boba
Posts: 82
Joined: Thu Oct 02, 2014 6:34 pm
Delivery Date: 23 Sep 2014
Leaf Number: 311002
Location: Hope Maine

Charging frequency

Sun Apr 23, 2017 5:59 am

At the first yearly checkup a couple of years ago I was told that I was charging too often and should travel more miles before doing so. My wife has an incurable case of range anxiety so we continued (trickle) charging often. The range vs. temperature plot here in Maine is the same now as in the first year, so I see no evidence of significant battery deterioration after 17000 miles and two and one half years. Comments?
2015 S purchased Sept. 2014.
Maine Weather. 13160 Miles. Morning sky blue.
Lots of complements on color. Few notice battery drive.
Leaf Spy Aug '16 SOH 100%, Hx 97%
Summer range – (70-80 F) 95-105 local, 90-100 highway

mhramr
Posts: 12
Joined: Sun Sep 20, 2015 5:51 pm
Delivery Date: 29 Nov 2014
Leaf Number: 317193
Location: Rockville, Maryland

Re: Charging frequency

Sun Apr 23, 2017 7:27 am

I am in a very similar situation to yours, so curious to see any technical responses to your post. I still haven't had the time or urge to get leaf spy working but I can tell you my wife likes to charge up any chance she gets! Even after I explain the concerns about too much charging as you stated.
2015 SV, purchased Nov 2014, shy of 14,000 miles, no apparent battery degradation, live in Mary-land.
Primarily use L2 charger (6.6) in garage. cheers
Red 2015 SV w/ QC/LED

sub3marathonman
Posts: 306
Joined: Wed Nov 03, 2010 11:57 am
Delivery Date: 31 Mar 2012
Location: Bartow, FL

Re: Charging frequency

Sun Apr 23, 2017 10:21 am

This isn't a "technical response," but it is an anecdotal response. I drove the 2011 LEAF until it had lost 7 capacity bars, a range of 26 miles to Low Battery Warning, and just under 60K miles when the battery was replaced under warranty.

What seems to be the general consensus is that high state of charge isn't the best for the battery, but high heat is much worse, but exponentially worse is high heat AND high state of charge. Living in Maine and Maryland, you're probably avoiding a good portion of the high heat degradation.

I believe the batteries in my LEAF were wrecked by the dealership in Tampa leaving it charged at 100% for the entire time they had it, as it sat out in the heat of the Florida Spring, Summer, and Autumn. I am surprised that a yearly battery report gave only four stars on something instead of five, as even at 7 capacity bars down I had everything with five stars. It shows how irrelevant the annual battery reports are. I used to charge at L1 for about a year after I got it, leaving it outside the garage where it was cooler, but I don't think there is any significant difference between L1 and L2, and even QC as long as it doesn't heat the battery to a great extent. I really only ever saw six temperature bars maximum, with occasional five temperature bars in the winter here in Florida.

As I got further and further down in range, I started keeping the LEAF at a higher state of charge, and at the end I too was charging to 100% at every opportunity, just to be able to get anywhere, and this is the key part, being able to get back home. I did feel that this was contributing to the further demise of the battery, but I don't have any scientific evidence, I think the decline remained at about the same rate.

One other small detail about charging to 100% is that the charge rate tapers down, so the inherent overhead electric consumption of the LEAF while charging becomes an added inefficiency. Add to that the regeneration is negligible at 100% SOC also, so there are a couple more reasons to live with less than 100% SOC when possible.

I now have the new battery, and I am trying to keep it down around 70% SOC maximum, and 20% SOC minimum. One of the forum members, AntronX suggested the 70%, and he is pretty knowledgeable so I'm taking his advice, and it hasn't been any inconvenience. I don't know if this will help it or not. Obviously if I have a long distance to drive I'd charge it to 100%, as others who have long commutes do. I didn't have "range anxiety" even as low as my battery got, I knew what parameters I had to live within. I did a 50 mile round trip even at 5 capacity bars down, but obviously with not much to spare. I found out too, if you're getting closer to the maximum range, slowing down really helps to extend the distance it will go. Tony Williams has provided an accurate chart for people to see on the forum, and with LeafSpy you will also have a true knowledge about the battery situation, so I would definitely advise people to get it. The program also provides a good bit of extra information, such as tire pressures too, so it can be very helpful.

DaveinOlyWA
Gold Member
Posts: 12210
Joined: Sat Apr 24, 2010 7:43 pm
Delivery Date: 10 Nov 2016
Leaf Number: 314199
Location: Olympia, WA
Contact: Website

Re: Charging frequency

Sun Apr 23, 2017 10:48 am

boba wrote:At the first yearly checkup a couple of years ago I was told that I was charging too often and should travel more miles before doing so. My wife has an incurable case of range anxiety so we continued (trickle) charging often. The range vs. temperature plot here in Maine is the same now as in the first year, so I see no evidence of significant battery deterioration after 17000 miles and two and one half years. Comments?


You did not provide near enough information to make an informed comment.

What is the farthest you have driven in a day?
How much time does your LEAF spend at full charge?

So I am guessing answer #1 is under 50 miles.

Answer #2 is "at least several hours per day, nearly every day.


Conclusion; If you are comfortable with what you are doing, to Hell with anyone else's opinion. Your driving needs are likely to be covered for several more years.
2011 SL; 44,598 miles. 2013 S; 44,840 miles.2016 S30 (build 10/2016)"low water marks" 26,100.2 miles.363GID Ahr 79.55Hx95.35%kwh28.1QCs227,L2's 237
My Blog; http://daveinolywa.blogspot.com" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

boba
Posts: 82
Joined: Thu Oct 02, 2014 6:34 pm
Delivery Date: 23 Sep 2014
Leaf Number: 311002
Location: Hope Maine

Re: Charging frequency

Thu May 18, 2017 5:36 pm

I most of the time I charge to 85%. Charging to 100% occurs maybe 3 or 4 times a year and the leaf is used within an hour or two after reaching 100%. The longest trip in one day is about 160 miles to an ev rally each September. The next longest is about 80 miles and happens 2 or 3 times a year. Most trips range between 15 and 25 miles. Today we had a low 90 degree day and a trip calculated out to be at a 113 mile range. I still don't see any measurable damage that goes with short charges at least under the stated conditions.
2015 S purchased Sept. 2014.
Maine Weather. 13160 Miles. Morning sky blue.
Lots of complements on color. Few notice battery drive.
Leaf Spy Aug '16 SOH 100%, Hx 97%
Summer range – (70-80 F) 95-105 local, 90-100 highway

GerryAZ
Gold Member
Posts: 1448
Joined: Mon Nov 22, 2010 6:47 pm
Delivery Date: 12 Jun 2011
Location: Phoenix, AZ

Re: Charging frequency

Thu May 18, 2017 8:11 pm

There is nothing in the warranty terms that could be construed to void coverage for low scores, just the requirement to have the test performed annually. Therefore, drive/charge the car as you need and don't worry about the test results. The main purpose of the report is really to collect detailed information for Nissan.
Gerry
Silver LEAF 2011 SL rear ended (totaled) by in-attentive driver 1/4/2015 at 50,422 miles
Silver LEAF 2015 SL purchased 2/7/2015

LeftieBiker
Posts: 7134
Joined: Wed May 22, 2013 3:17 am
Delivery Date: 31 May 2013
Location: Upstate New York, US

Re: Charging frequency

Thu May 18, 2017 9:26 pm

IF the OP has a 2013 Leaf, then the 80% charge is the way to go, with them charging to 100% before a trip whenever they feel the slightest need, using the timer override button. If it's a 2014 or 2015, then it's easy enough to estimate L-1 charge (5% per hour, slightly more as the battery degrades) and stop it at 80-90%.
2013 "Brilliant Silver" SV with Premium Package and no QC, and 2009 Vectrix VX-1 with 18 Leaf cells.

The most offensive, tasteless phrase in use here is "Pulled the trigger." I no longer respond to posts that use it.

hyperionmark
Posts: 118
Joined: Tue Jan 31, 2017 11:46 am
Delivery Date: 31 Jan 2017
Location: Nebraska

Re: Charging frequency

Fri May 19, 2017 7:07 am

If short frequent charges were a problem then regen during braking would be destroying the battery.

User avatar
Stanton
Forum Supporter
Posts: 1944
Joined: Thu Feb 03, 2011 10:56 am
Delivery Date: 01 Sep 2011
Leaf Number: 7458
Location: Plano, TX
Contact: Website Twitter

Re: Charging frequency

Fri May 19, 2017 8:29 am

I plug-in every night whether I need it or not (except weekends) and let the car charge to 80%; I like getting "charge stopped" messages every morning. :P
If I need more that day, I use the Nissan app to "top off".
2011 Blue Ocean SV w/floor mats & window tint
12v LiFePO4 battery & FIAMM 74100 horns
Wet Okole seat covers (front)
Tor's low-power heater mod
2013 sun visor
3G modem upgrade
L2 EVSE Upgrade
Battery Pack replaced (Rev E) @51 months and 41k miles

LincolnW
Posts: 22
Joined: Wed Mar 15, 2017 9:50 am
Delivery Date: 04 Jun 2017
Location: Portland, Oregon

Re: Charging frequency

Fri May 19, 2017 1:27 pm

I've only owned mine for a few months, but I've tried to do as much research as possible to get the best battery life I can. Mine is a 2013 so I'm able to set the charge % to 80%, which I've heard helps, and I never let it go below 20%. At least that's my goal, there have been a few times where I've dipped into the 15-18% range. From what I've read your best bet is to keep it within the 20-80% range, and avoid DC quick charging unless you absolutely need it. Other than that I can't find any data about charging every day or not. I'm curious to see if there's more data on this though.

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