jpadc
Posts: 269
Joined: Sat Dec 13, 2014 7:25 am
Delivery Date: 20 Dec 2014
Location: Indiana & Wisconsin

Re: 2015 Nissan LEAF Last in Resale Value

Wed Jan 13, 2016 11:38 am

dhanson865 wrote:So I don't see how you could look at the data in his sig and see the comparison he is talking about. The data isn't there. You'd have to look in another thread to see the comparison data.

TomT wrote:Yep, it is elsewhere here and you are correct... Also remember that for the first year and a half or so we had no measurement tools until Gary introduced the Gid Meter... The youngsters on here are spoiled! ;)

Finally back to this. I was only looking at his stats for ~8k miles on the new pack and an Ahrs of 61 is as good as others I see reported here at MNL with the exception of those few who drive a lot of miles/per year in temperate climates (which have better stats). I still hear that time (age) is an important factor (and at some level is must be) but Brian's LEAFs within a 2 months of mine in age has way better battery stats with 4 times the miles / charging cycles. There are other members here too mentioned recently in other threads that seem to be about the same age (mid to late 2013s) with battery Ahrs in the 63 range but again, they are driving way more miles per year than Tom or I. From what I've seen here its typical for 2013s to be in the upper 59s to lower 61s in Ahrs at this point with some doing even better but seemingly none of the 2013 owners lining up a class action law suit or likely losing 4 bars (including Tom's new one) in the time that many 2011 & 2012s did.

So Tom, what data are you using to say your new battery is no better than your old one?
2013 Leaf S /w Charge Package - Purchased new in Iowa City Dec. 2014
My previous car was a 2008 Prius Touring Package 5 - 73k Miles, 43 MPG lifetime

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TomT
Posts: 10557
Joined: Sun Aug 08, 2010 12:09 pm
Delivery Date: 01 Mar 2011
Leaf Number: 000360
Location: Foothills of Granada Hills, CA
Contact: Website

Re: 2015 Nissan LEAF Last in Resale Value

Wed Jan 13, 2016 2:28 pm

This: 68,770 miles/12 bars/262 Gids/60.04 AHr/94% SOH/89.92% Hx as of 13Jan16. Extrapolating from when I lost my first bar on the old battery, I am only slightly ahead of that timeline on the new... The car will be gone in 6 weeks so we'll never know for sure.

jpadc wrote:So Tom, what data are you using to say your new battery is no better than your old one?
59,991 miles/12 bars/289 Gids/68.54 AHr/101% SOH/101.64% Hx 7May15 w/ new Lizard (barely made the warranty).
71,770 miles/12 bars/256 Gids/59.04 AHr/88% SOH/87.92% Hx 3Mar16 at lease return.

Now driving a 2016 Volt Premier. Model 3 reserved.

golfcart
Posts: 111
Joined: Mon Jan 04, 2016 6:08 am
Delivery Date: 21 Nov 2015
Location: Virginia Beach, VA

Re: 2015 Nissan LEAF Last in Resale Value

Fri Jan 15, 2016 9:59 am

RegGuheert wrote:CleanTechnica reports the 2015 Nissan LEAF Last In Resale Value based on a study of more than 300 vehicles and over 46,000 transactions:
CleanTechnica wrote:The 2015 Nissan LEAF has the worst initial resale value of all 2015 model-year vehicles, according to a new study from the car concierge website Carlypso.com.

The new report found that the 2015 Nissan LEAF depreciates, on average, 48%, by the time of the first resale.

The Nissan LEAF was followed closely on the list by the Dodge Charger (45%), the Mercedes-Benz SL-Class (41%), the Chevrolet Camaro (39%), the Kia Cadenza (38%), the Volkswagen Beetle (37%), the Chevrolet Express (37%), the Mitsubishi Lancer (35%), the Kia Optima (35%), and the Cadillac CTS (34%).
As the article notes, that is partly due to the LEAF being the cheapest BEV to receive the largest tax credits on BEVs. But the issue of battery degradation also certainly plays a major.

Hopefully the new battery technology and warranty found in the SV and SL 2016s will greatly improve this situation.


I agree with the previous commenters that this is really not an apples to apples comparison. Resale is a concern, but it is really about your net cost vs what you can sell it for. If you want to take it further it is really about your net cost + operating costs vs what you sell it for.

My net sale price in November for a 2015 S with the charge package (after tax credit, NMAC cash, negotiations) was around $15,500. And I got 0% for 72 months to boot. If I can still get $10k for it in 3 or 4 years I think that's pretty good especially with the money I'm saving on gas and maintenance. I'd be more worried if I just bought a Dodge Charger anywhere near MSRP. LOL

But yeah, depreciation is a concern... so take that tax credit and put it towards the principal on the car if you have any concerns about resale that way you won't be underwater if you have to unload it in a pinch. We are all taking somewhat of a risk by embracing a fairly new technology...
2015 S with Charge Package

bbrowncods
Posts: 183
Joined: Fri Jun 06, 2014 8:53 pm
Delivery Date: 09 Jun 2014
Leaf Number: 339458
Location: Norfolk VA

Re: 2015 Nissan LEAF Last in Resale Value

Fri Jan 15, 2016 11:51 am

Cars are never a good investment (Karl). I answer many questions from those interested in the Leaf and I always lead off with - The best car is the one that is paid for.
If you include any discount on MSRP, incentives, and rebates, you are doing well compared to a typical ICE vehicle. The cost is a lot like the stock market, you only loose if you sell while your stock is in the tank.

I have a '89 Peugeot 405S. The car has been about worthless since 1992 when Peugeot America pulled out of the US, and I was upside down by about 8K. Yet its amortized costs over 27 years work out to be about $40 bucks a month! Great car!
Last edited by bbrowncods on Thu Jan 21, 2016 8:33 am, edited 3 times in total.
2014 Cayenne Red Leaf SL purchased 6/9/2014 (dealer received it on 6/7/2014), manufacture date 4/2014.
7/4/14 -629 miles, Temp 83, SOC 97.5, 59.81 Ahr, SOH 91%, Hx 91.44, 20.2 Kwh, Avg 4.127, High 4.136, Low 4.122, GIDS 267/92.5%.

greengate
Gold Member
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Location: Wilmette, IL

Re: 2015 Nissan LEAF Last in Resale Value

Fri Jan 15, 2016 3:51 pm

.


Yet its amortized costs over 27 years work out to be about $40 bucks a month! ]


Sounds like my marriage..Hoping to keep her for another 27 years, although the maintenance has gone up!!

booper
Posts: 41
Joined: Sat Jun 29, 2013 12:33 am
Delivery Date: 29 Jun 2013
Location: Seattle, WA

Re: 2015 Nissan LEAF Last in Resale Value

Wed Jan 20, 2016 1:43 pm

kolmstead wrote:All depends on how you do the math. In my case, out-of-pocket was $25K in 2011. I'll have to replace the battery this fall, so that's another $6.5K. The car is saving me about $933 a year in gas. If we just look at cost before the new battery, it works out to $25K - $5K (ignoring cost of electricity), or about $20K cost for a car that might bring $5-7K if I tried to sell it. The numbers are worse if I replace the battery. And I don't believe that there will be even the slightest chance that you can buy a replacement battery in ten years. Nissan seems to be having difficulties supplying replacement batteries for 2011 Leafs already.

If it fits your lifestyle, I think a used Leaf can be an incredible bargain. But I would never recommend that anyone do what I did... buy a new one. It is as bad an "investment" as a boat or motorhome.

-karl


Karl, if you drop the original price on a 2015 to around 17k (I got mine for 16.5k with FTC), it makes for a far more compelling argument to purchase. That puts the price with gas savings at 12k. Plus I value a year of use at around 2.5-3k/year (depending on trim/options) based conservatively on lease pricing (i.e. most leases now would cost more than this). After 5 years, any value the car has for re-sale is a bonus.

jpadc
Posts: 269
Joined: Sat Dec 13, 2014 7:25 am
Delivery Date: 20 Dec 2014
Location: Indiana & Wisconsin

Re: 2015 Nissan LEAF Last in Resale Value

Fri May 26, 2017 4:15 pm

Well I thought I'd revive this thread...

The other day while in Indianapolis on the east side I stopped by Ed Martin Nissan. I actually stopped to look at a used 2007 Toyota Prius that they have for sale. They are asking $6897 for it. Its nice but I really don't need it, just miss my old one still. The salesman asked me if I wanted to trade my LEAF for it. I said, no, but maybe we can talk about me buying a new LEAF and trading my current LEAF (2013 S + Charge Pkg. - 24K - 12 bars) for it. FYI: I'm eligible for one of those Electric Company $10K off deals, which I consider a good but not great deal as it makes you ineligible for any other incentives. I had the manager appraise my LEAF for the trade and he came back with $4300 which he said was "on the high side."

Now I'm sure part of that low number is just the not-so-subtle message that "we don't want your car because we can't sell your car to anyone" but, that's the reality of the value of the car at this point - to others anyway. Its worth way more than that to me and will easily meet my needs when it gets to be an 8 bar car, but its still shocking to hear.
2013 Leaf S /w Charge Package - Purchased new in Iowa City Dec. 2014
My previous car was a 2008 Prius Touring Package 5 - 73k Miles, 43 MPG lifetime

edatoakrun
Posts: 4572
Joined: Thu Nov 11, 2010 9:33 am
Delivery Date: 15 May 2011
Leaf Number: 2184
Location: Shasta County, North California

Re: 2015 Nissan LEAF Last in Resale Value

Fri May 26, 2017 4:31 pm

="jpadc"...my current LEAF (2013 S + Charge Pkg. - 24K...

I'm eligible for one of those Electric Company $10K off deals, which I consider a good but not great deal as it makes you ineligible for any other incentives. I had the manager appraise my LEAF for the trade and he came back with $4300

...shocking to hear.

So, you or anyone else in your region can buy a new "30 kWh" LEAF for what, between $10 k and $15 k after incentives ($10 k off and $7.5 k tax credit, right?) and you are shocked, SHOCKED that your four year old "24 kWh" S is only worth ~4,300 wholesale, and about $2 k more than that retail?
no condition is permanent

SageBrush
Posts: 1107
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Delivery Date: 13 Feb 2017
Location: Colorado

Re: 2015 Nissan LEAF Last in Resale Value

Fri May 26, 2017 7:20 pm

goodluckcharlie wrote:As someone who is looking to make a purchase, when I see posts like this and articles making these claims, I tend to get worried. I don't need the best resale value in the world, but I don't want "dead last" either. ;)
If the car cost you MSRP when all was said and done, be worried.
OTOH, if you paid a lot less after dealer discounts and tax incentives, no worry.

This is my polite way of saying that the article is garbage.
2013 Model 'S' with QC & rear-view camera
Bought off-lease Jan 2017 from N. California with 63.9 Ahr after 22k miles
Car is now enjoying an easy life in Colorado

silverone
Posts: 87
Joined: Sat Jan 02, 2016 4:29 pm
Delivery Date: 03 Jan 2017
Location: Eastern OH

Re: 2015 Nissan LEAF Last in Resale Value

Sat May 27, 2017 3:29 pm

edatoakrun wrote:
="jpadc"...my current LEAF (2013 S + Charge Pkg. - 24K...

I'm eligible for one of those Electric Company $10K off deals, which I consider a good but not great deal as it makes you ineligible for any other incentives. I had the manager appraise my LEAF for the trade and he came back with $4300

...shocking to hear.

So, you or anyone else in your region can buy a new "30 kWh" LEAF for what, between $10 k and $15 k after incentives ($10 k off and $7.5 k tax credit, right?) and you are shocked, SHOCKED that your four year old "24 kWh" S is only worth ~4,300 wholesale, and about $2 k more than that retail?


It is entirely regional. The Electric Company deal in my region is not available to more than half of the people I talk to every day (on state border). Also the fact that there are no state incentives and the income limitation that makes the $7500 Fed credit less valuable for some.

Based on those things, I've considered putting a for sale sign in my recently acquired 2013 SL but really don't think I'd be able to live with the equipment I'd lose for a comparable price on a 2017 S. In this area, most listings of a late 2013 are still well over $10K. The cheapest 2013 S within 100 miles of my area is still $9K.

The Leaf is still as rare as a unicorn here.
2013 SL with Premium package - build date 5/13. 12 bar car with 43,000 miles and counting... Don't expect the first bar to last to 50,000 miles!

2014 Volt - 46,000+ miles

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