Valdemar
Posts: 2403
Joined: Tue May 10, 2011 10:32 pm
Delivery Date: 09 Sep 2011
Location: Oak Park, CA

Re: Update on Nissan LEAF Battery Replacement

Wed Jan 04, 2017 1:42 pm

Firetruck41 wrote:Let us know when you have tracked down one of those 24 kWh Leafs that has had a 30 kWh battery installed by a Nissan dealer. Yup, still skeptical. I remember a few months back someone posting about their dealer claiming they replaced 24 kWh with 30 kWh battery, but when it came down to it, the dealer was mistaken.

And preemptively, no, I am not going to do the legwork for your claims.


+1, history proved general dealer service rep claims about the Leaf are typically wrong unless they talk about an actual work order, and even then... Being confident without substance is part of their job description.
'11 SL, totaled
-1CB@33k/21mo, -2CB@53k/33mo, -3CB@68k/41mo, -4CB(41.5AHr)@79k/49mo, -5CB(38.85AHr)@87.5k/54mo
-0CB(66.14AHr)@87.5k/54mo (BBB)
59.7AHr, SOH 93%, 118k miles
9kW Solar

lorenfb
Posts: 1254
Joined: Tue Dec 17, 2013 10:53 pm
Delivery Date: 22 Nov 2013
Leaf Number: 416635
Location: SoCal

Re: Update on Nissan LEAF Battery Replacement

Wed Jan 04, 2017 2:34 pm

Stoaty wrote:
lorenfb wrote:2. Next I spoke with the lead service writer, with whom I've dealt with on the TCU upgrade. I specifically asked about both the warranty and the customer-pay replacements. He indicated, as I learned & previously stated, that both warranty batteries and customer-pay batteries have been with 30 kWh replacements at Carson Nissan.

Did he say what the price is to replace with 30 kwh battery for customer-pay replacements?


It's $5.5K to $6K for the parts and install, i.e. 5 hrs labor ($600) plus the battery & brackets.
That results in about $180/kWh for a retail price for the battery alone.

Valdemar
Posts: 2403
Joined: Tue May 10, 2011 10:32 pm
Delivery Date: 09 Sep 2011
Location: Oak Park, CA

Re: Update on Nissan LEAF Battery Replacement

Wed Jan 04, 2017 3:27 pm

lorenfb wrote:
Stoaty wrote:
lorenfb wrote:2. Next I spoke with the lead service writer, with whom I've dealt with on the TCU upgrade. I specifically asked about both the warranty and the customer-pay replacements. He indicated, as I learned & previously stated, that both warranty batteries and customer-pay batteries have been with 30 kWh replacements at Carson Nissan.

Did he say what the price is to replace with 30 kwh battery for customer-pay replacements?


It's $5.5K to $6K for the parts and install, i.e. 5 hrs labor ($600) plus the battery & brackets.
That results in about $180/kWh for a retail price for the battery alone.


Highly suspicious as this is the price people paid for a 24kWh replacement pack. Considering the 30kWh S model is more expensive than its 24kWh predecessor the cost for a 30kWh pack installed should be in the 7-8k range.
'11 SL, totaled
-1CB@33k/21mo, -2CB@53k/33mo, -3CB@68k/41mo, -4CB(41.5AHr)@79k/49mo, -5CB(38.85AHr)@87.5k/54mo
-0CB(66.14AHr)@87.5k/54mo (BBB)
59.7AHr, SOH 93%, 118k miles
9kW Solar

GRA
Posts: 7246
Joined: Mon Sep 19, 2011 1:49 pm
Location: East side of San Francisco Bay

Re: Update on Nissan LEAF Battery Replacement

Wed Jan 04, 2017 7:08 pm

lorenfb wrote:
GRA wrote:
lorenfb wrote:
For some!

We'll be more likely to believe you're correct when you can point to someone who has had a 30kWh battery installed in their 24kWh LEAF. Until then, you're the sole source claiming that it's an option at the moment.


You "seem" to do research on some topics with vigor, have you personally done any on this issue,
e.g. visit a few Nissan dealers?

Why would I? It's not going to affect me either way, and I don't care enough to check, even if I thought I could get accurate info from a dealership. But you're asking us to accept the word of a single service writer as gospel, when we know they (and the rest of the dealer personnel FTM) often don't know what they're talking about (I have experienced numerous examples of that when visiting dealers selling EVs, ICEs too of course). So, until a knowledgeable owner posts here or elsewhere convincing information (work order, part numbers, LEAFSpy data etc.) that shows they've received a 30kWh battery as a replacement for a 24kWh one, or Nissan announces that they're now doing so, it remains an unconfirmed rumor based on a single, 2nd-hand source of unknown reliability, rather than a fact.

As another poster mentioned, the price you quote for a replacement is the same as what Nissan was quoting for a 24kWh pack. Maybe the price has come down enough that they can do that, and maybe not, but we simply don't know. What we do know is that Nissan has said repeatedly in the past that they weren't going to provide an upgrade option to 30kWh. Doesn't mean it can't be done, and they could change their minds.

Whether they feel they have any incentive to do so is another matter, and based on their past behavior I doubt that would be the case, but maybe the Bolt's appearance has made it clear to them that 24kWh simply isn't enough. The fact that they've now boosted the S to 30kWh may be an indication of that, and it probably makes no sense to continue to produce two different packs so close together in capacity, especially since they're almost certain to provide a larger pack in the not too distant future. For used LEAFs they might choose to install 30kWh packs but limit them to 24 kWh usable, as Tesla did with the Model S60/75, but where's the incentive for them to improve capacity on cars which are now as much as 6 years old? Unlike Tesla, Nissan isn't solely dependent on BEV sales, but they do need to sell enough each year to avoid penalties, and upgrading older cars won't help them with that directly, even though it will win them brownie points with existing owners (goodness knows they should be doing that, but that hasn't been their philosophy to date).
Guy [I have lots of experience designing/selling off-grid AE systems, some using EVs but don't own one. Local trips are by foot, bike and/or rapid transit].

The 'best' is the enemy of 'good enough'. Copper shot, not Silver bullets.

lorenfb
Posts: 1254
Joined: Tue Dec 17, 2013 10:53 pm
Delivery Date: 22 Nov 2013
Leaf Number: 416635
Location: SoCal

Re: Update on Nissan LEAF Battery Replacement

Wed Jan 04, 2017 8:35 pm

Valdemar wrote:+1, history proved general dealer service rep claims about the Leaf are typically wrong unless they talk about an actual work order, and even then... Being confident without substance is part of their job description.


I was also in the service shop area and spoke with the lead Leaf tech who provided the initial detailed battery
replacement info and then confirmed that info with the service adviser.

I'm at least two to three years out from needing a battery replacement, so I couldn't care less about pursing this
issue further. From my standpoint, I've done enough personal research and am satisfied with my results.
If those skeptics, who may need a warranty battery or wish to purchase an upgraded battery, lack the initiative
to further pursue the issue then it's their potential loss when the need arises.

SageBrush
Posts: 1112
Joined: Sun Mar 06, 2011 2:28 am
Delivery Date: 13 Feb 2017
Location: Colorado

Re: Update on Nissan LEAF Battery Replacement

Thu Jan 05, 2017 9:44 am

So Nissan is quietly installing 30 kWh packs into 24 kWh cars but has not made a public announcement ?

NIce dream
2013 Model 'S' with QC & rear-view camera
Bought off-lease Jan 2017 from N. California with 63.9 Ahr after 22k miles
Car is now enjoying an easy life in Colorado

lorenfb
Posts: 1254
Joined: Tue Dec 17, 2013 10:53 pm
Delivery Date: 22 Nov 2013
Leaf Number: 416635
Location: SoCal

Re: Update on Nissan LEAF Battery Replacement

Thu Jan 05, 2017 11:28 am

SageBrush wrote:So Nissan is quietly installing 30 kWh packs into 24 kWh cars but has not made a public announcement ?

NIce dream


And, your basis for such a statement? Is Nissan required by any federal/state agency that it must report this?

How is it that many on this forum lack any form of rational thinking?

Firetruck41
Posts: 501
Joined: Sun Aug 09, 2015 10:36 am
Leaf Number: 408264
Location: SW Washington State

Re: Update on Nissan LEAF Battery Replacement

Thu Jan 05, 2017 11:32 am

lorenfb wrote:
SageBrush wrote:So Nissan is quietly installing 30 kWh packs into 24 kWh cars but has not made a public announcement ?

NIce dream


And, your basis for such a statement? Is Nissan required by any federal/state agency that it must report this?

How is it that many on this forum lack any form of rational thinking?

They have no requirement to notify anyone, so they must be doing it? They must be installing Tesla drivetrains in Leafs... Because they haven't told anyone. :roll: Talk about lack of rational thinking!
8/2015- New to me 12bar 2013 SV w/QC package and 37k miles

SageBrush
Posts: 1112
Joined: Sun Mar 06, 2011 2:28 am
Delivery Date: 13 Feb 2017
Location: Colorado

Re: Update on Nissan LEAF Battery Replacement

Thu Jan 05, 2017 11:48 am

lorenfb wrote:How is it that many on this forum lack any form of rational thinking?
Here is your chance to take advantage of my irrationality: Choose a wager of $250 - $500. I say that a Nissan approved, Nissan dealership installation of a 30 kWh pack into a 24 kWh LEAF has not happened as of 1/5/2017.

Another guess: you will have a line of people hoping to take you up on the same wager.

Terms:
Documentation proves your side
The wager money will be placed with a 3rd party

P.s.,
For some reason internet loud-mouths have never accepted my offers of a wager in the past, but my fingers are crossed you are the first!
2013 Model 'S' with QC & rear-view camera
Bought off-lease Jan 2017 from N. California with 63.9 Ahr after 22k miles
Car is now enjoying an easy life in Colorado

GetOffYourGas
Posts: 1609
Joined: Tue Dec 20, 2011 6:56 pm
Delivery Date: 09 Mar 2012
Location: Syracuse, NY

Re: Update on Nissan LEAF Battery Replacement

Thu Jan 05, 2017 12:06 pm

SageBrush wrote:
lorenfb wrote:How is it that many on this forum lack any form of rational thinking?
Here is your chance to take advantage of my irrationality: Choose a wager of $250 - $500. I say that a Nissan approved, Nissan dealership installation of a 30 kWh pack into a 24 kWh LEAF has not happened as of 1/5/2017.

Another guess: you will have a line of people hoping to take you up on the same wager.

Terms:
Documentation proves your side
The wager money will be placed with a 3rd party

P.s.,
For some reason internet loud-mouths have never accepted my offers of a wager in the past, but my fingers are crossed you are the first!


I'd be in on this bet, but how do you prove the negative? Unless/until you can hunt down every possible case of a 30kWh battery in a 24kWh LEAF, lorenfb can always refuse to ante-up on the premise that it has happened, you just haven't done your homework well enough!
~Brian

EV Fleet:
2011 Torqeedo Travel 1003 electric outboard on a 22' sailboat
2012 Leaf SV
2015 C-Max Energi (302A package)

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