Option for User-Programmable Eco/Drive Sensitivity

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MarkBC

Well-known member
Joined
Dec 18, 2011
Messages
54
I don't know about everyone else but I find the "automatic transmission"-like pull on the wheels while stopped to be a little bit irritating because I like to take my foot off the brake at a light, plus I am sure this is wasting energy because you can feel it pulling on the brakes. Also, when in stop-and-go traffic this motor pull forces you to constantly go between the brake and gas pedal which is a pain.

If Nissan did this as a safety feature to force you to keep your foot on the brake when stopped to prevent the car from rolling, well it might have the opposite effect because I just stick the car in neutral in that case, in which case I won't be able to go forward in a flash in an emergency situation without first putting it into gear.

I propose that Nissan allow for user-programmable sensitivity settings for both Eco and Drive modes. This could even be done through a firmware update I presume. That way, if you like the motor pull you can keep it. Otherwise, for people like me, you can change it.

For example, I like having lots of regen braking on the car when I take my foot off the pedal, more than what we currently get with Eco. I would like to be able to program this into the Drive mode, because I like also having lots of kick when I touch the gas pedal. I believe this is how the Tesla Roadster is programmed. This would mean that I could do a lot of driving without having to touch the brakes. Just a more pleasurable driving experience, although this car already is already a pleasure to drive ... but it could be even better.
 
But that's what I want to avoid, it's a pain to always have to reach down there and change it. PLUS, there is a few second delay you have to hold the shifter to the left in order to enter neutral mode.
 
MarkBC said:
I don't know about everyone else but I find the "automatic transmission"-like pull on the wheels while stopped to be a little bit irritating because I like to take my foot off the brake at a light, plus I am sure this is wasting energy because you can feel it pulling on the brakes. Also, when in stop-and-go traffic this motor pull forces you to constantly go between the brake and gas pedal which is a pain.

If Nissan did this as a safety feature to force you to keep your foot on the brake when stopped to prevent the car from rolling, well it might have the opposite effect because I just stick the car in neutral in that case, in which case I won't be able to go forward in a flash in an emergency situation without first putting it into gear.

I propose that Nissan allow for user-programmable sensitivity settings for both Eco and Drive modes. This could even be done through a firmware update I presume. That way, if you like the motor pull you can keep it. Otherwise, for people like me, you can change it.

For example, I like having lots of regen braking on the car when I take my foot off the pedal, more than what we currently get with Eco. I would like to be able to program this into the Drive mode, because I like also having lots of kick when I touch the gas pedal. I believe this is how the Tesla Roadster is programmed. This would mean that I could do a lot of driving without having to touch the brakes. Just a more pleasurable driving experience, although this car already is already a pleasure to drive ... but it could be even better.
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While I don't know if this is the case with the Leaf, my experience driving a Think Citibee ~15 years ago made it clear that it was difficult/dangerous to try to parallel park it, owing to the lack of sufficient power in 'idle', and the high 'break-over' of the accelerator pedal. A high 'idle' setting allows you to park on flat ground without having to switch between the accelerator and brake. In the Citibee, when you pushed the throttle you got nothing . . nothing . . nothing . . not enough power to move the car . . too much power. Combine this inability to feather the throttle with the lack of power steering (so you had to be moving to turn the wheels), and the Citibee was unquestionably the hardest car to parallel park in a tight space I've ever driven (I learned to drive and park in a '65 Impala with a manual transmission and no power accessories of any kind, and that was a piece of cake by comparison). The not enough/too much power made it far too likely that you'd knock bumpers with the car behind or in front of you.

The Leaf and every current EV I've driven has far better accelerator control than the Citibee and power steering, but they also have high 'idle' power at rest, so parallel parking should be easy. I suspect you may just have to live with putting the car in neutral to limit the energy use, although it might be possible for Nissan to put a power kill on the brake pedal beyond a certain pressure.
 
Just push the Park button on top of the gear shifter. Everything stays on and you can take your foot off of the brake pedal. One quick slap of the shifter and you are off.
 
Then I can't coast in stop & go traffic, plus I have to reach down when the light turns green and shift. What I want is the minimal amount of shifting.
 
adric22 said:
You could always put the car in neutral if you knew you were going to be sitting at a light for a while.
Click to expand...

you can go instantly to neutral by faux shifting into reverse while moving. it defaults straight to N.
 
MarkBC said:
I don't know about everyone else but I find the "automatic transmission"-like pull on the wheels while stopped to be a little bit irritating because I like to take my foot off the brake at a light, plus I am sure this is wasting energy because you can feel it pulling on the brakes.
Click to expand...
You want the car free to roll when sitting at a light?? That's insane. If you are at the front of the line and get tapped from the rear, a car is going to smash into your left side, trapping you in the driver's seat if you are even still alive. If you are not at the front of the line and someone hits you from behind, you just became the leaf filling in a sandwich, with a bad case of double whiplash for dressing.

As for wasting energy; no, it takes no energy when you are stopped, because the inverter knows you have the brakes on.

Ray
 
planet4ever said:
MarkBC said:
I don't know about everyone else but I find the "automatic transmission"-like pull on the wheels while stopped to be a little bit irritating because I like to take my foot off the brake at a light, plus I am sure this is wasting energy because you can feel it pulling on the brakes.
Click to expand...
You want the car free to roll when sitting at a light?? That's insane. If you are at the front of the line and get tapped from the rear, a car is going to smash into your left side, trapping you in the driver's seat if you are even still alive. If you are not at the front of the line and someone hits you from behind, you just became the leaf filling in a sandwich, with a bad case of double whiplash for dressing.

As for wasting energy; no, it takes no energy when you are stopped, because the inverter knows you have the brakes on.

Ray
Click to expand...


Very true. This is similar to an ICE except for a manual in which case one is expected to keep their foot on the brake. The car is designed reasonably well in this regard with the exception of not remembering the last drive "mode" one used. Having my foot firmly on the brakes at a light likely saved my life when an old lady plowed into my rear end because she did not "see me" stopped at the light. There was 60 MPH cross traffic.
 
I don't see how this request is any different than what one would experience in a manual transmission regular car, and I've never heard of any increased accident stats from them over automatics. When you are stopped at a light in a manual transmission do you keep your foot on the clutch while in gear, with your other foot on the brake? No, you put it in neutral and if you are worried about rolling you put your foot on the brake. If not, and on a flat section of road, then you take your foot off the brake and just sit there.
 
MarkBC said:
I don't see how this request is any different than what one would experience in a manual transmission regular car, and I've never heard of any increased accident stats from them over automatics. When you are stopped at a light in a manual transmission do you keep your foot on the clutch while in gear, with your other foot on the brake? No, you put it in neutral and if you are worried about rolling you put your foot on the brake. If not, and on a flat section of road, then you take your foot off the brake and just sit there.
Click to expand...
Not the way I was taught to drive. Yes, you put it in neutral and release the clutch to minimize clutch bearing wear. But you don't take your foot off the brake until after the clutch is back down, you are in 1st gear, and you have eased the clutch back out to where it just starts to slow the engine. You try to do most of that before the light turns green, though at least in the early days most signals I dealt with were a single unit with lights on four sides suspended by wires in the middle of the intersection.

Ray

P.S. The first time I ever drove an automatic was 34 years after I got my license.
 
If you keep firm pressure on the brake pedal while stopped, the "creep" is turned off. It's only when using light pressure that this "wastes" power.
 
MarkBC said:
I don't see how this request is any different than what one would experience in a manual transmission regular car, and I've never heard of any increased accident stats from them over automatics. When you are stopped at a light in a manual transmission do you keep your foot on the clutch while in gear, with your other foot on the brake? No, you put it in neutral and if you are worried about rolling you put your foot on the brake. If not, and on a flat section of road, then you take your foot off the brake and just sit there.
Click to expand...

I put it in neutral and put my foot on the brake. Always. Never heard of or seen anyone just sit there in neutral without their foot on the brake. Sounds like an accident waiting to happen.
 
planet4ever said:
MarkBC said:
I don't see how this request is any different than what one would experience in a manual transmission regular car, and I've never heard of any increased accident stats from them over automatics. When you are stopped at a light in a manual transmission do you keep your foot on the clutch while in gear, with your other foot on the brake? No, you put it in neutral and if you are worried about rolling you put your foot on the brake. If not, and on a flat section of road, then you take your foot off the brake and just sit there.
Click to expand...
Not the way I was taught to drive. Yes, you put it in neutral and release the clutch to minimize clutch bearing wear. But you don't take your foot off the brake until after the clutch is back down, you are in 1st gear, and you have eased the clutch back out to where it just starts to slow the engine. You try to do most of that before the light turns green, though at least in the early days most signals I dealt with were a single unit with lights on four sides suspended by wires in the middle of the intersection.

Ray

P.S. The first time I ever drove an automatic was 34 years after I got my license.
Click to expand...
+1. If I know I'm going to be sitting there for a while I'll put the handbrake on (with my foot guarding the brake peddle), otherwise my foot stays on the brake. While I've never owned an automatic I've driven a few, and much the same procedure is followed - either foot on the brake or parking brake on and car in 'P'.
 
MarkBC said:
I don't know about everyone else but I find the "automatic transmission"-like pull on the wheels while stopped to be a little bit irritating because I like to take my foot off the brake at a light...
Click to expand...
While you (and I) would prefer our EVs without “Creep”, it is there for the same reason the regen is on the brake pedal; Nissan legal told the engineers to put it there. My driving instructor past rejects taking your foot off the brake at a light as a reason to disable creep. And lack of a roll back brake (ala MINI E), or a hand operated parking brake also informs this choice. But I am hoping that in time these things will be preferences that can be changed. For now EV = ICE is how the lawyers designed it.
 
KeiJidosha said:
While you (and I) would prefer our EVs without “Creep”, it is there for the same reason the regen is on the brake pedal; Nissan legal told the engineers to put it there. My driving instructor past rejects taking your foot off the brake at a light as a reason to disable creep. And lack of a roll back brake (ala MINI E), or a hand operated parking brake also informs this choice. But I am hoping that in time these things will be preferences that can be changed. For now EV = ICE is how the lawyers designed it.
Click to expand...
Unfortunately I suspected the lawyers were designing that aspect of the car. Out of curiosity, does anyone know what other EV's do? And to all others who feel it their duty to tell me how to drive, thanks for the advice, but no thanks.

And what about the other legal / safety angle about sitting at a light with 60 mph cross traffic only feet in front of you..... in a car which REQUIRES you to keep your foot on the brake, otherwise it will move BY ITS OWN FREE WILL into said heavy traffic???

Also, does anyone know why they went for an electronic hand brake? Seems to add more complexity and cost to me, because it's still cable actuated, just by a motor.
 
MarkBC said:
Also, does anyone know why they went for an electronic hand brake? Seems to add more complexity and cost to me, because it's still cable actuated, just by a motor.
Click to expand...
Now, there I'm with you 100%. I'm willing to "fly" by (electric) wire, but I'd like to have an emergency stop by good old reliable mechanical cable. And while you're at it, put the pedal or pull lever or whatever to control it back on the left side of the car where it belongs.

Ray
 
planet4ever said:
MarkBC said:
Also, does anyone know why they went for an electronic hand brake? Seems to add more complexity and cost to me, because it's still cable actuated, just by a motor.
Click to expand...
Now, there I'm with you 100%. I'm willing to "fly" by (electric) wire, but I'd like to have an emergency stop by good old reliable mechanical cable. And while you're at it, put the pedal or pull lever or whatever to control it back on the left side of the car where it belongs.

Ray
Click to expand...
The problem with the latter idea being that you now need to change the install depending on which country (i.e. right or left-hand drive) the car is going to. I've got no problem with a center handbrake, but agree I'd prefer a completely manual one. OTOH, maybe that would have boosted the interior noise level.
 
GRA said:
The problem with the latter idea being that you now need to change the install depending on which country (i.e. right or left-hand drive) the car is going to. I've got no problem with a center handbrake, but agree I'd prefer a completely manual one.
Click to expand...
I guess you don't have a copilot who has pulled that lever three times in the past year, thinking she was opening the console box. (The truth is, she's getting rather forgetful.) Actually, I don't think any driving controls, including the gear shifter, should be where passengers can mess with them. The Prius position for the shifter works beautifully. I don't even have to take my hand off the steering wheel.

But we're getting off topic. Sorry.

Ray
 

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