lorenfb
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Re: Leaf Spy and Leaf Spy Pro

Fri Sep 15, 2017 9:02 am

alozzy wrote:Nice work @turbo3, had a feeling you would be out in front on this ;)


There were doubts?

alozzy
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Re: Leaf Spy and Leaf Spy Pro

Fri Sep 15, 2017 5:37 pm

@lorenfb no doubts from me, see here: viewtopic.php?f=44&t=14285&start=1630#p505141
Vancouver, CA owner of a 2013 Ocean Blue SV + QC, purchased 01/2017 in WA
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LeafSpy Pro + Konnwei KW902 ELM327 BT OBDII dongle
Loving my first BEV :D

DaveinOlyWA
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Re: Leaf Spy and Leaf Spy Pro

Sun Sep 17, 2017 6:57 am

lorenfb wrote:
alozzy wrote:Nice work @turbo3, had a feeling you would be out in front on this ;)


There were doubts?


doubts were expressed by tech who received bulletin detailing failures on various models (no LEAFs) when OBD readers were used by customers. It was implied that changes would be made for data available without "special access." It was his speculation that the LEAF could be affected by the fallout of this issue. Great that 2018 seems to be OK and even better yet that Nissan North America seems to support what Jim is doing. Hope that continues.
2011 SL; 44,598 miles. 2013 S; 44,840 miles.2016 S30 (build 10/2016)"low water marks" 24,261.3 miles.363 GIDAhr 80.66Hx95.95%kwh28.1QCs205,L2's 226
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Turbo3
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Re: Leaf Spy and Leaf Spy Pro

Sun Sep 17, 2017 9:15 am

DaveinOlyWA wrote:
lorenfb wrote:
alozzy wrote:Nice work @turbo3, had a feeling you would be out in front on this ;)


There were doubts?


doubts were expressed by tech who received bulletin detailing failures on various models (no LEAFs) when OBD readers were used by customers. It was implied that changes would be made for data available without "special access." It was his speculation that the LEAF could be affected by the fallout of this issue. Great that 2018 seems to be OK and even better yet that Nissan North America seems to support what Jim is doing. Hope that continues.

If what I observed on this early 2018 Leaf are true and not limited to this one test car then they have indeed blocked OBD readers from working as there is no CAN activity on the OBDII connector for the OBD reader to read. (When using the OBD reader to monitor the CAN bus.)

My speculation is they have isolated the OBDII socket from the real CAN buses to protect the integrity of the CAN communications. This is important given the damage shorting out the CAN bus can do by plugging in a defective OBDII adapter like the Konnwei with the wrong termination resistor.

I would not say NIssan supports my activity in any way. It would be more correct to say they tolerate it.

What they have done is what I would have done to protect the CAN bus.

cwerdna
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Re: Leaf Spy and Leaf Spy Pro

Sun Oct 01, 2017 3:36 am

Turbo3 wrote:
ClarD wrote:In the http://www.electricvehiclewiki.com/Leaf_Spy_Pro it says
"calibrate the 12 volt battery voltage", but I can't find that. in my LeafSpy Pro v0.39.37
A DMM shows 12.28v while LeafSpy shows 12.88

That is old documentation. The 12 volts is now read from the Leaf directly.

It is the 12 volts as seen and measured by the VCM ECU.

Out of curiosity, how long has the displayed value been coming from the VCM ECU?

'13 blue Leaf SV w/premium package (owned)
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Turbo3
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Re: Leaf Spy and Leaf Spy Pro

Sun Oct 01, 2017 10:36 am

cwerdna wrote:
Turbo3 wrote:
ClarD wrote:In the http://www.electricvehiclewiki.com/Leaf_Spy_Pro it says
"calibrate the 12 volt battery voltage", but I can't find that. in my LeafSpy Pro v0.39.37
A DMM shows 12.28v while LeafSpy shows 12.88

That is old documentation. The 12 volts is now read from the Leaf directly.

It is the 12 volts as seen and measured by the VCM ECU.

Out of curiosity, how long has the displayed value been coming from the VCM ECU?

I would need to check my old code but I think that change was at least two years ago if not longer.

Version 0.29.17 reads from the VCM which was release in Dec 2013. Probably all versions from Play Store have it.

lorenfb
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Re: Leaf Spy and Leaf Spy Pro

Sun Oct 01, 2017 11:21 am

Turbo3 wrote:If what I observed on this early 2018 Leaf are true and not limited to this one test car then they have indeed blocked OBD readers from working as there is no CAN activity on the OBDII connector for the OBD reader to read. (When using the OBD reader to monitor the CAN bus.)


Then there is another communications port located elsewhere on the Leaf, i.e. the Nissan Consult III diagnostic tool
requires access to the Leaf's ECUs, right? If so, then that access port would require a special adapter, i.e. not the typical
OBDII one.

Turbo3 wrote:My speculation is they have isolated the OBDII socket from the real CAN buses to protect the integrity of the CAN communications. This is important given the damage shorting out the CAN bus can do by plugging in a defective OBDII adapter like the Konnwei with the wrong termination resistor.


Most vehicles' OBDII CAN lines (5V signals) are able to be shorted to ground or +12V. So the Leaf is an exception?

Turbo3
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Re: Leaf Spy and Leaf Spy Pro

Sun Oct 01, 2017 12:00 pm

lorenfb wrote:
Turbo3 wrote:If what I observed on this early 2018 Leaf are true and not limited to this one test car then they have indeed blocked OBD readers from working as there is no CAN activity on the OBDII connector for the OBD reader to read. (When using the OBD reader to monitor the CAN bus.)


Then there is another communications port located elsewhere on the Leaf, i.e. the Nissan Consult III diagnostic tool
requires access to the Leaf's ECUs, right? If so, then that access port would require a special adapter, i.e. not the typical
OBDII one.

Turbo3 wrote:My speculation is they have isolated the OBDII socket from the real CAN buses to protect the integrity of the CAN communications. This is important given the damage shorting out the CAN bus can do by plugging in a defective OBDII adapter like the Konnwei with the wrong termination resistor.


Most vehicles' OBDII CAN lines (5V signals) are able to be shorted to ground or +12V. So the Leaf is an exception?

The Consult 3+ uses the standard OBDII connector under the dash. That part has not changed. It is just that the normal communications between ECUs does not show up on that connector of the 2018 I tested. But the Consult 3+ (and therefore LeafSpy) can still communicate with the ECUs. We just can not snoop on ECU to ECU communications.

Understand I am basing all this on a sample of one but it makes sense to me. Nissan is adding emergency braking and Pro-Pilot feature and it makes sense to protect the CAN bus from external interference. The bad batch of Konnwei OBDII adapters with the wrong termination resistor that shorted out the CAN bus shows how this can happen.

Also at the 2018 Leaf introduction while I was testing LeafSpy the Nissan engineer told me they had made changes that would make things more difficult for me. This fits right in with that statement.
Last edited by Turbo3 on Sun Oct 01, 2017 12:06 pm, edited 1 time in total.

lorenfb
Posts: 1312
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Re: Leaf Spy and Leaf Spy Pro

Sun Oct 01, 2017 12:04 pm

Turbo3 wrote:
lorenfb wrote:
Turbo3 wrote:If what I observed on this early 2018 Leaf are true and not limited to this one test car then they have indeed blocked OBD readers from working as there is no CAN activity on the OBDII connector for the OBD reader to read. (When using the OBD reader to monitor the CAN bus.)


Then there is another communications port located elsewhere on the Leaf, i.e. the Nissan Consult III diagnostic tool
requires access to the Leaf's ECUs, right? If so, then that access port would require a special adapter, i.e. not the typical
OBDII one.

Turbo3 wrote:My speculation is they have isolated the OBDII socket from the real CAN buses to protect the integrity of the CAN communications. This is important given the damage shorting out the CAN bus can do by plugging in a defective OBDII adapter like the Konnwei with the wrong termination resistor.


Most vehicles' OBDII CAN lines (5V signals) are able to be shorted to ground or +12V. So the Leaf is an exception?

The Consult 3+ uses the standard OBDII connector under the dash. That part has not changed. It is just that the normal communications between ECUs does not show up on that connector of the 2018 I tested. But the Consult 3+ (and therefore LeafSpy) can still communicate with the ECUs. We just can not snoop on ECU to ECU communications.

Understand I am basing all this on a sample of one but it makes sense to me. Nissan is adding emergency braking and Pro-Pilot feature and it makes sense to protect the CAN bus from external interference. The bad batch of Konnwei OBDII adapters with the wrong termination resistor that shorted out the CAN bus shows how this can happen.


Thanks. So maybe at least LeafSpy may be able to read DTCs and reset them? If so, this will be valuable.

Turbo3
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Delivery Date: 12 May 2011
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Re: Leaf Spy and Leaf Spy Pro

Sun Oct 01, 2017 12:07 pm

lorenfb wrote:
Turbo3 wrote:
lorenfb wrote:
Then there is another communications port located elsewhere on the Leaf, i.e. the Nissan Consult III diagnostic tool
requires access to the Leaf's ECUs, right? If so, then that access port would require a special adapter, i.e. not the typical
OBDII one.



Most vehicles' OBDII CAN lines (5V signals) are able to be shorted to ground or +12V. So the Leaf is an exception?

The Consult 3+ uses the standard OBDII connector under the dash. That part has not changed. It is just that the normal communications between ECUs does not show up on that connector of the 2018 I tested. But the Consult 3+ (and therefore LeafSpy) can still communicate with the ECUs. We just can not snoop on ECU to ECU communications.

Understand I am basing all this on a sample of one but it makes sense to me. Nissan is adding emergency braking and Pro-Pilot feature and it makes sense to protect the CAN bus from external interference. The bad batch of Konnwei OBDII adapters with the wrong termination resistor that shorted out the CAN bus shows how this can happen.


Thanks. So maybe at least LeafSpy may be able to read DTCs and reset them? If so, this will be valuable.

Already tested reading and clear DTCs on a 2018. Works just fine.

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