SageBrush
Posts: 2685
Joined: Sun Mar 06, 2011 2:28 am
Delivery Date: 13 Feb 2017
Location: Colorado

Re: Nissan issues software update to solve 30 kwh battery issues

Sat Jul 07, 2018 2:34 pm

jfr2006 wrote:
SageBrush wrote:
jfr2006 wrote:On VLBW, Leafspy measured 1.8kWh remaining ;)

Yes, but that includes an unusable fraction.


No, it does not! I have done the experiment previously until i run out of battery. Got the turtle mode when i was with 0.4kWh measured by LeafSpy ;)

It surely includes an unusable fraction, but I am not sure how much. This post from Graffi is from 2014 and is for a 24 kWh LEAF:
On my MY2013 SL I get the following:
LBW = 49 gids
VLBW = 24 gids
Turtle = below 3 volts on the lowest cell-pair
2013 LEAF 'S' Model with QC & rear-view camera
Bought off-lease Jan 2017 from N. California
Car is now enjoying an easy life in Colorado
3/2018: 58 Ahr, 28k miles
-----
2018 Tesla Model 3 LR, Delivered 6/2018

jbuntz
Posts: 137
Joined: Thu Dec 08, 2016 5:41 am
Delivery Date: 17 Dec 2016
Leaf Number: 303765
Location: New Braunfels, TX

Re: Nissan issues software update to solve 30 kwh battery issues

Sat Jul 07, 2018 4:50 pm

SageBrush wrote:
jfr2006 wrote:
SageBrush wrote:Yes, but that includes an unusable fraction.


No, it does not! I have done the experiment previously until i run out of battery. Got the turtle mode when i was with 0.4kWh measured by LeafSpy ;)

It surely includes an unusable fraction, but I am not sure how much. This post from Graffi is from 2014 and is for a 24 kWh LEAF:
On my MY2013 SL I get the following:
LBW = 49 gids
VLBW = 24 gids
Turtle = below 3 volts on the lowest cell-pair
On the 30kWh turtle hits at about 5 gids
Mfg 11/15 Del 12/16 TX 2016 SL 30kWh,
Date Bar MI GID Ahr SOH
05/17 12 05175 324 70.75 89
08/17 11 09245 282 61.68 77
10/17 10 12000 260 57.22 71
01/18 09 15329 244 53.72 68
06/20 08 21716 230 50.41 63
06/27 11 22047 296 66.01 83 Aftr Updt

SageBrush
Posts: 2685
Joined: Sun Mar 06, 2011 2:28 am
Delivery Date: 13 Feb 2017
Location: Colorado

Re: Nissan issues software update to solve 30 kwh battery issues

Sat Jul 07, 2018 5:56 pm

jbuntz wrote:On the 30kWh turtle hits at about 5 gids

I'm not sure about that. Turtle is a result of the weakest pair, while GIDS is (I think) a pack average. So it *could* be 5 GIDS depending on the load and the pack, but that is more coincidental than anything.
2013 LEAF 'S' Model with QC & rear-view camera
Bought off-lease Jan 2017 from N. California
Car is now enjoying an easy life in Colorado
3/2018: 58 Ahr, 28k miles
-----
2018 Tesla Model 3 LR, Delivered 6/2018

Oils4AsphaultOnly
Posts: 445
Joined: Sat Oct 10, 2015 4:09 pm
Delivery Date: 20 Nov 2016
Leaf Number: 313890
Location: Arcadia, CA

Re: Nissan issues software update to solve 30 kwh battery issues

Fri Jul 13, 2018 4:25 pm

rcm4453 wrote:
DaveinOlyWA wrote:
jbuntz wrote:
I missed the cut off by a couple of weeks :(


There was no cut off. The reality is Nissan was getting degraded packs and upon testing, they were well over the 8 bars required for replacement so the people who did get new packs, got them thru a Nissan SW error. not from true degradation.



My battery has still prematurely degraded even after this update. 87% SOH on a two year old car with 28k miles is unacceptable. Lease is up in February so not really a problem for me. Had I purchased it would be a different story. By comparison a 2 year old Tesla with 28k miles would probably have only around 2% - 3% degradation. It baffles me that there are members on this forum that still defend Nissan's crappy batteries!


Because it gets the job done for the lowest possible price to drive gas-free. Including one expected battery replacement under warranty, I would be able to commute 60-miles daily for over 160,000 miles (~9-10 years) for around $20k out of pocket. I'd have to drive my model 3 for ~480,000 miles to get the same cost savings (parts of the car will need expensive replacement parts before I reach that mileage limit though).

But it does make it harder to recommend the leaf to others.
:: Model 3 LR :: acquired 9 May '18
:: Leaf S30 :: build date: Sep '16 :: purchased: Nov '16
Date - Miles / GIDs:
May '17 - 7300 mi / 363
Feb '18 - 20.5k mi / 333

jbuntz
Posts: 137
Joined: Thu Dec 08, 2016 5:41 am
Delivery Date: 17 Dec 2016
Leaf Number: 303765
Location: New Braunfels, TX

Re: Nissan issues software update to solve 30 kwh battery issues

Fri Jul 13, 2018 8:48 pm

SageBrush wrote:
jbuntz wrote:On the 30kWh turtle hits at about 5 gids

I'm not sure about that. Turtle is a result of the weakest pair, while GIDS is (I think) a pack average. So it *could* be 5 GIDS depending on the load and the pack, but that is more coincidental than anything.

Before the update turtle hit at 3.43 and after at 2.56v
Mfg 11/15 Del 12/16 TX 2016 SL 30kWh,
Date Bar MI GID Ahr SOH
05/17 12 05175 324 70.75 89
08/17 11 09245 282 61.68 77
10/17 10 12000 260 57.22 71
01/18 09 15329 244 53.72 68
06/20 08 21716 230 50.41 63
06/27 11 22047 296 66.01 83 Aftr Updt

SageBrush
Posts: 2685
Joined: Sun Mar 06, 2011 2:28 am
Delivery Date: 13 Feb 2017
Location: Colorado

Re: Nissan issues software update to solve 30 kwh battery issues

Sat Jul 14, 2018 8:08 am

jbuntz wrote:Before the update turtle hit at 3.43 and after at 2.56v

Oh...
So the update masks weak cells.

Great.
2013 LEAF 'S' Model with QC & rear-view camera
Bought off-lease Jan 2017 from N. California
Car is now enjoying an easy life in Colorado
3/2018: 58 Ahr, 28k miles
-----
2018 Tesla Model 3 LR, Delivered 6/2018

LeftieBiker
Posts: 9225
Joined: Wed May 22, 2013 3:17 am
Delivery Date: 31 May 2013
Location: Upstate New York, US

Re: Nissan issues software update to solve 30 kwh battery issues

Sat Jul 14, 2018 1:58 pm

This would appear to be an attempt to extract more range than they should from the "bottom" of the pack, in an effort to support their claim that the cars aren't really losing huge amounts of capacity. Classy.
Scarlet Ember 2018 Leaf SL W/ Pro Pilot
2009 Vectrix VX-1 W/18 Leaf modules, & 3 EZIP E-bicycles.
PLEASE don't PM me with Leaf questions. Just post in the topic that seems most appropriate.

SageBrush
Posts: 2685
Joined: Sun Mar 06, 2011 2:28 am
Delivery Date: 13 Feb 2017
Location: Colorado

Re: Nissan issues software update to solve 30 kwh battery issues

Sat Jul 14, 2018 5:17 pm

And yet I *thought* I read a post here stating that the Turtle threshold was unchanged.
I sure hope so, because lowering it would be a *really* bad move on Nissan's part.
2013 LEAF 'S' Model with QC & rear-view camera
Bought off-lease Jan 2017 from N. California
Car is now enjoying an easy life in Colorado
3/2018: 58 Ahr, 28k miles
-----
2018 Tesla Model 3 LR, Delivered 6/2018

Oils4AsphaultOnly
Posts: 445
Joined: Sat Oct 10, 2015 4:09 pm
Delivery Date: 20 Nov 2016
Leaf Number: 313890
Location: Arcadia, CA

Re: Nissan issues software update to solve 30 kwh battery issues

Sun Jul 15, 2018 7:38 am

DaveinOlyWA wrote:
jbuntz wrote:
OrientExpress wrote:
Your statement tells me that you still don't understand the root problem that this update resolves.


I was at 8 bars, 50.4 AHr, 63.41% SOH, prior to the update. Now at 11 bars, 66.1 AHr, 83.16% SOH 22k miles. The commuting range has improved from about 75-80 miles to 90 miles from 100% to turtle. I am now seeing 88-92 miles on the GOM after a full charge. LeafSpy says my total charge has increased from 17.8 kWH to 22.9 kWH.

While this is definitely an improvement, I do not feel like the software update solved the root problem of my 30 kWh battery. It seems like it has just postponed my eligibility for a replacement by a year or 2 and I will have to live with what amounts to a 24 kWh battery after I just spent the last year living with a 24 kWh and less battery.

What do you think, did this resolve my battery issues??


Your case is interesting in a few different ways;

*Your reset went immediately to 11 bars. You are the only one I know of that didnt have 12 bars for at least a short period of time

*Your fast charging speed has slowed down. Not a lot of feedback on this yet but a few have stated they saw no change while yours was throttled by a significant amount.


Let me add a second data point then. My sister-in-law's leaf had only 8-bars (bought that way), and when she started the warranty claim, they updated the firmware, and she was at 11-bars:
AHr 63.41
SOH 79.78%
Hx . 54.51%
SOC . 76.2%
37,684 miles, 79 QC's, 1467 L1/L2's

Before the update:
AHr 47.31
SOH 59.52%
Hx . 55.06%
SOC 86.4%
37,294 miles
:: Model 3 LR :: acquired 9 May '18
:: Leaf S30 :: build date: Sep '16 :: purchased: Nov '16
Date - Miles / GIDs:
May '17 - 7300 mi / 363
Feb '18 - 20.5k mi / 333

joeriv
Posts: 154
Joined: Sun Mar 24, 2013 1:33 pm
Location: Fairfield County CT

Re: Nissan issues software update to solve 30 kwh battery issues

Sun Jul 15, 2018 8:45 pm

Did the update about two weeks ago (3500 miles) with the following results:

Before - charged to 100%, took reading, then drove to dealer:

Ahrs 73.27 SOH 92.19% Hx 86.09

Reading right after update at dealer, about 80% SOC:

Ahrs 76.98 SOH 96.86% Hx 86.81

Reading today about two weeks after, 100% charge:

Ahrs 77.22 SOH 97.16% Hx 87.39

The GOM now reads about 135 miles on a full charge, back to what it read when the car was new. Dividing Ahrs by SOC% indicates a base of 79.48 Ahrs.
2017 Leaf S with QC, JUN mfg date

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