"Cheap" 1 kW to get me going?

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cracovian

Well-known member
Joined
Jul 29, 2011
Messages
260
Location
Marietta, GA
I got a quote for a four panel Suniva+enphase setup for $4K including everything (and before fed credit.) Plug and play (supposedly) to expand which I'd like to do eventually (much cheaper since there's probably no need to use specialized installers anymore.) Is this a good idea?

If I expand this in the following years (either self or through a company), can I stack and/or rollover overlapping fed credits for those separate transactions?
 
cracovian said:
I got a quote for a four panel Suniva+enphase setup for $4K including everything (and before fed credit.) Plug and play (supposedly) to expand which I'd like to do eventually (much cheaper since there's probably no need to use specialized installers anymore.) Is this a good idea?

If I expand this in the following years (either self or through a company), can I stack and/or rollover overlapping fed credits for those separate transactions?
Click to expand...

Is that $4,000 installed? That seems like a pretty decent deal since you'd expect the price to shoot up on a small install.

Not exactly plug and play but yeah it's easy to expand. You are just installing the racking/panels and micro-inverters and then there is an Engage coupler that will allow you to splice together the old and the new Engage wiring at which point it just plugs together.

Does that price include the Envoy? That will be required to get the web reporting features.

Federal credits shouldn't be a problem.
 
Thanks so much for your response... Yes, I have space for at least 36 panels (30 degree roof section facing south) and the salesman said it wouldn't be a problem to get it down to the price of a big system (less than $4K for 1 kW) since I can bring all this extra business down the road :) He mentioned web monitoring and there's a lot of cable to run to the other side of the house, so all would be included. The panels are $300 each, so it's not like they're going to go bankrupt over this install... How much would any extra material and equipment cost them? I'm even tempted to tell them that I can pay $600 more for two more panels since they would go on the same rail and they're already installing stuff... Why not or dream on?

I just don't want to (probably can't either) pay for a large install right away since prices are coming down and my fed liability is already so low...
 
cracovian said:
Thanks so much for your response... Yes, I have space for at least 36 panels (30 degree roof section facing south) and the salesman said it wouldn't be a problem to get it down to the price of a big system (less than $4K for 1 kW) since I can bring all this extra business down the road :) He mentioned web monitoring and there's a lot of cable to run to the other side of the house, so all would be included. The panels are $300 each, so it's not like they're going to go bankrupt over this install... How much would any extra material and equipment cost them? I'm even tempted to tell them that I can pay $600 more for two more panels since they would go on the same rail and they're already installing stuff... Why not or dream on?

I just don't want to (probably can't either) pay for a large install right away since prices are coming down and my fed liability is already so low...
Click to expand...

Yeah, actually does make a lot of sense to get you hooked on a small system. I would definitely clarify on if the Envoy is included as that is $450.

$300 per panel is a dream, to give you an idea on costs:
M215s are less than $140
CSI 250 watt panels are $200
Might need a pair of additional roof mounts with L brackets which are ~$20 each.
Grounding supplies add a couple dollars
Additional clamps are a couple dollars
Additional rail length might cost $20
Engage cable is $20 per panel

Then add in profit and labor :)

I'd expect them to come back saying to add 2 more 250 watt panels will cost $2000 :) It's probably not a half bad idea to save your money and as you have tax liability install more panels. How many kilowatts do you think it would take to zero your annual consumption?
 
Great info!!!

36 panels would give me 9.180 kW and that would probably cover 90% of our annual requirements. We use ~1,500 kWh/month on average and can definitely use more if you let me though replacing a couple of pounds of missing Freon should have made us more efficient this year...

Oh, and GA Power limits residential installs to 10 kWh... But it's all good - I'd like to get started before they make solar illegal down here.
 
cracovian said:
Great info!!!

36 panels would give me 9.180 kW and that would probably cover 90% of our annual requirements. We use ~1,500 kWh/month on average and can definitely use more if you let me though replacing a couple of pounds of missing Freon should have made us more efficient this year...

Oh, and GA Power limits residential installs to 10 kWh... But it's all good - I'd like to get started before they make solar illegal down here.
Click to expand...

So you definitely want to end up filling your southern roof :) I wonder what their concern is with having over 10kw of solar on residential is. Most likely illogical reasoning.

When they make the run from the service panel to the roof make sure they size things with the future growth in mind.
 
QueenBee said:
cracovian said:
Great info!!!

36 panels would give me 9.180 kW and that would probably cover 90% of our annual requirements. We use ~1,500 kWh/month on average and can definitely use more if you let me though replacing a couple of pounds of missing Freon should have made us more efficient this year...

Oh, and GA Power limits residential installs to 10 kWh... But it's all good - I'd like to get started before they make solar illegal down here.
Click to expand...

So you definitely want to end up filling your southern roof :) I wonder what their concern is with having over 10kw of solar on residential is. Most likely illogical reasoning.

When they make the run from the service panel to the roof make sure they size things with the future growth in mind.
Click to expand...

Unofficially they limit your solar since it's a death sentence to a power company that sees no growth in demand and tries to justify triple cost overruns on a new nuke plant that nobody needs.

Officially, they limit any given area to 0.2% of solar capacity to better match customer demand for renewable energy at this point :)

Any new commercial installations (limited to 100 kW of course) have a current waiting period of 20 years to sell their energy at 17 cents/kW, so there isn't much incentive.
 
Be sure you plan the design for the entire layout for all 36 panels so that when you go to add more you don't end up putting the mounting feet or roof wire penetrations in a different location.

One issue that you may run into is that you likely will not be able to get the same panels in the future. That's not a huge deal, since they will likely be the same size, but higher power level and cheaper. Since you will only have four now, you might even be able to sell those on eBay and purchase a matched set when you expand.

Good luck and enjoy your solar!
 
If you had PG&E [Pacific Gas and Electric] , on the default residential rate plan (E-1), that 1500 kWH/mo would cost you over $400 each month. If you had SMUD (which is ~100 miles away, and where the state capital and legislators live) your monthly cost would be about $150.

PG&E makes an argument that investor owned utilities need to provide a decent return on capital to the investors. Of course, there's the koan, that government can't do anything right (certainly not efficiently).
 
When adding additional panels, have you considered the limits of your house,switch panel? Example: You have a 100 amp service panel. You're charging your Leaf at 30 amps. The house A/C is drawing 30 amps. The microwave is drawing an additional 20 amps. Your solar array is feeding an additional 30 amps. The rest of the house is drawing an additional 20 amps. You are approaching the perfect storm of feeding 130 amps through a 100 amp service, something has to give! :( I know these service panels are built to take extra amps, but be careful when adding additional solar panels. SOLUTION: replace your 100 amp service with a 200 amp service panel for the house.....Good Luck
 
srl99 said:
If you had PG&E [Pacific Gas and Electric] , on the default residential rate plan (E-1), that 1500 kWH/mo would cost you over $400 each month.
Click to expand...
Yep. that's about right for me via http://www.pge.com/myhome/myaccount/charges/" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;, if I put in the 95136 zip, answer yes for gas and no for CARE (for low income folks).
srl99 said:
If you had SMUD (which is ~100 miles away, and where the state capital and legislators live) your monthly cost would be about $150.
Click to expand...
Holy crap! Really?!?!?
srl99 said:
PG&E makes an argument that investor owned utilities need to provide a decent return on capital to the investors. Of course, there's the koan, that government can't do anything right (certainly not efficiently).
Click to expand...
Yeah, I think most PG&E customers know that PG&E is a ripoff. :(
 
SCE in the Los Angeles area will charge me $.33 per kW on the fourth TIER (charging my Leaf) but pay $.03 per kW for any excess I generate with my solar array. Next year, I will give consideration to an OFF-GRID system, with Edison as my back-up. With a solar array of 6 kW, I'am going to run my Leaf on sun shine only. The scheduled rate increases don't mean anything now.
 

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