LeftieBiker
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Location: Upstate New York, US

Re: Have B Mode as Deflaut Drive Mode

Wed Dec 20, 2017 5:22 pm

I have about a 20 mile commute and there have been times where I actually have had the battery percentage be higher than when I left by using the B mode. Only by a percentage point or two, but still higher and yes I know that isn't always the normal, but it is a good example of why it would be nice to be able to set B mode as the default drive mode.


This can only be true if you are driving downhill. It is literally against the laws of physics for it to be true in any other case - except for maybe being pushed by traffic behind you... ;-)
Scarlet Ember 2018 Leaf SL W/ Pro Pilot
2009 Vectrix VX-1 W/18 Leaf modules, & 3 EZIP E-bicycles.
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nerys
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Leaf Number: 020441

Re: Have B Mode as Deflaut Drive Mode

Wed Dec 20, 2017 5:37 pm

You say it is impossible and then you explain why it's possible that's just silly many of us have a commute where one way is more downhill than the other where this is quite plausible

Although I think it's just higher efficiency not extra power and the gom is just confused

I want B mode for the higher regen

No other reason it's silly not to use higher Regen to save my brakes when I have it available it's also annoying that my 2016 is slower than my 2012 I always have to shift it 3 times to get it into B mode or I have to shift once wait a five-count and then shift again into B mode

Very annoying it's a minor thing but very annoying I wish the damn thing would just default to B mode
2012 SV 4802miles. 1month 2400 miles. 9 weeks 5000 miles. 6 months 13,300 miles. 4/18 15,000 miles.

LeftieBiker
Posts: 8655
Joined: Wed May 22, 2013 3:17 am
Delivery Date: 31 May 2013
Location: Upstate New York, US

Re: Have B Mode as Deflaut Drive Mode

Wed Dec 20, 2017 6:04 pm

You say it is impossible and then you explain why it's possible that's just silly many of us have a commute where one way is more downhill than the other where this is quite plausible


No, I wrote that it's only possible in one kind of driving. When you are driving downhill to work and getting a net gain in charge, then it's gravity helping you out, not B mode. The above is sort of like claiming that blasting the stereo increases range, but forgetting to mention that you are driving downhill when you do it.
Scarlet Ember 2018 Leaf SL W/ Pro Pilot
2009 Vectrix VX-1 W/18 Leaf modules, & 3 EZIP E-bicycles.
PLEASE don't PM me with Leaf questions. Just post in the topic that seems most appropriate.

nerys
Posts: 695
Joined: Tue Sep 09, 2014 10:11 pm
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Re: Have B Mode as Deflaut Drive Mode

Wed Dec 20, 2017 6:07 pm

No it's B mode not gravity gravity just accelerates the car and you have two ways of dealing with that increase region to slow down and convert that into power or use the brakes and convert it into heat

B mode does that not gravity gravity's just the way it works but gravity alone does nothing
2012 SV 4802miles. 1month 2400 miles. 9 weeks 5000 miles. 6 months 13,300 miles. 4/18 15,000 miles.

LeftieBiker
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Joined: Wed May 22, 2013 3:17 am
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Location: Upstate New York, US

Re: Have B Mode as Deflaut Drive Mode

Wed Dec 20, 2017 9:04 pm

Just keep telling yourself that. I won't try to argue anymore.
Scarlet Ember 2018 Leaf SL W/ Pro Pilot
2009 Vectrix VX-1 W/18 Leaf modules, & 3 EZIP E-bicycles.
PLEASE don't PM me with Leaf questions. Just post in the topic that seems most appropriate.

nerys
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Re: Have B Mode as Deflaut Drive Mode

Wed Dec 20, 2017 9:45 pm

You can ignore it if you want but physics is physics you can recover some of your acceleration energy in regeneration or you can burn it away in your brakes as waste Heat and wear out your brakes faster too

B mode permits a higher level of regeneration which allows you to use the brakes less as the Regeneration slows you down more.

Why in the world would you argue with me about that? What am I missing here?
2012 SV 4802miles. 1month 2400 miles. 9 weeks 5000 miles. 6 months 13,300 miles. 4/18 15,000 miles.

NeilBlanchard
Posts: 617
Joined: Sat Oct 11, 2014 5:02 pm
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Leaf Number: 306278

Re: Have B Mode as Deflaut Drive Mode

Thu Dec 21, 2017 12:40 pm

cmwade77 wrote:
NeilBlanchard wrote:I am a practiced ecodriver, and I know that coasting is better than always having regen. Regen is fine - when you need to slow down. Regen is much better than friction brakes, obviously.

But when the default is coasting, you learn to accelerate less and then coast and then use some regen to slow to a stop.

Yes, if you are in areas where this works, but if you live in areas with stop and go traffic, you have to come to a stop virtually every time you slow down anyway, so coasting does no good in that circumstance, as you still would not have momentum to get going again.


I have been ecodriving for at least 10 years, and I can assure you that coasting is better - in particular - in stop and go conditions. You accelerate LESS (that you would otherwise) and then you coast. It becomes a challenge to never stop, or use the brakes. And if you look at what we have learned from traffic studies, this kind of driving actually reduces traffic.

Jackrabbit starts and abrupt stops make traffic worse, and they use a lot of energy.

Regen can NEVER regain everything you invest in getting the car moving, and so when you keep rolling, even just barely, you save energy.

NeilBlanchard
Posts: 617
Joined: Sat Oct 11, 2014 5:02 pm
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Re: Have B Mode as Deflaut Drive Mode

Thu Dec 21, 2017 12:48 pm

nerys wrote:You can ignore it if you want but physics is physics you can recover some of your acceleration energy in regeneration or you can burn it away in your brakes as waste Heat and wear out your brakes faster too

B mode permits a higher level of regeneration which allows you to use the brakes less as the Regeneration slows you down more.

Why in the world would you argue with me about that? What am I missing here?


The brake pedal has regen integrated, so B mode has no advantage. Light braking is all regen, and since you can modulate it, it is arguably better than B.

nerys
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Re: Have B Mode as Deflaut Drive Mode

Thu Dec 21, 2017 12:54 pm

Your data is illogically applied.

Regen will always recover some of the energy use to accelerate. That is its explicitly designed function and you can clearly abd umbigiously see it on your information display.

I have been eco driving for well over 20 years well over 50,000 miles a year. Before my leaf indrove and still have my 94 xfi that i net 62mpg from yearly average and i have sustained 70mpg for over 400 miles.

Stock.

We are not talking about coasting. We are talking about braking. So the superior efficiency of coasting is completely irrelevant to this discussion at least my part of it.

Between braking and regen only regen is superior. Its more efficient both in energy and maintenance.

If i must brake i want as much of that braking going into regeneration versus brake rotors and pads as waste heat.

That simple. Coasting is not a good option for me as a delivery driver. I habe to brake. So I want regen instead of wasted heat in my brakes.
2012 SV 4802miles. 1month 2400 miles. 9 weeks 5000 miles. 6 months 13,300 miles. 4/18 15,000 miles.

nerys
Posts: 695
Joined: Tue Sep 09, 2014 10:11 pm
Delivery Date: 09 Sep 2014
Leaf Number: 020441

Re: Have B Mode as Deflaut Drive Mode

Thu Dec 21, 2017 1:00 pm

I disagree. When i lightly brake in D versus B there is a significant difference in regen. Its like there is a software cap on regen amount in D mode that is particularly nasty when cold. Almost no regen at all.

On top of this in D mode i cant feather the speed controller since i have to move my foot to the brake pedal.

In b mode i keep my foot on the acceleration pedal and feather it to control the amount of regen versus coast down for each individual stopping scenario.

I can not do this in d mode since i have to move my foot to the brake pedal.
2012 SV 4802miles. 1month 2400 miles. 9 weeks 5000 miles. 6 months 13,300 miles. 4/18 15,000 miles.

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