Nissan issues software update to solve 30 kwh battery issues

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coldstorage5 said:
Hi, There seems to be a lot on Nissan Haters on this board. Surprising because this is a Nissan Leaf Board.
*SNIP*
Nissan would not offer a fix if it wasn't legit. Come On people. You think Nissan would open themselves up to a class-action lawsuit by rebooting software after their batteries weren't lasting long. Really?
I m100% confident this will show the batteries are good. Remember Only a handful have failed over the warranty time period. Do the research as I have.
After I get the Reboot I will wait the 7 years and another 91000 to see how the battery hangs in there.
All The best,
CS

I love my 2012 Leaf SL from the perspective that it's reliable as long as I'm operating within the known range. (8 bars, 55-60 miles range.) I got it for a song. $6k, used. No way I could get into a BEV without these Leafs having such terrible resale values thanks to the degrading batteries. lol.

Regarding Nissan. I also own a Nissan Versa. Transmission (CVT) started crapping out on it within 15,000 miles. Took it to the dealership 3 times over a period of time trying to get them to fix the issue. They finally replaced the CVT at 45,000 miles when it was nearly impossible to drive without being a hazard on the road due to inability to accelerate. Until that point, it was unsafe to drive only periodically. They applied a "software fix" before they replaced the transmission. A service call was issued for these nationwide. All it did was change the behavior of the transmission to make it behave more like a traditional automatic transmission and less like a CVT. Anyhow, fast forward, our transmission is acting like it did before, so failure is imminent. Hopefully I can get my standard range Tesla Model 3 before then to replace the Versa. Just do a google search for Nissan CVT failure, you'll see all sorts of class action lawsuits, typically Nissan extends the warranty to 100,000 miles as a settlement to that particular year and model but not others.

The behavior of Nissan with the Versa, plus the initial denial of problems on the 2011 and 2012 Leafs which required a class action lawsuit (just like with the CVTs on their ICE cars) is why I don't like Nissan. Back in 2010 I was rooting for Nissan and Ghosen, as I thought they were committed towards progressing BEVs with the Leaf and others, but the constant denials of problems on their part due to poor engineering, whether it's the CVTs with extreme failure rates (where it is warm) and the Leaf battery problems changed my opinion for the company for the worse. I'm unsure that Nissan could ever have me as a customer again.
 
Hi:

Any of you that did the software fix noticed any changes on the regeneration braking or changes in the fast charge speed (kind like a rapidgate issue)?
 
jfr2006 said:
Hi:

Any of you that did the software fix noticed any changes on the regeneration braking or changes in the fast charge speed (kind like a rapidgate issue)?

I would be interested to hear the answer on these questions also,
- Regen affected? Less?
- Is DCQCing slower? What Amp rate to what percent full?
 
Just over three months ago I installed Leaf-Spy on my phone. At that time, I had readings as low as AHr = 68.17, SOH = 85.77%, and Hx = 80.92 on my one year old 2017 Leaf with just under 6,7000 miles. Now three months later the readings are AHr = 75.776, SOH=95.34, and Hx = 88.54 at 8,500 miles on the odometer. I have been charging the battery to 100% more often, and have taken the car for longer drives. I am wondering if this dramatic change might be due to the so called software error. In any case, the recent values are encouraging, and are continuing to improve.

Does anyone here have any idea what is going on?
 
bmw said:
Just over three months ago I installed Leaf-Spy on my phone. At that time, I had readings as low as AHr = 68.17, SOH = 85.77%, and Hx = 80.92 on my one year old 2017 Leaf with just under 6,7000 miles. Now three months later the readings are AHr = 75.776, SOH=95.34, and Hx = 88.54 at 8,500 miles on the odometer. I have been charging the battery to 100% more often, and have taken the car for longer drives. I am wondering if this dramatic change might be due to the so called software error. In any case, the recent values are encouraging, and are continuing to improve.

Does anyone here have any idea what is going on?
The bms stats tend to go into "hibernation" during the winter may have remembered some low readings from previous.
With the warm weather , the stats go up as the battery can store/regenerate more power than when cold.
Also the car (battery) likes to be driven , just try to avoid those 10 temperature bar DCFC successive charges :(
 
jfr2006 said:
Hi:

Any of you that did the software fix noticed any changes on the regeneration braking or changes in the fast charge speed (kind like a rapidgate issue)?
I've had the fix for 5 days and haven't noticed any difference in regenerative braking. I mostly drive in B mode, but am occasionally in D mode some of the time. No quantitative comparison, just my impression.

I have only L2 charged, and that's been the same before and after.
 
bmw said:
Just over three months ago I installed Leaf-Spy on my phone. At that time, I had readings as low as AHr = 68.17, SOH = 85.77%, and Hx = 80.92 on my one year old 2017 Leaf with just under 6,7000 miles. Now three months later the readings are AHr = 75.776, SOH=95.34, and Hx = 88.54 at 8,500 miles on the odometer. I have been charging the battery to 100% more often, and have taken the car for longer drives. I am wondering if this dramatic change might be due to the so called software error. In any case, the recent values are encouraging, and are continuing to improve.

Does anyone here have any idea what is going on?

How long ago did you have the SW fix installed?

How often do you take LEAF Spy readings?

Am I to understand you drive about 600 miles a month?
 
DaveinOlyWA said:
bmw said:
Just over three months ago I installed Leaf-Spy on my phone. At that time, I had readings as low as AHr = 68.17, SOH = 85.77%, and Hx = 80.92 on my one year old 2017 Leaf with just under 6,7000 miles. Now three months later the readings are AHr = 75.776, SOH=95.34, and Hx = 88.54 at 8,500 miles on the odometer. I have been charging the battery to 100% more often, and have taken the car for longer drives. I am wondering if this dramatic change might be due to the so called software error. In any case, the recent values are encouraging, and are continuing to improve.

Does anyone here have any idea what is going on?

How long ago did you have the SW fix installed?

How often do you take LEAF Spy readings?

Am I to understand you drive about 600 miles a month?

I have not had the sw update. I was just wondering if what I am seeing is due to a software problem.

I take readings almost every time I drive. And yes, I drive about 600 miles perl month. I am just curious why I have since such a large increase in three months. By the way, I am pleased that the readings have gotten better.
 
So, had the Software update this morning. Not much to report yet. We are about 55 KM to the dealer. Arrived at the dealer with about 72 percent left after charging to 100 overnight. They did the update and then put it on the charger as I went off to the mall to kill time. Typically a full battery reads 184 to 188 KM for us. GOM is actually very acurate for our type of driving. Most speed limits here are 90 KMH and the route has some 50 and 70 KMH stretches as well as a short stretch of maybe 10 km at 100 KMH. Hilly windy route but starts and finishes at same altitude. I always drive at the speed limit and on cruise. Temp set on auto at 24 degrees.

After the update GOM read 196 KM at 99 percent. Arrive home with 75 percent and a combined GOM and trip odometer of 202 km. This is probably a little better than normal but not much. Maybe 6 or 8 KM better. So what did I notice. Well, the biggest change was that 4 bubbles of regen were available at 95 percent as opposed to 90 percent. Other than that pretty much the same.

We have a 450 km trip coming up in a few weeks that will involve a couple fast charges. I'll report in then on any changes.
 
bmw said:
DaveinOlyWA said:
bmw said:
Just over three months ago I installed Leaf-Spy on my phone. At that time, I had readings as low as AHr = 68.17, SOH = 85.77%, and Hx = 80.92 on my one year old 2017 Leaf with just under 6,7000 miles. Now three months later the readings are AHr = 75.776, SOH=95.34, and Hx = 88.54 at 8,500 miles on the odometer. I have been charging the battery to 100% more often, and have taken the car for longer drives. I am wondering if this dramatic change might be due to the so called software error. In any case, the recent values are encouraging, and are continuing to improve.

Does anyone here have any idea what is going on?

How long ago did you have the SW fix installed?

How often do you take LEAF Spy readings?

Am I to understand you drive about 600 miles a month?

I have not had the sw update. I was just wondering if what I am seeing is due to a software problem.

I take readings almost every time I drive. And yes, I drive about 600 miles perl month. I am just curious why I have since such a large increase in three months. By the way, I am pleased that the readings have gotten better.

Numbers generally improve when car is driven further between charges if period is relatively short. Why this happens is somewhat of a mystery since there is no science behind it. imho, its likely the LEAF pack simply loses track of the pack's status and regains it when the car is driven to a low SOC and recharged. This allows the BMS to do a sort of recalibration. The ideology that exercising the pack will make it stronger simply has no physical basis in reality.

The opposite is also true. Don't drive far or spend several days to drive off a single charge and the numbers start dropping. Again, no real reason why this would happen other than simply poor accounting processes by the BMS.
 
Yesterday (6/25/18) we took our 2016 30kw-hr Leaf in for the recall 'software update' (SU) and I will report some limited data below. I did not have time to drain the battery to VLBW and record the voltage on LeafSpy, nor did I do so after the SU update (though I will be doing so; see below), but perhaps the data presented below will be helpful.

Brief background:
  1. We took possession of our Leaf on 6/1/16 (so we've had just over 2 years of ownership)
  2. I started using LeafSpy on 10/31/16 when we had 2,360 miles on the odometer. We don't drive much and the car is ALWAYS in the garage otherwise and almost NEVER in the sun or in the cold very long since we don't park for long hours outside.
  3. On 10/31/16 LeafSpy reported a SOH = 89%
  4. We lost our first bar at 6,200 miles on 11/16/16. At that time, LeafSpy report SOH = 87%.
  5. We rarely use fast charging (only when taking trips of more than 70 or 80 miles, and that is perhaps a total of 30 fast charges)
  6. We ALWAYS drive in ECO mode
  7. About 80% of our charging is L1 at home and NEVER past 80% except when planning one of those (rather rare) long-ish day trips
  8. We NEVER exceed 65 mph on the highway (and usually set the cruise control at 62 mph)
  9. We have NEVER seen a dashboard battery temperature of greater than 5 bars (that is, above the 2 lower red bars) and typically in the summer months the dashboard shows 4 bars, and in the winter 2 bars.
  10. If it matters, the ambient temperature in our garage (where the car spend >95% of its time) varies from a low of about 38 degrees in the winter to a high of 95 degrees at about sunset during the hottest summer days.

Before the SU yesterday -- when the dashboard SOC read 80% and the # of bars was 11/12 as it had been since November 2017 at 6,200 miles -- LeafSpy reported the following data:
  1. SOH = 80.1%
  2. Hx = 76.79
  3. SHVolt = 388

Immediately after the SU the Dashboard read 12/12 bars (that is we 'recovered' back to 12/12 from 11/12 bars) and the following LeafSpy data was obtained
  1. SOH = 91.6%
  2. Hx = 76.79
  3. SHVolt= 378

For what it may be worth, the Nissan service representative said their battery check gave "5 stars" in each of three categories: "Frequent use of Quick Charging", "Frequent charging when batter state of charge is already high" and "Too much electric consumption while driving". He also said we had 11 of 12 bars after the SU, but that was simply wrong; we were back to 12 bars after the SU. (I suppose it is possible he recorded the # of bars before doing the SU.)

My wife then drove to an L2 charger today (6/26) and charged the car to 100%. After she turned on the car post-100% charge, the dashboard read 128 miles of range before starting to drive, but it should probably be noted that her drive to the L2 charger was largely downhill over about 2.5 miles. Also note that the AC was was turned on when she started the car, and FWIW the outside temperature was about 95deg F. My wife didn't have the ability to use LeafSpy and she drove the car 7 miles back home (with one stop for a bit of shopping), and that drive just so happened to be mostly uphill, so the dashboard reported she was getting 3.5 miles/kw-hr.

I then got in the car (with LeafSpy running). The dashboard reported an SOC = 92% and a reported range of 108 miles. From the trip LeafSpy Log_GCXXXXX file at that time:
  1. SOC = 88.3% (Dashboard read 92%)
  2. Ahr = 72.8
  3. Pack Volts = 389 (So I calculate kw-hrs as 72.8 * 389 = 28.3 kw-hrs (hope my physics is correct here)
  4. CP diff = 16mV

I then drove the car another 18 miles (thus a total of 23.5 miles after 100% charging) with the AC on (outside temp = 99deg F) and at the end of my drive the miles/kw-hr was 4.1 on the dashboard and had the following LeafSpy data:
  1. SOH = 91.7%
  2. Hx = 76.79
  3. SHVolt= 381
  4. Battery temperature = 96 degrees (outside temp = 101, pretty much usual here in the late afternoon in the summer)


Two final observations:

(1) Toward the end of my drive I noticed that the GOM estimate dropped suddenly from about 100 miles to 95 miles. At the same time, the battery temperature indicator went from 4 bars to 5. Looking at the trip log from LeafSpy, when I started my 18 mile drive the battery temperature (averaged across the 3 reported temperatures) was about 93 degF and ended at 96.8deg F.

(2) The SOC reported by LeafSpy was 4% lower than that registered on the car's dashboard, and consistently so.

I intend to abjure recharging the battery until we are down to about 10% or thereabouts so I can provide the forum group readers with an actual range (well, more or less).

I look forward to the interpretation from the group and will happily supply any additional data from LeafSpy. Just ask.
 
apzelic said:
Yesterday (6/25/18) we took our 2016 30kw-hr Leaf in for the recall 'software update' (SU) and I will report some limited data below.

I look forward to the interpretation from the group and will happily supply any additional data from LeafSpy. Just ask.
Ahr before the update, then Ahr and SOH in about two months. You have to wait for the reset effect to fade.

Too bad you missed the cell voltage histogram at VLBW for a baseline.
 
DaveinOlyWA said:
LEAF Spy registered 4% lower than the dash??

oh oh... not good.


Might you say a bit more? How ominous 4% difference in SOC (higher on the Leaf dashboard than from LeafSpy)?
 
Hi:

This is the status of my leaf on LS after i receive the VLBW:

Screenshot_20180627-231304.png


The car is from 10/2016 (although i only own it from 1/2017 at the time with 1800km)

Will be doing the update next Tuesday
 
jfr2006 said:
Hi:

This is the status of my leaf on LS after i receive the VLWB warning:
Good stuff.
I"ll post a shot from my 24 kWh LEAF at VLBW in a few days for comparison. I take it your car is pre-update ?
 
apzelic said:
DaveinOlyWA said:
LEAF Spy registered 4% lower than the dash??

oh oh... not good.


Might you say a bit more? How ominous 4% difference in SOC (higher on the Leaf dashboard than from LeafSpy)?

Dash shows usable and LEAF Spy shows real so usable is always lower. A good example (on 2018) I was at "_ _ _" on SOC meter on dash (this is another alert added that lies between VLBW and Turtle) and plugged into an AV station so the station reports what the car tells it so it listed me at 1% SOC but LEAF Spy had me at 9%.

The other thing is you say it "always" reads 4% less? Well that is not realistically possible without degradation. A full charge will read 100% on the dash but the real SOC will be like 97% or so. What you see is what I term as SOC drift where the car reading starts out higher but then loses ground to LEAF Spy which is real SOC.

IOW; the SOC meter on the car will have a 100% range but only for XX% of the true value since it won't read the top or bottom of the pack. So your 100% on the dash is in reality 90% or such.
 
QC charging 30kWh after update. It was hot out about 100°. Battery was at 99° at beginning of charge. 120° at the end. The last time I charged at this charger I started at 45kW. The charger stopped after 30 minutes. After the charger restarted I was closer to 22kW. This lasted for about 15 minutes then it started tapering again an I gave up at 2kW. Total charge time 1hr.

Is this normal? I have only QC a few times so not sure if it is due to software update.

This morning the battery temp was still 96-106°

Also driving back while trying to accelerate the motor was limited to 33kW instead of 80kW. Never seen this before either.
 
jbuntz said:
QC charging 30kWh after update. It was hot out about 100°. Battery was at 99° at beginning of charge. 120° at the end. The last time I charged at this charger I started at 45kW. The charger stopped after 30 minutes. After the charger restarted I was closer to 22kW. This lasted for about 15 minutes then it started tapering again an I gave up at 2kW. Total charge time 1hr.

Is this normal? I have only QC a few times so not sure if it is due to software update.

This morning the battery temp was still 96-106°

Also driving back while trying to accelerate the motor was limited to 33kW instead of 80kW. Never seen this before either.
Ouch.
If this is post update changes, Nissan is living up to my expectations of them.

Just be glad you do not own a 2018, which is almost certainly even more heat sensitive.
 
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