edatoakrun
Posts: 4432
Joined: Thu Nov 11, 2010 9:33 am
Delivery Date: 15 May 2011
Leaf Number: 2184
Location: Shasta County, North California

Estonia does it faster!

Fri Feb 22, 2013 10:58 am

Any Estonians care to comment on how well it's working?

Any Americans care to comment on how our driving experience would differ if we already currently had about the same (population adjusted) access to ~5,000 DC chargers?


Estonia takes the lead in electric car infrastructure



Estonia has become the first country in the world to have a complete national network of DC fast chargers.

The tiny eastern European country contracted ABB to install around 200 DC fast charger across the state, creating in the process, the highest concentration of fast chargers anywhere in Europe.



The chargers are installed in urban areas where the population exceeds 5,000, and on major roads throughout the country. On highways, the chargers are never more than 60km apart, meaning that EV drivers can have free rein to travel anywhere in the country without fear of running out of charge.

The fast chargers are part of a wider network of some 700 charging points across the country. It might sound surprising that such a small country, with a population of around 1.3 million should take the lead in building EV infrastructure, but Estonia has long had a reputation for being an early adopter of technology, as the birthplace of Skype and having enjoyed widespread Wi-fi access for years.


CHAdeMO standard

Because the charging stations are all fast chargers, the time it takes to ‘refuel’ an electric car is cut from the regular time of around eight hours to around 30 minutes. ABB’S Terra 51 DC fast chargers comply with CHAdeMO charging standard and can be used with DC of up to 50kW as well as alternating current (AC) of to 22kW.

ABB won the contract to install the chargers in 2011 and completed the work in just six months...

http://www.thegreencarwebsite.co.uk/blo ... structure/
no condition is permanent

edatoakrun
Posts: 4432
Joined: Thu Nov 11, 2010 9:33 am
Delivery Date: 15 May 2011
Leaf Number: 2184
Location: Shasta County, North California

Re: Estonia does it faster!

Sat Feb 23, 2013 1:54 pm

More details at the link below, including details of (IMO) a potentially workable economic model:

...The government's idea was that EV charging should be fuss-free, fast and uncomplicated. The government succeeded. It's also accessible to most EVs thanks to ABB, the manufacturers of all chargers, which installed dual units. Each charger has a 50-kW Chademo port (for Japanese EVs like the Nissan LEAF) and a 22-kW AC plug (for Renault or Smart EVs). Many people talk about those new dual chargers, but they are already deployed nationwide in Estonia.

Payment is uniform across the whole network, with three schemes to choose, depending on the expecting number or charging sessions per month. The volume package is €30 ($40) for up to 150 kWh. That's not exactly cheap, but Estonia has no plan to give energy away. The charging stations network has to be economically sustainable. The service opened this week, and as of today, there are less than 500 EVs in private hands in Estonia. With only 1.3 million people, there will never be millions of EVs in this country, but it's a reasonable hope that EVs will very soon take a substantial share of the new car market...


http://www.plugincars.com/estonia-anoth ... 26505.html
no condition is permanent

Herm
Posts: 3765
Joined: Sun May 23, 2010 3:08 pm
Delivery Date: 29 Aug 2012
Location: Timbuktu, Mali

Re: Estonia does it faster!

Sat Feb 23, 2013 4:30 pm

edatoakrun wrote:Any Americans care to comment on how our driving experience would differ if we already currently had about the same (population adjusted) access to ~5,000 DC chargers?


47k miles on the Federal Highway system so that works out to a fast DC charger every 9 miles.. too inconvenient :)

edatoakrun
Posts: 4432
Joined: Thu Nov 11, 2010 9:33 am
Delivery Date: 15 May 2011
Leaf Number: 2184
Location: Shasta County, North California

Re: Estonia does it faster!

Fri Mar 08, 2013 9:35 am

More detail in this presentation on Estonia's recently completed DC infrastructure installation.

See the Use/technology grid analysis on p 10.

Very unfortunate, IMO, that the same analysis was never undertaken here, and so the USA has wasted so much time and resources on slow AC, when it is so obviously of very limited use for public charging.

http://www.chademo.com/wp/wp-content/up ... stonia.pdf
no condition is permanent

shima
Posts: 8
Joined: Tue Nov 26, 2013 10:42 am
Delivery Date: 26 Nov 2013
Location: Tallinn, Estonia

Re: Estonia does it faster!

Tue Nov 26, 2013 10:51 am

Estonia did even more.

ELMO, government organization that promotes electric cars, now offers inexpensive rental of Leafs and i-Mievs. First hour costs only 6EUR, every other goes for 3EUR/extra, until you reach 30EUR total, thats a daily rate. Imagine renting a Leaf for 30EUR/day, no strings attached?

Well as far as the infrustructure of fast charges, so far there are 160 Chardemo charges installed and working.
You can see a map here: http://elmo.ee/laadimispunktide-vorgustik/
Blue ones are chargers, green ones are those that are used right now.

I took a Leaf for a round trip of 460km for a day in the summer.
Rental Leafs are all 2011 models, so you know they won't last long on the highway. But I figured if you are doing 90km/h (common speedlimit on most Estonian roads), you can last for about 90-100km. After that you can pull over to the fast charger, and get a free (rental Leaf gets it free) charge of about 83-86% in approximately 27-33 minutes. So overall it took me longer than using a conventional car, but it was an adventure, no regrets.

Right now its even more interesting, because its getting colder, and I'd like to see the performance of Leafs during common Estonian winter, when it goes down to -20'c or worse. 2013 model has updated heating system, and Nissan rep told me today that battery heating, and new heater would solve all issues of the previous models. Lets wait and see.

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gbarry42
Posts: 887
Joined: Mon Jan 10, 2011 5:48 pm
Delivery Date: 06 May 2011
Location: Moonlight Beach

Re: Estonia does it faster!

Tue Nov 26, 2013 12:15 pm

Now I'm imagining a setup where you pull into a charge station and swap your rental for another one that's charged, significantly reducing the length of that 30 minute stop.

Beware of advice from Nissan dealers. The battery heater will take you up as far as -4C. I don't know how much that will help.
And there goes the first capacity bar! At 24,000 mi on 9/9/2013.
Second bar at 30,500 mi on 2/7/2015.

shima
Posts: 8
Joined: Tue Nov 26, 2013 10:42 am
Delivery Date: 26 Nov 2013
Location: Tallinn, Estonia

Re: Estonia does it faster!

Tue Nov 26, 2013 1:01 pm

I can't wait until it will go down to -20'C to see the performance

Rootengieneer
Posts: 1
Joined: Wed Feb 12, 2014 3:09 pm
Delivery Date: 01 May 2013
Location: Estonia

Re: Estonia does it faster!

Wed Feb 12, 2014 4:09 pm

-20C gives you 50km of range (old leaf) and fores you to wear mountain skiing clothes because 5kW of heating isn't enough. Fast charging takes about 2 times more time (~40 min) than in summer (~20 min). After adding diesel heater: its warm inside and about 20-25 km more range.

By the way: Estonian II largest city has Electric-Taxi company with 9 old Leafs and constantly growing number of new Leafs (app 5). Within a year they have done over 1 million kilometers.
Andres
---------------------------------------------
You Leaf or I-Miev needs some extra (diesel) heating? I can help!
Before telling me something about fossil fuels try to do your everyday driving in -25 C

Ogi
Posts: 53
Joined: Tue May 08, 2012 3:41 am

Re: Estonia does it faster!

Wed Feb 12, 2014 4:30 pm

Rootengieneer wrote:By the way: Estonian II largest city has Electric-Taxi company with 9 old Leafs and constantly growing number of new Leafs (app 5). Within a year they have done over 1 million kilometers.
How much per car, per year?

shima
Posts: 8
Joined: Tue Nov 26, 2013 10:42 am
Delivery Date: 26 Nov 2013
Location: Tallinn, Estonia

Re: Estonia does it faster!

Wed Feb 12, 2014 10:02 pm

Rootengieneer wrote:-20C gives you 50km of range (old leaf) and fores you to wear mountain skiing clothes because 5kW of heating isn't enough. Fast charging takes about 2 times more time (~40 min) than in summer (~20 min). After adding diesel heater: its warm inside and about 20-25 km more range.

By the way: Estonian II largest city has Electric-Taxi company with 9 old Leafs and constantly growing number of new Leafs (app 5). Within a year they have done over 1 million kilometers.

Andres

please tell us more about the diesel heater you mentioned.

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