Why are there no L3 DC charging stations in Colorado?

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Lencho

New member
Joined
Nov 5, 2013
Messages
3
New Leaf owner, 1st week. I looked up charging stations in Denver and Boulder, all L2. There are no L3 DC charging stations in CO. So the Quick Charge port is useless right now. The L2 stations only add about 3 to 4 miles of range per 30 min, not practical unless you happen to work a Walgreens or Nissan dealership or next door to one.

Why do the Nissan dealers only have L2 chargers? If they really wanted to support the Leaf owners they should have L3 chargers, for pay not free. The Nissan corp should work out a deal with one of the L3 network providers like Chargepoint, Blink or EVgo to get them installed at the dealerships. This could be a dealership revenue stream.

FYI Tesla also does not have any L3 Supercharger stations in Denver metro or Boulder. They have one in Summit Co and Glenwood, I guess they felt the need to support the Aspen to DIA commute?
 
Lencho said:
New Leaf owner, 1st week. I looked up charging stations in Denver and Boulder, all L2. There are no L3 DC charging stations in CO. So the Quick Charge port is useless right now. The L2 stations only add about 3 to 4 miles of range per 30 min, not practical unless you happen to work a Walgreens or Nissan dealership or next door to one.

Why do the Nissan dealers only have L2 chargers? If they really wanted to support the Leaf owners they should have L3 chargers, for pay not free. The Nissan corp should work out a deal with one of the L3 network providers like Chargepoint, Blink or EVgo to get them installed at the dealerships. This could be a dealership revenue stream.

FYI Tesla also does not have any L3 Supercharger stations in Denver metro or Boulder. They have one in Summit Co and Glenwood, I guess they felt the need to support the Aspen to DIA commute?

Fort Collins has the first L3 DCQC in Colorado, not counting the two Tesla stations.

http://www.plugshare.com" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
 
Be happy that you have L2 stations. Out here on the far Western Slope there aren't any public L2 stations, save for one at the dealer in Durango, which is beyond LEAF range from my home. The next nearest are at Carbondale and Aspen, which are far beyond LEAF range.

You Front Range folks are lucky: there are L2 stations everywhere!
 
Dpgcolorado; I suspect L2 stations are really not all that useful. I guess we are lucky we have L2 stations but are they only just a bit better than 110V? For me I'd rather run an extension cord with 110V to the parking lot at my job an let it charge up over 8 hours if I need the extra range. If I'm reading the specs correctly it should be at least 50% charge at 3.3kW 110V over 8 hours. With an L2 station I would need a couple of hours of hanging around a Walgreens or a Nissan dealership to get 50%, using up time I don't have. L3 stations would be much more useful.

Thanks WetEV, so there is one L3 DCQC in Colorado, donated by Nissan to the Drive Electric Northern CO program. I'll use it if I make it to Ft. Collins.

But why is L3 DCQC not the standard for dealership charging stations?
 
Lencho said:
Dpgcolorado; I suspect L2 stations are really not all that useful. I guess we are lucky we have L2 stations but are they only just a bit better than 110V? For me I'd rather run an extension cord with 110V to the parking lot at my job an let it charge up over 8 hours if I need the extra range. If I'm reading the specs correctly it should be at least 50% charge at 3.3kW 110V over 8 hours. With an L2 station I would need a couple of hours of hanging around a Walgreens or a Nissan dealership to get 50%, using up time I don't have. L3 stations would be much more useful.
While I agree that DCFC "Quick Charge" stations would be more useful for picking up a charge rapidly and are more useful for those trying to increase the range of their cars by a substantial amount, the idea that L2 is about the same as L1 and, therefore, not useful is not true.

L2 is about 3 x as fast as L1 for 3.3 kW charger cars and about 5.5 x as fast for 6.0 kW charger cars. In my case I'm going to have trouble making my long grocery shopping trips this winter due to battery degradation. Next winter I likely won't be able to do them at all without some sort of interim charging. Twenty to thirty minutes at Level 2 would be enough to make the trip possible for some years to come. An hour to an hour and a half at level 1 is considerably less convenient, although it remains a possibility.

The idea that unless one puts in 50% or more at a time then opportunity charging is not useful, is not true. One only needs to add just enough charge to make the trip home. And that might be just a little as the battery degrades and trips that were routine on a new battery become more difficult on an older one.

Since L2 public charge stations don't exist here I have to look for 240 Volt plugs and hope that I can convince those who have them — RV parks, for example — to allow me to charge at a reasonable cost. Or, perhaps, persuade an acquaintance to let me put one in at his/her house at my expense, although that is a bit awkward. The alternative, of course, is to take the ICE car for those longer trips, which would be disappointing and considerably more expensive.

Yes, I know that people like to knock L2 public charge stations as being useless. However, a few L2 public charge stations in my destination city (Montrose) might allow me to keep my LEAF battery for eight years or so with relatively little hassle since most of my trips will be well within LEAF range for many years to come.

So, it depends on what one is trying to accomplish.
 
dgpcolorado said:
Yes, I know that people like to knock L2 public charge stations as being useless. However, a few L2 public charge stations in my destination city (Montrose) might allow me to keep my LEAF battery for eight years or so with relatively little hassle since most of my trips will be well within LEAF range for many years to come.
So, it depends on what one is trying to accomplish.

The Recargo search screen shows a charge station at Montrose Nissan. Is that one close to your grocery store ?

2nd thought, are there any Walgreens stores in area ?

I agree with you L2 is very useful when compared to not making it home.
 
KJD said:
The Recargo search screen shows a charge station at Montrose Nissan. Is that one close to your grocery store ?

2nd thought, are there any Walgreens stores in area ?

I agree with you L2 is very useful when compared to not making it home.
Montrose Nissan is not LEAF certified, so no charge station (first place I checked before getting my car); I think most of the "phantom" charge stations have been erased from Plugshare.com; haven't checked Recargo in a long time. There is a Walgreens but they don't have charge stations at stores out here in the boondocks. It is a different world: in Montrose "real men drive trucks". Such cars as Prii are uncommon.

It is the usual chicken and egg scenario: why put in charge stations if there are no EVs? And why buy an EV if there are no charge stations? Truth be told, I knew perfectly well that I was on my own trying to make a LEAF work in a remote, rural, mountainous area and would never recommend the car to neighbors, since one has to be committed to make it work. I find it fun, most people can't be bothered (and I don't blame them). The LEAF is an urban/suburban commuter; it wasn't designed for 65 mile grocery shopping trips with 2300 feet of elevation change in winter!

Nevertheless, I do envy those with access to public L2 charge stations because it would make things so simple if I had a few well located ones here.
 
I'm still figuring this out. Today I had my first multi trip day, about 80 miles of errands. I had 3 short 10 mile trips in the AM just plugged it into the 15 amp L2 I have in the garage from our Volt between trips. I ran it down to about 40% by noon and by 2:30 I had 80% and completed a 50 mile round trip. You're right L2 does help a lot. tomorrow we should we get a Siemens 30 amp L2 installed in the garage with even faster charging.

You'd think supermarkets, malls and coffee shops would install L2 stations to get our business. I usually don't go to Walgreens, but now I would definitely go shop and get a charge boost. Someone should start a campaign to get the Kroegers to install chargers at their supermarkets, king Soopers, Safeway and City Markets.
 
Lencho said:
I'm still figuring this out. Today I had my first multi trip day, about 80 miles of errands. I had 3 short 10 mile trips in the AM just plugged it into the 15 amp L2 I have in the garage from our Volt between trips. I ran it down to about 40% by noon and by 2:30 I had 80% and completed a 50 mile round trip. You're right L2 does help a lot. tomorrow we should we get a Siemens 30 amp L2 installed in the garage with even faster charging.

You'd think supermarkets, malls and coffee shops would install L2 stations to get our business. I usually don't go to Walgreens, but now I would definitely go shop and get a charge boost. Someone should start a campaign to get the Kroegers to install chargers at their supermarkets, king Soopers, Safeway and City Markets.

So, welcome to the small but growing band of Colorado LEAFers.

In addition to Plugshare.com checkout Carstations.com - both have apps you can put on your smartphone.

The reasons we are slow to get L3s is twofold: First, the early rollout of L3s was concentrated in areas with high LEAF density from the earliest LEAF sales. You'd think the Denver-Boulder area would have been a natural demographic for early LEAF deployments but we didn't get the LEAF here until well into 2012. The delay was due primarily to this being a cold weather location. Second, the high elevation makes a difference in the electrical certification process - apparently this is due to different arc tolerances, and the first ChaDemo stations were not certified for above 3000 feet.

You're right (in your first post) that L2 takes a while to charge but that doesn't mean it's not useful. I've charged at different times all over the Denver-Colorado Springs metro areas - the key is to plan a trip so that you have other things to do when the car is charging. Walgreens locations are often very good this way because they are typically near shopping locations.

Sometimes the challenge with the L2 locations is reliability - some locations are frequently down (for example: First and Main shopping center in east Colorado Springs) and some are frequently occupied or blocked (example: Denver Museum of Nature and Science). It's a very good idea to have a backup plan when a trip relies on a charging station for these reasons. You'll soon learn that many stations are more reliable that others - examples include the Denver Art Museum parking garage and Larry Miller Nissan (not near anything right now except some great trails).

Walgreens is controversial on this board because they recently went from free charging to $0.49/kWh, which is quite expensive compared to home charging. Not a good idea for regular charging, but for occasional use it's still quite a convenience. I recommend getting a Semacharge card and keeping it in your LEAF just in case.
 
Lencho said:
The reasons we are slow to get L3s is twofold: First, the early rollout of L3s was concentrated in areas with high LEAF density from the earliest LEAF sales. You'd think the Denver-Boulder area would have been a natural demographic for early LEAF deployments but we didn't get the LEAF here until well into 2012. The delay was due primarily to this being a cold weather location. Second, the high elevation makes a difference in the electrical certification process - apparently this is due to different arc tolerances, and the first ChaDemo stations were not certified for above 3000 feet.

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I believe Nissan dealers are installing L3 in the Denver area? Or so I thought.
 
ampitupco said:
Lencho said:
The reasons we are slow to get L3s is twofold: First, the early rollout of L3s was concentrated in areas with high LEAF density from the earliest LEAF sales. You'd think the Denver-Boulder area would have been a natural demographic for early LEAF deployments but we didn't get the LEAF here until well into 2012. The delay was due primarily to this being a cold weather location. Second, the high elevation makes a difference in the electrical certification process - apparently this is due to different arc tolerances, and the first ChaDemo stations were not certified for above 3000 feet.

ef07a67741720afecc0fdb10e4a09e59.gif


I believe Nissan dealers are installing L3 in the Denver area? Or so I thought.

I've been doing some sleuthing, and I've gathered that we are going to be getting some in the Denver and Boulder area (and even further south as well) soon, perhaps 6-7 by the end of the year. I don't have a lot of details at the moment (I hope to have some more soon), but I do know that Tynan's in Aurora should be wrapping up the installation of a QC any day now. I hope to visit it soon. :)

Other folks besides Nissan are also installing QC's in the area: Goe3 has perhaps the largest planned deployment (another 7) that I'm aware of, but they have been pretty mum lately on their plans. Maybe they decided to back out of Denver since Nissan is supposedly stepping up with so many free chargers?

I'll let you guys know more when I find out.
 
To all Colorado LEAF owners:

Please sign my petition.

http://www.ipetitions.com/petition/install-evseelectrical-vehicle-supply-equipment" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
 
Nigel (the Leaf specialist at Boulder Nissan) just let me know that they have started installation of their level 3 charger.

PS: I highly recommend working with Nigel and Boulder Nissan - he really knows the Leaf and he is a pleasure to work with!
 
There are at least 2 DC charge stations in Colorado.

http://www.teslamotors.com/supercharger" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
 
WetEV said:
Fort Collins has the first L3 DCQC in Colorado, not counting the two Tesla stations.

NREL received one of the first level 3 chargers in the US. Just, it is not available to the public.
 
I don't count TESLA Superchargers in the fast charger equation. They are not compatible with the LEAF's ChaDeMo configuration.
 
bsoft said:
Nigel (the Leaf specialist at Boulder Nissan) just let me know that they have started installation of their level 3 charger.

PS: I highly recommend working with Nigel and Boulder Nissan - he really knows the Leaf and he is a pleasure to work with!

I totally agree, Nigel is a really nice and helpful guy. I didn't buy from them, but I wish I would have now.

I was actually there Monday and saw the pad where it is being installed (freshly poured). I was told it should be ready by the end of the year.

Super exciting!
 
Lencho said:
New Leaf owner, 1st week. I looked up charging stations in Denver and Boulder, all L2. There are no L3 DC charging stations in CO. So the Quick Charge port is useless right now. The L2 stations only add about 3 to 4 miles of range per 30 min, not practical unless you happen to work a Walgreens or Nissan dealership or next door to one.

Why do the Nissan dealers only have L2 chargers? If they really wanted to support the Leaf owners they should have L3 chargers, for pay not free. The Nissan corp should work out a deal with one of the L3 network providers like Chargepoint, Blink or EVgo to get them installed at the dealerships. This could be a dealership revenue stream.

FYI Tesla also does not have any L3 Supercharger stations in Denver metro or Boulder. They have one in Summit Co and Glenwood, I guess they felt the need to support the Aspen to DIA commute?

they need the L2's to charge their dealer stock. lately Nissan has had a flurry of installs in Western WA and it would appear its semi based on sales volume. This area ranks anywhere from #1 to 3 generally in sales and most of the higher volume dealers have had one installed, about 4 VERY recently

So, guessing your dealers are not selling enough maybe? either way, i posted in another thread that Nissan did ZERO publicity on these recent installs so you might want to take another survey of dealers in the area
 
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