
Former lessee 2012 SL
http://www.pluginamerica.org/surveys/batteries/leaf/vehicle.php?vid=229
2017-October: bght 2013 Volt
will buy 150+ mile BEV when they become less expensive on used market
josh@jlaz.com
opinions expressed are my own

KJD
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Re: Why not just display estimated number of kWh left?

Sun Dec 09, 2012 2:42 pm

jlsoaz wrote:Another business-minded way for Nissan to look at this is that if entire cottage industries inevitably spring up around certain early-adopter questions/suggestions on new products (EVSE upgrade to the charge cords, GID meters to gauge energy use, etc.) then this springing-up can be used by the manufacturer as a way to keep a short-list of potential improvement areas.

To a certain extent Nissan is already doing this. See the new State Of Charge display in the 2013.
http://insideevs.com/nissan-officially- ... tionality/
I have a GID meter in my 2012 and I find the SOC display to be the most useful of all the features. You may want to purchase one for your own car.
2012 SL Delivered 12/08/2011
Sold 05/12/2015
2012 Tesla Model S 85

SeattleBlue
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Re: Why not just display estimated number of kWh left?

Sun Dec 09, 2012 4:14 pm

ebill3 wrote:Percent of charge remaining will be nice, but I doubt that remaining kWhs would me meaningful to most folks. For techies? OK.

Bill


Agree!

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TomT
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Re: Why not just display estimated number of kWh left?

Sun Dec 09, 2012 4:23 pm

The problem is that the meter in the 2013s appears to show the SOC as a percent of the relative battery capacity. Thus, at different temperatures and as the battery ages, the absolute amount that each percent and the meter total represents will be a constantly moving target due to changing battery capacity... An absolute number is far more helpful but this relative SOC is certainly better than what people without a Gid meter currently have...

KJD wrote:http://insideevs.com/nissan-officially-announces-2013-leaf-in-japan-more-range-less-money-new-functionality/
I have a GID meter in my 2012 and I find the SOC display to be the most useful of all the features. You may want to purchase one for your own car.
59,991 miles/12 bars/289 Gids/68.54 AHr/101% SOH/101.64% Hx 7May15 w/ new Lizard (barely made the warranty).
71,770 miles/12 bars/256 Gids/59.04 AHr/88% SOH/87.92% Hx 3Mar16 at lease return.

Now driving a 2016 Volt Premier.

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garygid
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Re: Why not just display estimated number of kWh left?

Mon Dec 10, 2012 8:12 am

The description is probably incorrectly translated:
"Remaining battery capacity shown by percentage in the Multifunction Display".

So, it is unlikely that it is displaying the battery capacity.
At this point, we do not know what value is being displayed.

I suspect that it is unlikely to be percent GIDs.
However, it is also unlikely to stop at 95% when the battery is full.
See SOC/GID-Meter and CAN-Do Info
2011 LEAF, sold in 2015
2010 Prius, 2014 silver Tesla S
Nissan EVSE, mod to 240/120v 16A
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philipscoggins
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Re: Why not just display estimated number of kWh left?

Mon Dec 10, 2012 8:34 am

I'd like to have kw/h remaining too.

Philip
2012 Black SL, 104,100, 4y 3m, 175 gids ~ 33% capacity loss - Lost 1st bar @ 44,800 miles & 20 months of driving - 2nd @ 62,000 miles 2y6m - 3rd @ 80,000 3y6m - 4th @ 104,074 4y3m. Member of the 100 mile & 200km club

IBELEAF
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Re: Why not just display estimated number of kWh left?

Mon Dec 10, 2012 11:38 am

Volt shows how many kWh used number, but personally just looking at the bars has been always enough information for me. Perhaps percentage would be better like a on a cellphone.
Currently: '12 Volt (12k) since 7/2012
Previously: '11 Leaf SL (w/ 12k miles & 16 month ownership)

LEAFfan
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Re: Why not just display estimated number of kWh left?

Mon Dec 10, 2012 12:01 pm

KJD wrote:
jlsoaz wrote:Another business-minded way for Nissan to look at this is that if entire cottage industries inevitably spring up around certain early-adopter questions/suggestions on new products (EVSE upgrade to the charge cords, GID meters to gauge energy use, etc.) then this springing-up can be used by the manufacturer as a way to keep a short-list of potential improvement areas.

To a certain extent Nissan is already doing this. See the new State Of Charge display in the 2013.
http://insideevs.com/nissan-officially- ... tionality/
I have a GID meter in my 2012 and I find the SOC display to be the most useful of all the features.
You may want to purchase one for your own car.


The 2013 SoC % is going to show the actual % for the fuel bars, which are now not showing the actual %, but a vague % on CW.
2013 LEAF SV Del. 2/28/13
2013 LEAF World Record for Most Miles Driven On One Charge-188 miles/8.8 m/kW h
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drees
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Re: Why not just display estimated number of kWh left?

Mon Dec 10, 2012 12:30 pm

Personally, I like the the Tesla method of showing "ideal" miles remaining as long as you know how many mi/kWh is needed to get those ideal miles. Also having kWh remaining would be useful.

At this point - I'd take anything over the GOM and 12 SOC bars which vary significantly in available capacity (never mind the hidden ones).
'11 LEAF SL Powered By 3.24 kW Enphase Solar PV

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