Nissan "Out-of-Warranty" support for battery pack degradation

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I know of at least one manufacturer that does... Tesla! But I'm sure you didn't want to hear that. :lol:

Nope, not these days. Remember, we are talking outside of warranty. Good luck getting Tesla to do anything after the warranty has expired.
 
Joe6pack said:
I know of at least one manufacturer that does... Tesla! But I'm sure you didn't want to hear that. :lol:

Nope, not these days. Remember, we are talking outside of warranty. Good luck getting Tesla to do anything after the warranty has expired.
I look forward to your proof that Tesla has denied battery replacement assistance to any owner for LEAF level degradation.
 
Lol. Technically, Tesla doesn't have a degredation warranty, only a battery failure warranty. And as of right now, no Tesla besides the roadster is outside that warranty. Also, there is no easy method of identifying degradation on a Tesla as they do not provide access to the BMS. Thus, I am not likely to find anyone denied service outside of warranty.

Now, finding folks denied service for things like door handles outside of warranty is easy as you are well aware from your anti-LEAF trolling exploits on TMC.
 
Joe6pack said:
Technically, Tesla doesn't have a degredation warranty, only a battery failure warranty.
That is why I reframed your question asking for *any* complaints of battery degradation in a Tesla.
I have read (I think two) reports of battery degradation that Tesla handled without fuss. NO reports I have read of owners having to put up with LEAF level battery degradation despite cars reaching 200k miles. So your post suggesting that Tesla owners face the same issues with regards to battery degradation as LEAF owners is BS. With or without a specific degradation warranty, this is not a problem for Tesla owners while it consumes the LEAF.


Also, there is no easy method of identifying degradation on a Tesla as they do not provide access to the BMS.
I see you remain clueless
 
SageBrush said:
Joe6pack said:
I know of at least one manufacturer that does... Tesla! But I'm sure you didn't want to hear that. :lol:

Nope, not these days. Remember, we are talking outside of warranty. Good luck getting Tesla to do anything after the warranty has expired.
I look forward to your proof that Tesla has denied battery replacement assistance to any owner for LEAF level degradation.

was there not a Tesla owner who COMPLETELY bricked his pack? I heard he got something (after suing) but not sure what?
 
DaveinOlyWA said:
SageBrush said:
Joe6pack said:
Nope, not these days. Remember, we are talking outside of warranty. Good luck getting Tesla to do anything after the warranty has expired.
I look forward to your proof that Tesla has denied battery replacement assistance to any owner for LEAF level degradation.

was there not a Tesla owner who COMPLETELY bricked his pack? I heard he got something (after suing) but not sure what?
Why are you asking about a case of car abuse when the question is Tesla response to battery degradation ?
 
Talk about clueless. There are plenty of stories about Tesla refusing work outside of warranty. You're trying to create a catch 22. Tesla has no degradation warranty nor do they have a universally recognized way to measure degradation. It's that simple. Isolated cases of someone bitching and moaning until they get their way are not a corporate policy.
 
peter said:
Just got off of talking to Nissan support after opening an out of warranty battery replacement assistance case for my 2011 Leaf two weeks ago.

He says the official Nissan word is that all out of warranty battery assistance has been ended since last week. Fini.

Oh, man. :( My 2012 is on the edge, but I was counting on / hoping for some assistance if I didn't make it in time. What a bummer. You were talking to the NO GAS EV folks I assume?
 
Joe6pack said:
Talk about clueless. There are plenty of stories about Tesla refusing work outside of warranty. You're trying to create a catch 22. Tesla has no degradation warranty nor do they have a universally recognized way to measure degradation.
I have no idea what a "universally recognized" way is. If you mean goofy LEAF bars that Nissan changes their meaning on a whim, then no.

kWh meter (multiplied by a constant) shown every time a Tesla is charged, YES

Tesla does not have a battery degradation warranty, and they do not have a degradation problem.
Nissan has a warranty based on goofy bars, and a HUGE battery degradation problem in the LEAF

Are you a Nissan Employee ? Nothing else explains your ridiculous responses attempting to conflate out of warranty repairs in general with the issue of battery degradation.
 
peter said:
Just got off of talking to Nissan support after opening an out of warranty battery replacement assistance case for my 2011 Leaf two weeks ago.

He says the official Nissan word is that all out of warranty battery assistance has been ended since last week. Fini.
Anyone have an actual experience to report, either of continuing their own process toward a discounted pack exchange, or a refusal from Nissan to do so, since the single post above from yesterday morning?
 
sandeen said:
peter said:
Just got off of talking to Nissan support after opening an out of warranty battery replacement assistance case for my 2011 Leaf two weeks ago.

He says the official Nissan word is that all out of warranty battery assistance has been ended since last week. Fini.

Oh, man. :( My 2012 is on the edge, but I was counting on / hoping for some assistance if I didn't make it in time. What a bummer. You were talking to the NO GAS EV folks I assume?

Back when this program first started, I wondered why Nissan set it up as a case by case thing rather than just improve the warranty. Now we know: no obligation on their part to anybody.
 
sandeen said:
SageBrush said:
Now we know: no obligation on their part to anybody.
Well, that's how goodwill (non)-warranty assistance always works...
Fair point. I suppose it only came up because there was a hope that Nissan had reconsidered their overall miserable handling of early adopters and owners of 2011/2012 LEAFs, and @DaveInOly conjectured that this was Nissan's way of discounting the battery replacement.
 
It seems odd to cut it off cold like this. For one, it leaves a lot of 2012 owners out in the cold - many of those cars are still approaching their warranty cutoff dates. (Mine is in Feb of next year.)
If they had a budget for goodwill, and had done the assistance at closer to 50%, there would have been a lot more people helped out by the program, rather than a handful of 100%-80% concessions, with the latecomers getting zilch.
It'll be interesting to see if there are more reports about this from others who try. For me you'll probably need to wait until spring. ;)
 
Joe6pack said:
I know of at least one manufacturer that does... Tesla! But I'm sure you didn't want to hear that. :lol:

Nope, not these days. Remember, we are talking outside of warranty. Good luck getting Tesla to do anything after the warranty has expired.

I am speaking from experience with both Nissan and Tesla. And... I own some of each. I want both companies to do great. I personally have a vested interest in both. You should take into account that some of us do have a relationship with both companies. As bad as you don't want to believe it, Tesla has replaced things for free on one of my out of warranty vehicles and I suspect will do more. So far, they have treated me very well.

I have also had 2 batteries replaced in my Leafs under warranty and was treated well. My son also owns a Leaf and may/may not qualify for battery warranty. I was happy to hear that Nissan (was) helping mitigate out of warranty customers with degradation problems.

Keep in mind, I am not stuck with either one of these companies. If another company makes a better mouse trap, I will be there to test it if I truly believe they are better.
 
SageBrush said:
Joe6pack said:
Talk about clueless. There are plenty of stories about Tesla refusing work outside of warranty. You're trying to create a catch 22. Tesla has no degradation warranty nor do they have a universally recognized way to measure degradation.
I have no idea what a "universally recognized" way is. If you mean goofy LEAF bars that Nissan changes their meaning on a whim, then no.

kWh meter (multiplied by a constant) shown every time a Tesla is charged, YES.
SageBrush: I'm not sure your claim here is correct. Tesla seems to be the one that is screwing with their "rated range" meter on a whim.

In another forum I'm on, a Model S owner and a bit of a fanboy stated over a year ago:
"Yeah. They're constantly screwing around with the Algorithms they use to estimate range, so your Battery may not have degraded as much as you think, but it's showing less range because of the software update. So in other words... who knows? "

A quick few searches on "TMC": has turned up threads like these:
https://teslamotorsclub.com/tmc/threads/7-1-range-algorithm-updated.60499/
https://teslamotorsclub.com/tmc/threads/rated-range-loss-after-1-year.25976/#post-546603
https://teslamotorsclub.com/tmc/threads/rated-range-loss-after-1-year.25976/#post-547018
 
cwerdna said:
SageBrush said:
Joe6pack said:
Talk about clueless. There are plenty of stories about Tesla refusing work outside of warranty. You're trying to create a catch 22. Tesla has no degradation warranty nor do they have a universally recognized way to measure degradation.
I have no idea what a "universally recognized" way is. If you mean goofy LEAF bars that Nissan changes their meaning on a whim, then no.

kWh meter (multiplied by a constant) shown every time a Tesla is charged, YES.
SageBrush: I'm not sure your claim here is correct. Tesla seems to be the one that is screwing with their "rated range" meter on a whim.

In another forum I'm on, a Model S owner and a bit of a fanboy stated over a year ago:
"Yeah. They're constantly screwing around with the Algorithms they use to estimate range, so your Battery may not have degraded as much as you think, but it's showing less range because of the software update. So in other words... who knows? "

A quick few searches on "TMC": has turned up threads like these:
https://teslamotorsclub.com/tmc/threads/7-1-range-algorithm-updated.60499/
https://teslamotorsclub.com/tmc/threads/rated-range-loss-after-1-year.25976/#post-546603
https://teslamotorsclub.com/tmc/threads/rated-range-loss-after-1-year.25976/#post-547018

I remember the thread, pretty confusing but I think it came down to this:
"Apparently just about any update can/might/will on some cars "forget" the data/measurements for the battery pack installed in the car. When that happens, the UI shows the "default for the pack when new" until it collects current data to feed to the algorithm to get an actual estimate. I've had this happen like 4 times on my Nov2012 Sig P85, and I think once on my Dec2014 P85D."

Ongoing battery capacity estimates is a tricky business in an EV, with effects from heat, hysteresis, imperfect coulomb counting (and who knows what else) in play. We see the same in the LEAF when Ahr estimates in LeafSpy jump around after a charge or three to 100% SoC or use of a QC. The rated miles (RM) in a Tesla is simply battery capacity * a_constant, but the battery capacity calculation can have short lived errors. No conspiracy here or deception or gaming, just some difficult engineering and occasionally resets like that mentioned above. It is certainly night and day different from Nissan changing the Ahr thresholds for capacity bar loss.
 
sandeen said:
If they had a budget for goodwill, and had done the assistance at closer to 50%, there would have been a lot more people helped out by the program, rather than a handful of 100%-80% concessions, with the latecomers getting zilch.

I can definitely agree with this. While I am grateful for the assistance I have received I was prepared to pay some of the costs out of pocket since the car did go over the warranty period. Knowing how much it sucks to have reduced range, and have to monitor defroster usage in the middle of winter I would have liked to see more people get assistance. To be quite honest I wasn't expecting anything going in to it, so it was a big shock for me when they did come back and say they were going to replace the battery. I do wonder what is going to happen now with Nissan selling AESC off. I do like the car quite a lot, and would hope to be able to get a replacement battery in the future if I need it. Otherwise going to have to start looking at the only other alternative I am considering (Bolt) when the time comes.
 
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