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Marktm
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Posts: 359
Joined: Thu Jan 21, 2016 10:49 am
Delivery Date: 09 Jan 2016
Leaf Number: 022737

Re: LEAF 2 : What we know so far (2018 or later?)

Thu Aug 10, 2017 5:55 pm

The dealer in Sugar Land TX (Houston) is one of the largest in the area. They had 10 on the lot that they said were all sold (OK - it was a car salesman!) This is without any significant incentives (except the tax credit). Went on a 250 mile + trip in one last weekend - drove it myself for over 100 miles with several miles on rough gravel road. It is a great vehicle to drive - with fully loaded four people.

A number of people have recently started to ask me (out of the "blue") about my Leaf and that they really want an EV, but worried so much about "how far can I go?" Seems the Bolt is answering that question.
2012 Leaf SL; 36,000 miles. Battery replaced November 1st, 2016.
Rural cabin with 6750 watts Grid tied PV. Off-grid solar Leaf charging capable (level II).

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DNAinaGoodWay
Posts: 2756
Joined: Mon Dec 17, 2012 1:43 am
Delivery Date: 03 Dec 2012
Leaf Number: 23156
Location: Central Massachusetts

Re: LEAF 2 : What we know so far (2018 or later?)

Thu Aug 10, 2017 7:35 pm

"How far can I go?" is always the first question. When they hear "84 EPA" a little switch flips in their heads and they loose interest. 238 sounds a bit better. 160 just seems disappointing.
'12 SL last reading @ 2 yr, 22k, 260 GIDs, 62.35 Ahr

'15 SV w/QC, Mfd 5/14, Leased 8/14, 292 GIDs, 64.38 Ahr when new
@ 36 months, 34k, 270 GID, 57.49 Ahr

'17 Bolt LT



6.72 kW Array

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LTLFTcomposite
Posts: 4351
Joined: Fri Apr 23, 2010 6:06 pm
Delivery Date: 10 Dec 2011
Leaf Number: 5926
Location: Boca Raton FL

Re: LEAF 2 : What we know so far (2018 or later?)

Thu Aug 10, 2017 7:46 pm

DNAinaGoodWay wrote:"How far can I go?" is always the first question. When they hear "84 EPA" a little switch flips in their heads and they loose interest. 238 sounds a bit better. 160 just seems disappointing.

+1

At 238 a few more people start to think hmmm maybe this would work for me and ask how hard is it to find charging stations and how long will it take to recharge. Then they take a look at the size of the car and how not cool it is for the price tag and move on.
LTL
White 2012 SV delivered 10 Dec 2011 returned 25 Nov 2014 replaced with stopgap ICE Sentra
[35 months] [35K miles] [9 Bars]
2013 Volt replaced after 36 months/30k miles with ICE Rogue

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OrientExpress
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Posts: 1064
Joined: Sun Aug 08, 2010 12:22 pm
Delivery Date: 10 May 2011
Leaf Number: 2331
Location: San Jose, Ca

Re: LEAF 2 : What we know so far (2018 or later?)

Thu Aug 10, 2017 7:50 pm

DNAinaGoodWay wrote:"How far can I go?" is always the first question. When they hear "84 EPA" a little switch flips in their heads and they loose interest. 238 sounds a bit better. 160 just seems disappointing.


$43K sounds disappointing, $29k sounds interesting. $18K flips a switch in their heads and they say "tell me more."

"How far can I go" is best answered "how far do you need to go each day?"
2014 LEAF SV
Ocean Blue
Delivery May 23 2014
46,000+ miles - all 12 bars - Same range as new - No warranty issues ever!

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LTLFTcomposite
Posts: 4351
Joined: Fri Apr 23, 2010 6:06 pm
Delivery Date: 10 Dec 2011
Leaf Number: 5926
Location: Boca Raton FL

Re: LEAF 2 : What we know so far (2018 or later?)

Thu Aug 10, 2017 8:53 pm

OrientExpress wrote:"How far can I go" is best answered "how far do you need to go each day?"

IMO trying to redefine the customer's wants and needs around the reduced capabilities compared to what they are accustomed to is a recipe for prolonging slow adoption rates.
How far do I need to go? Work is six miles round trip. Most amenities in the area are within ten miles; some are further. But anything in Miami (port, airport, south beach, etc) is 100 miles round trip. Key West is probably 400, Tampa is 500, Orlando is 400. I don't go to those places every day, but I "need" to go fairly regularly.
Rationalize all you want, but the customer gets to decide, and limited range isn't resonating with Joe Motorist.
LTL
White 2012 SV delivered 10 Dec 2011 returned 25 Nov 2014 replaced with stopgap ICE Sentra
[35 months] [35K miles] [9 Bars]
2013 Volt replaced after 36 months/30k miles with ICE Rogue

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OrientExpress
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Delivery Date: 10 May 2011
Leaf Number: 2331
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Re: LEAF 2 : What we know so far (2018 or later?)

Thu Aug 10, 2017 9:15 pm

Don't confuse helping someone define their needs better vs rationalizing a solution.

To follow your example, ocassional 400 mile trips appear to rank higher than the rest of your driving needs, so in that case you would be best served by a conventional automobile.
2014 LEAF SV
Ocean Blue
Delivery May 23 2014
46,000+ miles - all 12 bars - Same range as new - No warranty issues ever!

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DNAinaGoodWay
Posts: 2756
Joined: Mon Dec 17, 2012 1:43 am
Delivery Date: 03 Dec 2012
Leaf Number: 23156
Location: Central Massachusetts

Re: LEAF 2 : What we know so far (2018 or later?)

Thu Aug 10, 2017 10:50 pm

And most people in the states will continue to buy conventional vehicles. EVs don't interest them at all, even a cheaper shorter range EV. How far they drive each day on average is a thought they never have and refuse to entertain.

For the US minority that want an EV, if they have the means, they'll get a 3. If that's a stretch, they'll go with their perceived best value, given the limited selection outside the PRoC. Most of us lease, so MSRPs don't matter, just total lease cost. If the limited choice becomes a 238 car for less than a 160 car, that's one less 160 car order. Unless Nissan pulls a rabbit out of its hat, that's what I expect next month.

I don't think Nissan will start discounting right off. Should take a week or two anyway. Then they'll be able to offer lower lease rates and if the deals are low enough, sales should pick up.
'12 SL last reading @ 2 yr, 22k, 260 GIDs, 62.35 Ahr

'15 SV w/QC, Mfd 5/14, Leased 8/14, 292 GIDs, 64.38 Ahr when new
@ 36 months, 34k, 270 GID, 57.49 Ahr

'17 Bolt LT



6.72 kW Array

User avatar
DNAinaGoodWay
Posts: 2756
Joined: Mon Dec 17, 2012 1:43 am
Delivery Date: 03 Dec 2012
Leaf Number: 23156
Location: Central Massachusetts

Re: LEAF 2 : What we know so far (2018 or later?)

Fri Aug 11, 2017 6:52 am

For example: I can lease a Bolt LT with QC and both packages based off of $32k. For about the same money, I could lease a Leaf S (if it were available and the leak numbers are correct) with QC and the winter package, or a SV without that package. That makes the Bolt the better value and I can get one today. It could be 6 months before the Leaf is delivered, and I'm off warranty and it'd be another winter with an 80 mile car when I could have triple the range for the same lease payment I have now. If the disappointing leaked info is right, maybe Nissan has done me a favor and forced my hand. No matter how low Nissan can discount this car for, it will still be only 40 kWh, and so, a second class EV.

A pity too, Nissan could have several EV models for sale here by now, and gigafactories, and supercharger networks. Instead, they're too little, too late.
'12 SL last reading @ 2 yr, 22k, 260 GIDs, 62.35 Ahr

'15 SV w/QC, Mfd 5/14, Leased 8/14, 292 GIDs, 64.38 Ahr when new
@ 36 months, 34k, 270 GID, 57.49 Ahr

'17 Bolt LT



6.72 kW Array

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jhm614
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Posts: 910
Joined: Fri Apr 23, 2010 7:48 pm
Delivery Date: 30 Mar 2011
Leaf Number: 000493
Location: Arlington, TX

Re: LEAF 2 : What we know so far (2018 or later?)

Fri Aug 11, 2017 8:05 am

DNAinaGoodWay wrote:For example: I can lease a Bolt LT with QC and both packages based off of $32k. For about the same money, I could lease a Leaf S (if it were available and the leak numbers are correct) with QC and the winter package, or a SV without that package. That makes the Bolt the better value and I can get one today. It could be 6 months before the Leaf is delivered, and I'm off warranty and it'd be another winter with an 80 mile car when I could have triple the range for the same lease payment I have now. If the disappointing leaked info is right, maybe Nissan has done me a favor and forced my hand. No matter how low Nissan can discount this car for, it will still be only 40 kWh, and so, a second class EV.

A pity too, Nissan could have several EV models for sale here by now, and gigafactories, and supercharger networks. Instead, they're too little, too late.

That's a good deal on the Bolt! In TX, the same car would run just over 38k. Is that all Chevy discounts or are state and federal discounts included?
And isn't it about time for another Nissan tease?!? I need my official 2.0 fix :)
2011 Brilliant Silver SL - 110,000 gasoline free miles so far.
4BL: 06/29/13 @ 27 months, 43,520 miles, 42.56 Ahr. New 12 bar battery: 09/09/13
4BLx2:12/31/16 @ 69 months, 99,475 miles, 42.99 Ahr.

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DNAinaGoodWay
Posts: 2756
Joined: Mon Dec 17, 2012 1:43 am
Delivery Date: 03 Dec 2012
Leaf Number: 23156
Location: Central Massachusetts

Re: LEAF 2 : What we know so far (2018 or later?)

Fri Aug 11, 2017 8:44 am

Just Chevy discounts. Lots of variation across the states.
'12 SL last reading @ 2 yr, 22k, 260 GIDs, 62.35 Ahr

'15 SV w/QC, Mfd 5/14, Leased 8/14, 292 GIDs, 64.38 Ahr when new
@ 36 months, 34k, 270 GID, 57.49 Ahr

'17 Bolt LT



6.72 kW Array

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